January Transfer Window Discussion - Rumours and Links welcome
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Re: January Transfer Window Discussion - Rumours and Links welcome
The new owners can't buy new players because they have no money.
They have secured loans against the club's assets not their own.
They have secured loans against the club's assets not their own.
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Re: January Transfer Window Discussion - Rumours and Links welcome
No, apparently we’re too highly leveraged.
This user liked this post: Vegas Claret
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Re: January Transfer Window Discussion - Rumours and Links welcome
Why is this thread still going?
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Re: January Transfer Window Discussion - Rumours and Links welcome
Can we just delete this thread Mods its depressing
Re: January Transfer Window Discussion - Rumours and Links welcome
Garlick was a master in peakaboo BS, bid £7M for Deeney, the week later Sordell signs. £20M bid for Kalvin Phillips, the next week we are broke. Garlick pulled off an absolute blinder hereMACCA wrote: ↑Tue Feb 02, 2021 11:08 amWould you expect to get a house for 75k when it's up for sale at 100k?
Its always looks good to be seen to be doing the right things, even if you know it's not a chance if happening, the old board were masters of the disguise
Remember us "bidding 20m" for a player yet moths later we had no money.
Bidding is the easy bit.
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Re: January Transfer Window Discussion - Rumours and Links welcome
" We were not close to anything " SD when asked about transfers in todays press conference
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Re: January Transfer Window Discussion - Rumours and Links welcome
Poor but hardly surprising by insulting Stoke with a joke of an offer for Collinsrandomclaret2 wrote: ↑Tue Feb 02, 2021 1:30 pm" We were not close to anything " SD when asked about transfers in todays press conference
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Re: January Transfer Window Discussion - Rumours and Links welcome
Love SD-says it as it is. Never makes pledges that cant be met. Not only is he the one guy, along with his coaches that constantly deliver, with his arms tied behind his back, communicates and is prepared to let fans know what is happening. Sadly for me the only one in the entire organisation who I trustrandomclaret2 wrote: ↑Tue Feb 02, 2021 1:30 pm" We were not close to anything " SD when asked about transfers in todays press conference
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Re: January Transfer Window Discussion - Rumours and Links welcome
DomBFC1882 wrote: ↑Tue Feb 02, 2021 1:33 pmPoor but hardly surprising by insulting Stoke with a joke of an offer for Collins
Why do you feel an offer is insulting or a joke ?
An offer is made and can be accepted or turned down, don't be so precious about things.
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Re: January Transfer Window Discussion - Rumours and Links welcome
Time to move in and concentrate on how we're going to get those
4 wins (and a few draws) to ensure we stay up.
4 wins (and a few draws) to ensure we stay up.
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Re: January Transfer Window Discussion - Rumours and Links welcome
Just no excuse for it. Looking forward to hearing how the Pace, Hart and Garlick try to spin this cluster****.randomclaret2 wrote: ↑Tue Feb 02, 2021 1:30 pm" We were not close to anything " SD when asked about transfers in todays press conference
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Re: January Transfer Window Discussion - Rumours and Links welcome
Okay mate, I'll give you a 5r for your house, deal?claretonthecoast1882 wrote: ↑Tue Feb 02, 2021 2:23 pmWhy do you feel an offer is insulting or a joke ?
An offer is made and can be accepted or turned down, don't be so precious about things.
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Re: January Transfer Window Discussion - Rumours and Links welcome
Providing you keep the Mrs with the house ?
Re: January Transfer Window Discussion - Rumours and Links welcome
We’ll be much more able to add to the squad in summer;
We’ll spend in January;
We’ll be much more able to add to the squad in summer;
We-
We’ll spend in January;
We’ll be much more able to add to the squad in summer;
We-
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Re: January Transfer Window Discussion - Rumours and Links welcome
It's worth mentioning though mate, if someone came in an offered 5 million for mcneil I'd also feel insulted or it being a "joke" offer. Surely you would also
Re: January Transfer Window Discussion - Rumours and Links welcome
Another window boarded up.
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Re: January Transfer Window Discussion - Rumours and Links welcome
DomBFC1882 wrote: ↑Tue Feb 02, 2021 2:44 pmIt's worth mentioning though mate, if someone came in an offered 5 million for mcneil I'd also feel insulted or it being a "joke" offer. Surely you would also
Wouldn't feel insulted over something I have no control over. I know it wouldn't be accepted but I wouldn't feel anything about the offer.
It works both ways, should we have taken the offer of over 1million for Wayne Thomas or should we have said he is worth nearer the 100k mark so lower your bid.
Should Bournemouth feel insulted that the only bid they could get for King yesterday was 6m from 2 clubs when they turned down 13m in the summer for him from West Ham ?
It is football and it is what clubs do.
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Re: January Transfer Window Discussion - Rumours and Links welcome
Well I think most people in football describe offers as "derisory" "insulting" etc. You hear it on the tele all the time from punditsclaretonthecoast1882 wrote: ↑Tue Feb 02, 2021 2:53 pmWouldn't feel insulted over something I have no control over. I know it wouldn't be accepted but I wouldn't feel anything about the offer.
It works both ways, should we have taken the offer of over 1million for Wayne Thomas or should we have said he is worth nearer the 100k mark so lower your bid.
Should Bournemouth feel insulted that the only bid they could get for King yesterday was 6m from 2 clubs when they turned down 13m in the summer for him from West Ham ?
It is football and it is what clubs do.
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Re: January Transfer Window Discussion - Rumours and Links welcome
The Bournemouth comparison is silly given he was 6 months further into his contract.claretonthecoast1882 wrote: ↑Tue Feb 02, 2021 2:53 pmWouldn't feel insulted over something I have no control over. I know it wouldn't be accepted but I wouldn't feel anything about the offer.
It works both ways, should we have taken the offer of over 1million for Wayne Thomas or should we have said he is worth nearer the 100k mark so lower your bid.
Should Bournemouth feel insulted that the only bid they could get for King yesterday was 6m from 2 clubs when they turned down 13m in the summer for him from West Ham ?
It is football and it is what clubs do.
Nathan Collins has years left on his and is only young with massive sell on potential if he improves at the rate Dyche has improved our other defenders
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Re: January Transfer Window Discussion - Rumours and Links welcome
The Bournemouth comparison isn't silly, it is exactly the same as people comparing someone who has gone for a high amount then using that to say that is the guideline for our fees.DomBFC1882 wrote: ↑Tue Feb 02, 2021 3:08 pmThe Bournemouth comparison is silly given he was 6 months further into his contract.
Nathan Collins has years left on his and is only young with massive sell on potential if he improves at the rate Dyche has improved our other defenders
Taking into account though what you are saying
Matt Doherty, plays 38 games 36 games in 2 season in the Prem with Wolves being a first choice pick, scores 4 league goals in each season, reached the quarter finals of the Europa League, has 16 full international caps as oppose to under 21 caps, had 3 years left on his contract and was sold to a top 6 rival for 15m.
Do you think someone who may turn out to be decent should go for that kind of money upfront ?
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Re: January Transfer Window Discussion - Rumours and Links welcome
That's nonsense. The Bournemouth comparison is stupid as every player will go for less when they're nearing the end of their contract. What you've said has absolutely nothing to do with a player nearing the end of his contract.claretonthecoast1882 wrote: ↑Tue Feb 02, 2021 3:20 pmThe Bournemouth comparison isn't silly, it is exactly the same as people comparing someone who has gone for a high amount then using that to say that is the guideline for our fees.
Taking into account though what you are saying
Matt Doherty, plays 38 games 36 games in 2 season in the Prem with Wolves being a first choice pick, scores 4 league goals in each season, reached the quarter finals of the Europa League, has 16 full international caps as oppose to under 21 caps, had 3 years left on his contract and was sold to a top 6 rival for 15m.
Do you think someone who may turn out to be decent should go for that kind of money upfront ?
Also who said anything about upfront? We clearly haven't bid anywhere near respectable as an overall bid. Whether that be 7 million up front and 3 million in add ons.
Not sure what Matt Doherty has to do with anything either. That was Wolves perogative to accept that and the player may have played a part in forcing the move. If Spurs had an idea it would take 15-20 million say, then its good business.
We were told Collins was worth way more yet we got nowhere near. That's the massive difference in the 2 scenarios.
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Re: January Transfer Window Discussion - Rumours and Links welcome
Yup, not insulted by it, thought of it as a joke or called it derisory.
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Re: January Transfer Window Discussion - Rumours and Links welcome
They obviously didn't see it as any of the things you just mentioned otherwise they wouldn't have accepted it.claretonthecoast1882 wrote: ↑Tue Feb 02, 2021 3:50 pmYup, not insulted by it, thought of it as a joke or called it derisory.
Honestly
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Re: January Transfer Window Discussion - Rumours and Links welcome
DomBFC1882 wrote: ↑Tue Feb 02, 2021 3:52 pmThey obviously didn't see it as any of the things you just mentioned otherwise they wouldn't have accepted it.
Honestly
Someone who has cried for the last week or so on every thread regarding no signings and liked as many posts as possible being negative towards the club because you didn't get what you wanted isn't really in a position to attempt to be clever.
Hopefully the next window is better for you as this seems far more important that actual results on the pitch
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Re: January Transfer Window Discussion - Rumours and Links welcome
I think you'll find I've as much right as you pal.claretonthecoast1882 wrote: ↑Tue Feb 02, 2021 3:56 pmSomeone who has cried for the last week or so on every thread regarding no signings and liked as many posts as possible being negative towards the club because you didn't get what you wanted isn't really in a position to attempt to be clever.
Hopefully the next window is better for you as this seems far more important that actual results on the pitch
Take your high horse on a nice long journey
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Re: January Transfer Window Discussion - Rumours and Links welcome
DomBFC1882 wrote: ↑Tue Feb 02, 2021 4:02 pmI think you'll find I've as much right as you pal.
Take your high horse on a nice long journey
Its been emotional .... well for you anyway
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Re: January Transfer Window Discussion - Rumours and Links welcome
Ps. Results on the pitch are a result of transfer windows if you didn't know and unlike you I prefer to look at the bigger picture without clutching at the past few resultsclaretonthecoast1882 wrote: ↑Tue Feb 02, 2021 3:56 pmSomeone who has cried for the last week or so on every thread regarding no signings and liked as many posts as possible being negative towards the club because you didn't get what you wanted isn't really in a position to attempt to be clever.
Hopefully the next window is better for you as this seems far more important that actual results on the pitch
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Re: January Transfer Window Discussion - Rumours and Links welcome
Far from it. You seem bothered hence you leaving after I shut down your point as nonsense.
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Re: January Transfer Window Discussion - Rumours and Links welcome
DomBFC1882 wrote: ↑Tue Feb 02, 2021 4:04 pmPs. Results on the pitch are a result of transfer windows if you didn't know and unlike you I prefer to look at the bigger picture without clutching at the past few results
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Re: January Transfer Window Discussion - Rumours and Links welcome
I understand how a bid can be an insulting but on a one off basis it really shouldn't be a big deal because you can always increase it.
When you buy a car if you offer such a low fee you will get snubbed and it's very likely your emails or calls will be ignored. I see it the same way buying a player.
However what I believe is worse isn't the low bid itself, but the fact we consistently do it and we get labeled as cheap penny pinchers who offer such low fees for players. We get a bad reputation as a club that no one wants to do business with. Not just transfers, but wages too.
From the outside in the past when we got done over by the likes of West Brom at the last second I always assumed they just did the dirty on us, but over time it's been increasingly clear it is us who do it to ourselves with stringent negotiating for transfer fees, agent fees and wages.
When the new owners came in I think everyone thought despite the debt that they'd be able to loan more money and get in at least one new face, for me anyway that just proves the problem stems deeper than the owners but instead the recruitment team itself. If we have x to spend and x isn't close to enough for the players we are recruiting it's just bad recruitment and we need to search better. Either that, or whoever is doing our negotiating is just a complete idiot.
Digressing from the point I certainly understand that the club no longer has funds in the bank. I prefer the club to be debt free. I don't agree with the ridiculous fees people are paying for players and I certainly see why we don't give up and just pay up. However it is what it is in the modern game and to compete with other teams we are going to need find a way to pay. Other clubs consistently borrow money and are in far worse debt than we are, it's the norm now. Other clubs continue to make signings and we don't meaning we struggle more and more year to year.
At some point we are going to have to face reality and find a way to pay, even it means borrowing more money. Otherwise it's going to bite us in the backside and we'll have no revenue at all in the championship.
If we don't manage it soon then more teams like West Ham, Aston Villa and Wolverhampton Wanderers will overtake us and we'll be pushed even further down the pecking order. All it takes is for a team like Leeds to be promoted, survive the first year and get some backing the second and we get an extra club we aren't expected to get a result against.
In a league where we already play against top opposition regularly we can't keep still. We need to be developing youngsters now and not in a few years and who knows with the teams surrounding us geographically if that will ever really come to much.
I sincerely hope that the new owners get to the bottom of our bad recruitment and put an end to the terrible negotiating. There's never any sense in it. We bought Brownhill for 10m yet bid 5 for collins and then 7.5 when Stoke wanted 10? We can't get a deal over the line for Knight when Derby are in financial disarray? And we can't be in for a player like King earlier in the window even when his transfer fee would have been peanuts?
Let's hope we get lucky with injuries and address it in the summer.
When you buy a car if you offer such a low fee you will get snubbed and it's very likely your emails or calls will be ignored. I see it the same way buying a player.
However what I believe is worse isn't the low bid itself, but the fact we consistently do it and we get labeled as cheap penny pinchers who offer such low fees for players. We get a bad reputation as a club that no one wants to do business with. Not just transfers, but wages too.
From the outside in the past when we got done over by the likes of West Brom at the last second I always assumed they just did the dirty on us, but over time it's been increasingly clear it is us who do it to ourselves with stringent negotiating for transfer fees, agent fees and wages.
When the new owners came in I think everyone thought despite the debt that they'd be able to loan more money and get in at least one new face, for me anyway that just proves the problem stems deeper than the owners but instead the recruitment team itself. If we have x to spend and x isn't close to enough for the players we are recruiting it's just bad recruitment and we need to search better. Either that, or whoever is doing our negotiating is just a complete idiot.
Digressing from the point I certainly understand that the club no longer has funds in the bank. I prefer the club to be debt free. I don't agree with the ridiculous fees people are paying for players and I certainly see why we don't give up and just pay up. However it is what it is in the modern game and to compete with other teams we are going to need find a way to pay. Other clubs consistently borrow money and are in far worse debt than we are, it's the norm now. Other clubs continue to make signings and we don't meaning we struggle more and more year to year.
At some point we are going to have to face reality and find a way to pay, even it means borrowing more money. Otherwise it's going to bite us in the backside and we'll have no revenue at all in the championship.
If we don't manage it soon then more teams like West Ham, Aston Villa and Wolverhampton Wanderers will overtake us and we'll be pushed even further down the pecking order. All it takes is for a team like Leeds to be promoted, survive the first year and get some backing the second and we get an extra club we aren't expected to get a result against.
In a league where we already play against top opposition regularly we can't keep still. We need to be developing youngsters now and not in a few years and who knows with the teams surrounding us geographically if that will ever really come to much.
I sincerely hope that the new owners get to the bottom of our bad recruitment and put an end to the terrible negotiating. There's never any sense in it. We bought Brownhill for 10m yet bid 5 for collins and then 7.5 when Stoke wanted 10? We can't get a deal over the line for Knight when Derby are in financial disarray? And we can't be in for a player like King earlier in the window even when his transfer fee would have been peanuts?
Let's hope we get lucky with injuries and address it in the summer.
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Re: January Transfer Window Discussion - Rumours and Links welcome
not sure we paid anything like 10 for Brownhill
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Re: January Transfer Window Discussion - Rumours and Links welcome
£3M net according to SD.
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Re: January Transfer Window Discussion - Rumours and Links welcome
I agree with many of your points. It seems that Darren Fletcher until recently at Stoke, but now on the coaching team at Old Trafford recommended Collins to Man Utd. He is captain at the age of 19, and played RB on Saturday so fills in two positions. He is also an international.To put it into context, from what I have heard, he could have been purchased by offering £2m more than we sold Vokes for, who lets face it had reached the end of his PL career. So what do we do we offer half of the Vokes fee as starters, then raise the offer supposedly, but its still less than what we sold Vokes for. We cant have it both wayssuperdimitri wrote: ↑Tue Feb 02, 2021 4:31 pmI understand how a bid can be an insulting but on a one off basis it really shouldn't be a big deal because you can always increase it.
When you buy a car if you offer such a low fee you will get snubbed and it's very likely your emails or calls will be ignored. I see it the same way buying a player.
However what I believe is worse isn't the low bid itself, but the fact we consistently do it and we get labeled as cheap penny pinchers who offer such low fees for players. We get a bad reputation as a club that no one wants to do business with. Not just transfers, but wages too.
From the outside in the past when we got done over by the likes of West Brom at the last second I always assumed they just did the dirty on us, but over time it's been increasingly clear it is us who do it to ourselves with stringent negotiating for transfer fees, agent fees and wages.
When the new owners came in I think everyone thought despite the debt that they'd be able to loan more money and get in at least one new face, for me anyway that just proves the problem stems deeper than the owners but instead the recruitment team itself. If we have x to spend and x isn't close to enough for the players we are recruiting it's just bad recruitment and we need to search better. Either that, or whoever is doing our negotiating is just a complete idiot.
Digressing from the point I certainly understand that the club no longer has funds in the bank. I prefer the club to be debt free. I don't agree with the ridiculous fees people are paying for players and I certainly see why we don't give up and just pay up. However it is what it is in the modern game and to compete with other teams we are going to need find a way to pay. Other clubs consistently borrow money and are in far worse debt than we are, it's the norm now. Other clubs continue to make signings and we don't meaning we struggle more and more year to year.
At some point we are going to have to face reality and find a way to pay, even it means borrowing more money. Otherwise it's going to bite us in the backside and we'll have no revenue at all in the championship.
If we don't manage it soon then more teams like West Ham, Aston Villa and Wolverhampton Wanderers will overtake us and we'll be pushed even further down the pecking order. All it takes is for a team like Leeds to be promoted, survive the first year and get some backing the second and we get an extra club we aren't expected to get a result against.
In a league where we already play against top opposition regularly we can't keep still. We need to be developing youngsters now and not in a few years and who knows with the teams surrounding us geographically if that will ever really come to much.
I sincerely hope that the new owners get to the bottom of our bad recruitment and put an end to the terrible negotiating. There's never any sense in it. We bought Brownhill for 10m yet bid 5 for collins and then 7.5 when Stoke wanted 10? We can't get a deal over the line for Knight when Derby are in financial disarray? And we can't be in for a player like King earlier in the window even when his transfer fee would have been peanuts?
Let's hope we get lucky with injuries and address it in the summer.
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Re: January Transfer Window Discussion - Rumours and Links welcome
So £3.75m spent nett over the last 3 windows ? Pitiful for a Premier League club.
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Re: January Transfer Window Discussion - Rumours and Links welcome
I think we did if you include the worth of Wells.
Re: January Transfer Window Discussion - Rumours and Links welcome
Christ, this last page of this thread has been nothing short of embarrassing.
Hopefully it will be the last page.
Hopefully it will be the last page.
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Re: January Transfer Window Discussion - Rumours and Links welcome
We signed anyone yet?
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Re: January Transfer Window Discussion - Rumours and Links welcome
There's a good point there. We all sniggered when it was reported Stoke had shelled out £10 million for Big Sam who had largely become a late sub or even an unused sub at Burnley and clearly wasn't the force he had been. BUT we wouldn't pay out £10 million for an extremely highly rated 19 year old international with loads of potential who could have become the next Tarks, Trippier, Mee or Keane. If we really did offer 7.5 then surely handing over the extra 2.5 to get the lad here wouldn't have been all that difficult or represent a huge gamble.warksclaret wrote: ↑Tue Feb 02, 2021 5:22 pmI agree with many of your points. It seems that Darren Fletcher until recently at Stoke, but now on the coaching team at Old Trafford recommended Collins to Man Utd. He is captain at the age of 19, and played RB on Saturday so fills in two positions. He is also an international.To put it into context, from what I have heard, he could have been purchased by offering £2m more than we sold Vokes for, who lets face it had reached the end of his PL career. So what do we do we offer half of the Vokes fee as starters, then raise the offer supposedly, but its still less than what we sold Vokes for. We cant have it both ways
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Re: January Transfer Window Discussion - Rumours and Links welcome
Only theories that stack up are that a) we didn't rate him so highly (improbable, given we were bidding), b) they made it clear they wouldn't sell this window at any price (so no point bidding further, or c) we hadn't got the money to bid higher (most likely, given recent reports).Dark Cloud wrote: ↑Wed Feb 03, 2021 9:37 amThere's a good point there. We all sniggered when it was reported Stoke had shelled out £10 million for Big Sam who had largely become a late sub or even an unused sub at Burnley and clearly wasn't the force he had been. BUT we wouldn't pay out £10 million for an extremely highly rated 19 year old international with loads of potential who could have become the next Tarks, Trippier, Mee or Keane. If we really did offer 7.5 then surely handing over the extra 2.5 to get the lad here wouldn't have been all that difficult or represent a huge gamble.
Such a shame because a strong second half of the season and we may be out of the running in summer.
While I'd have loved us to sign a right winger, having a young RB/CB option would have been a pleasing window.
Re: January Transfer Window Discussion - Rumours and Links welcome
But Dyche doesn't seem to trust youngsters as much as players over 30, therefore would maybe not want to spend anywhere near £10m on a 19 year oldDark Cloud wrote: ↑Wed Feb 03, 2021 9:37 amThere's a good point there. We all sniggered when it was reported Stoke had shelled out £10 million for Big Sam who had largely become a late sub or even an unused sub at Burnley and clearly wasn't the force he had been. BUT we wouldn't pay out £10 million for an extremely highly rated 19 year old international with loads of potential who could have become the next Tarks, Trippier, Mee or Keane. If we really did offer 7.5 then surely handing over the extra 2.5 to get the lad here wouldn't have been all that difficult or represent a huge gamble.
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Re: January Transfer Window Discussion - Rumours and Links welcome
The thing is, I wasn't thinking of Collins walking into the team UNLESS one of our first choice CB's gets injured, but more that he would be a potential long term replacement for Tarks who will 99% definitely leave in the summer and that's how I'd have hoped SD would have seen it too. Secondly, I think what the club have to realise is that £1m for Michael Keane from Utd back in 2014?? (Not sure) and £3m for Tarks a couple of years later is now the £10m for Collins in 2021. Things have moved on. You're still largely buying the "potential" and that includes the potential to sell on at a hefty profit somewhere down the line.
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Re: January Transfer Window Discussion - Rumours and Links welcome
The essence of this takeover is that for it to succeed the new methods to be employed by Alan Pace to spot and identify transfer targets and sign them for the club needs to work and have Sean Dyche fully on board.
To quote "Alan Pace has a lot of faith in the software and algorithms he uses that he will be able to employ to help identify, buy, develop and subsequently sell that talent for the benefit of the club."
I cannot imagine that the software will identify many targets approaching 30 years of age.
To quote "Alan Pace has a lot of faith in the software and algorithms he uses that he will be able to employ to help identify, buy, develop and subsequently sell that talent for the benefit of the club."
I cannot imagine that the software will identify many targets approaching 30 years of age.
Re: January Transfer Window Discussion - Rumours and Links welcome
Given the size of the rebuild job, I'd suggest the club needs to be out there now targeting players coming out of contract at the end of the season and looking at contracts swiftly come the end of the season or even pre contracts.
Re: January Transfer Window Discussion - Rumours and Links welcome
You're not wrong
But I would have expected Mike Rigg and the rest of the recruitment team to have been doing the same for the last 2/3 years, and we know where that has got us in terms of improving first eleven
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Re: January Transfer Window Discussion - Rumours and Links welcome
Armstrong ends the season with a hat trick and 28 goals. As previous, really think he could make the step up now. Would be well worth looking at. Fine player.
This user liked this post: frankinwales
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Re: January Transfer Window Discussion - Rumours and Links welcome
Just watched the goals. He’s done very well, and reminds me of Ings. Only concerns would be whether the quality of defending in the Championship makes him look better than he is (doubt either of his shots today would’ve beaten a PL keeper & the other was a pen) and whether he’s physically strong enough.
I’d like him but might be a bit worried if it were to replace Vyds who looks the part at this level now.
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Re: January Transfer Window Discussion - Rumours and Links welcome
Armstrong and Toney have scored an almost identical number of goals in the Championship this season and I would imagine Brentford will be wanting in the region of £30m to £35m to secure Ivan Toney's signature.