ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover

[jrgbfc]

Most neutrals in this country hate watching us play, its pretty far fetched to think we're going to start attracting legions of fans from across the world.
Growing the commercial side of things is probably doable but it all depends on Dyche keeping us relatively competitive on the pitch.

[GodIsADeeJay81]

Thinking big, tell me what is that exactly?

All your buzz words mean nothing, its results on the pitch what matters to the fans. Many owners who have taken over clubs, including them lot down the road, used buzz words like you but failed to deliver. Why you think we'll be any different is baffling let alone improve on our 7th place finish.

I could think big by thinking Burnley are going to win the Premier league. Sound good? Yes. Realistic? No

Ah so now you're trying to focus on 7th place because you've realised you can't trap me with youth players.

I didn't say improve on 7th either, I said improve our league position and enter Europe more often, plus better Cup runs.
There is a difference.

You're not even that good at this yet you accuse me of having no meat on the bone with this topic.

[DomBFC1882]

Get lost

It isn't my fault your a small minded person who can't see how to grow a business.

You're very insulting and patronising for a guy who still believes in the tooth fairy

[GodIsADeeJay81]

Most neutrals in this country hate watching us play, its pretty far fetched to think we're going to start attracting legions of fans from across the world.
Growing the commercial side of things is probably doable but it all depends on Dyche keeping us relatively competitive on the pitch.

Making us more competitive requires improvements in recruitment, improvements to sponsorship deals etc.

That's what the owners want to do.

[GodIsADeeJay81]

You're very insulting and patronising for a guy who still believes in the tooth fairy

The tooth fairy would probably have a better grasp of this than you.

[DCWat]

I've made numerous comments on this, as have others like Darthlaw.
If people aren't going to bother reading or learning how businesses grow revenue streams, how many times should I repeat myself?

The basics of revenue expansion apply to any business, the level it reaches depends on who's task it it.

You want substance, look at Utd and how they did it over the years.
Maybe look at Leeds because they're about to embark on a similar project to improve their revenue streams to enable them to keep up with the big boys.
Sheff Utd have gone into partnerships with other clubs, as have Leicester.

We are playing catch up but at least we're finally about to enter the game at long last

I must have missed your comments on it. I’ve seen you mention growing revenue streams, increasing our appeal to a wider audience and the income that might bring. I’ve seen you mention us getting into Europe and now pointing us in the direction of Man United, Leeds and Sheffield United.

They’re all exceptionally high level and basic visions. So, I’m not asking you to repeat yourself, I’m asking you to provide some detail as to how you see us doing all of these fantastic things.

If I’ve missed your marketing and business growth seminars on here, I do apologise.

[DomBFC1882]

Ah so now you're trying to focus on 7th place because you've realised you can't trap me with youth players.

I didn't say improve on 7th either, I said improve our league position and enter Europe more often, plus better Cup runs.
There is a difference.

You're not even that good at this yet you accuse me of having no meat on the bone with this topic.

Improve on league position you said correct? So again, how do we improve on the 7th place we had under the previous ownership?

And far from evading the youth topic, if you can't see that the new owners who believe in the scouting system want to gradually introduce youth more whilst at the same time having a manager who never either plays or signs young players then im afraid you're a lost cause.

[DomBFC1882]

The tooth fairy would probably have a better grasp of this than you.

You're clearly alone in your delusions of all this.

Where do you see us in 5 years then? Genuine question.

[Newcastleclaret93]

The fact of the matter is, the new owners don’t have a penny to there name. Not sure how anyone can say that we will be in a better position than we are now without serious investment.

Let’s be realistic the team alone requires close to £40m in the next window or two just get the squad back to the levels of 2017-2018.

The areas Godisadeejay has highlighted can work but I just don’t see how it is going to be possible to grow the various areas of the business without investment. Especially since it doesn’t appear like we will even be able to pay the interest on the MSD loan with the current revenue levels.

I want them to be successful but actions speak louder than words and so far they have done nothing or even shown evidence that they are capable of moving the club forward.

[dushanbe]

ok yeah its hard to argue against, we do need to grow - we have a product with a level of exposure. We need to find a way of making that product attractive to people who might want to attach themselves to us in the form of sponsorship etc. We don't have the global reach of the big boys - your average fan in China, India, US or Middle east want to ally with succesful teams, so the money follows those teams.

I understand whats being said, its obvious really, the question is how do we increase our exposure level, not who we've got trying to pull in sponsorship deals. If there is a plan to do that, then great - I haven't heard it from ALK, I've heard some soundbites, lets hope they've got a deliverable idea.

[GodIsADeeJay81]

You're clearly alone in your delusions of all this.

Where do you see us in 5 years then? Genuine question.

Premier league club.
Better squad.
Better academy players.
To have had another trip into Europe.
To have finished 10th or higher more of than not.

[DomBFC1882]

The fact of the matter is, the new owners don’t have a penny to there name. Not sure how anyone can say that we will be in a better position than we are now without serious investment.

Let’s be realistic the team alone requires close to £40m in the next window or two just get the squad back to the levels of 2017-2018.

The areas Godisadeejay has highlighted can work but I just don’t see how it is going to be possible to grow the various areas of the business without investment. Especially since it doesn’t appear like we will even be able to pay the interest on the MSD loan with the current revenue levels.

I want them to be successful but actions speak louder than words and so far they have done nothing or even shown evidence that they are capable of moving the club forward.

He's offering a very speculative viewpoint of ifs buts and maybe but refusing to deal in the here and now. What happens on the pitch ultimately effects all of these "visions". If we don't improve the team in the summer, we are likely to get relegated.

For us to be marketed properly we need to be playing at the top level that can't even be disputed. Being accused of being short termist is a compliment tbh as thst means improving the squad now and playing in the top league.

[agreenwood]

I’ve tried to follow this thread, but it’s just leaving me with more questions than answers.

The one question I keep returning to however, is whether muchacho is still faster than Cristiano Ronaldo?

[Elizabeth]

Some really positive support here for the new owners eg who wouldn’t like some great young players coming through and better players at good prices.
The reliance on modern scouting techniques for this to happen is all very good but it can’t be the guarantee some people think it is . Then the money has to be found , they won’t come free however ‘cheap’they are.
Then how does the plan go if we get relegated before this all falls into place ? This could happened while money is freed up by selling our current best players and while these ‘new’ ideas are still to mature

[DomBFC1882]

Premier league club.
Better squad.
Better academy players.
To have had another trip into Europe.
To have finished 10th or higher more of than not.

Okay so basically everything we had under the previous ownership bar the academy players.

Academy players, decent ones, take time. The only way to have a better squad for the next 2 seasons or so is by investing in the playing squad. Alarmingly however we don't appear to have the money.

[Newcastleclaret93]

He's offering a very speculative viewpoint of ifs buts and maybe but refusing to deal in the here and now. What happens on the pitch ultimately effects all of these "visions". If we don't improve the team in the summer, we are likely to get relegated.

For us to be marketed properly we need to be playing at the top level that can't even be disputed. Being accused of being short termist is a compliment tbh as thst means improving the squad now and playing in the top league.

I 100% agree. I think the next 12 months will dictate the next 10 years of this club.

If we don’t seriously invest in the squad we will be in serious trouble next season. We have been relatively lucky that Dyche has managed to pull our threadbare squad through another season (that is if we stay up this season).

I just can’t see how the investment in the squad is going to happen now that we have an extra 6-10m worth of interest on debt to pay every season. Especially given the revenue is significantly lower due to Covid.

All we can do is hope this Gamble pays off.

[elwaclaret]

I don’t have delusions, but I feel a month into a new club, homes and getting to know the place, I hardly think it is surprising that we are not yet seeing much at ground level yet. Not to mention COVID.

To say that no-one except the men running our club truly know our collective arses from our elbows... so is it not better to stop slagging off people you do not know, based only for the sake of your personal petty frustrations that the football club did not go and do exactly what you in your collective wisdom(s)would have done.

They might be broke and a waste of space, but let’s give them time to find out. We are looking reasonably comfortable and have players coming back... we have no idea of what is planned for the summer, on any front.

[Tall Paul]

Some really positive support here for the new owners eg who wouldn’t like some great young players coming through and better players at good prices.
The reliance on modern scouting techniques for this to happen is all very good but it can’t be the guarantee some people think it is . Then the money has to be found , they won’t come free however ‘cheap’they are.
Then how does the plan go if we get relegated before this all falls into place ? This could happened while money is freed up by selling our current best players and while these ‘new’ ideas are still to mature

I think if we're relegated we'll be pretty much screwed.

[DomBFC1882]

I don’t have delusions, but I feel a month into a new club, homes and getting to know the place, I hardly think it is surprising that we are not yet seeing much at ground level yet. Not to mention COVID.

To say that no-one except the men running our club truly know our collective arses from our elbows... so is it not better to stop slagging off people you do not know, based only for the sake of your personal petty frustrations that the football club did not go and do exactly what you in your collective wisdom(s)would have done.

They might be broke and a waste of space, but let’s give them time to find out. We are looking reasonably comfortable and have players coming back... we have no idea of what is planned for the summer, on any front.

The last part of your post .......

And therein lies the problem

[elwaclaret]

The last part of your post .......

And therein lies the problem

For that I can only find solace in the fact that they are religious men. They have made no secret of it and it would look pretty bad for the Church of the Laterday Saints if their aim was to turn the club over, would it?
...they are under a lot of pressure, debt is also frowned upon if I remember right, they’ll want converts not enemies in East Lancashire.

[DomBFC1882]

For that I can only find solace in the fact that they are religious men. They have made no secret of it and it would look pretty bad for the Church of the Laterday Saints if their aim was to turn the club over, would it?
...they are under a lot of pressure, debt is also frowned upon if I remember right, they’ll want converts not enemies in East Lancashire.

For the love of God I hope you're right Elwa

[KRBFC]

Premier league club.
Better squad.
Better academy players.
To have had another trip into Europe.
To have finished 10th or higher more of than not.

and how do we do that without significant investment into the playing side? money ALK doesn't have.

[DCWat]

and how do we do that without significant investment into the playing side? money ALK doesn't have.

Better marketing, more fans, more revenue, better players, higher league position. It’s just basic business growth. Simples.

[DomBFC1882]

Better marketing, more fans, more revenue, better players, higher league position. It’s just basic business growth. Simples.

And it all happens without us spending a penny or costing us anything at all. Simples.

[DCWat]

To be fair, I do think that there will be plenty of opportunities out there. I’m sure that a good few of those will be much easier to attain for the likes of Leeds and Man United, so I’m not convinced by that as a comparison.

I also don’t think it’s as simple as just getting some big commercial deals to get the money rolling in. It sounds a bit chicken and egg, without further investment to make us a more attractive proposition for potential ‘partners’.

[GodIsADeeJay81]

I must have missed your comments on it. I’ve seen you mention growing revenue streams, increasing our appeal to a wider audience and the income that might bring. I’ve seen you mention us getting into Europe and now pointing us in the direction of Man United, Leeds and Sheffield United.

They’re all exceptionally high level and basic visions. So, I’m not asking you to repeat yourself, I’m asking you to provide some detail as to how you see us doing all of these fantastic things.

If I’ve missed your marketing and business growth seminars on here, I do apologise.

For those at the back of the class who weren't paying attention then..

We have access to a world wide market, yet we have local businesses advertising within TM.
That doesn't make us much money, so we need to find bigger national and international companies for starters.

Match day revenue can be increased, better halftime food, better shop with a more varied range of products etc.
Ticket deals to entice people in.
I've seen other clubs do a deal for people who have a season ticket and get another match day ticket at a reduced price every so often.

Clarets player - isn't marketed very well, personally I've never used it yet I've paid for the NFL app because I know exactly the quality of content on there.
I don't recall if I've ever had an email about clarets player telling me what's on there...
Improve that and its marketing and off it goes making more money.

I get emails thrice weekly from Man City though, prior to a game, after a game, and with offers inbetween (did a tour of the ground a few years ago hence the emails)
Same with Utd after we went to watch Carricks testimonial for someone elses birthday.
Burnley lag behind here.

Every effing year we fail to release the new kit until the season is about to start, we miss out on a summer of sales pretty much

Oh and the club webstore, it's like wading through mud when I use it, I already know I could make that layout better, I've done it for other businesses.
Does the club have an ebay or Amazon store does anyone know?
Last time I ran an eBay store they offered a click a collection service from your nearest Argos branch, that would save people from having to travel all the way up to Burnley to buy stuff...
Missing a market there.

Delivery from the store is painful, just get vaguely told it will appear in the next 10 days...
Anywhere else I shop online, I get told when it's left and a due date and some places I can track it so I don't have to chase it.
I'm even happy paying for that shipping service.

Even when I visit the club store it feels amateurish, there wasn't anyone on the door to greet you when you walked in, or help you find stuff.


As darthlaw mentioned previously, Utd have official partners in all sorts of things from tyres, cars, clothing, electrical items, luggage etc.
That's a large amount of money.
We won't get near to their number, I think it's hundreds of deals, but we haven't barely even scratched the surface.

Our pre season tours aren't very international either, but they could be so much more profile raising.

We are in the most marketed league in the world and as a club we just don't do a lot because we just didn't think outside of our long standing small minded thinking.

It's all fairly basic stuff, it doesn't even require big thinking, just forward thinking more than anything.

I don't even know who the previous marketing person was, but I know they weren't very good at it...

[DomBFC1882]

To be fair, I do think that there will be plenty of opportunities out there. I’m sure that a good few of those will be much easier to attain for the likes of Leeds and Man United, so I’m not convinced by that as a comparison.

I also don’t think it’s as simple as just getting some big commercial deals to get the money rolling in. It sounds a bit chicken and egg, without further investment to make us a more attractive proposition for potential ‘partners’.

Leeds and Manchester United is a ridiculous comparison given the size of the 2 respective cities and fan bases it must be said.

If we get relegated our attendances will drop several thousand. That would be catastrophic for any vision that ALK has. We are going to lose several players in the summer including Tarky. Without proper investment short term in the playing squad, we could be in serious trouble in 12-18 months time

[GodIsADeeJay81]

He's offering a very speculative viewpoint of ifs buts and maybe but refusing to deal in the here and now. What happens on the pitch ultimately effects all of these "visions". If we don't improve the team in the summer, we are likely to get relegated.

For us to be marketed properly we need to be playing at the top level that can't even be disputed. Being accused of being short termist is a compliment tbh as thst means improving the squad now and playing in the top league.

I can deal in the here and now, plus look forwards.

You lot clearly can't.

[Newcastleclaret93]

For those at the back of the class who weren't paying attention then..

We have access to a world wide market, yet we have local businesses advertising within TM.
That doesn't make us much money, so we need to find bigger national and international companies for starters.

Match day revenue can be increased, better halftime food, better shop with a more varied range of products etc.
Ticket deals to entice people in.
I've seen other clubs do a deal for people who have a season ticket and get another match day ticket at a reduced price every so often.

Clarets player - isn't marketed very well, personally I've never used it yet I've paid for the NFL app because I know exactly the quality of content on there.
I don't recall if I've ever had an email about clarets player telling me what's on there...
Improve that and its marketing and off it goes making more money.

I get emails thrice weekly from Man City though, prior to a game, after a game, and with offers inbetween (did a tour of the ground a few years ago hence the emails)
Same with Utd after we went to watch Carricks testimonial for someone elses birthday.
Burnley lag behind here.

Every effing year we fail to release the new kit until the season is about to start, we miss out on a summer of sales pretty much

Oh and the club webstore, it's like wading through mud when I use it, I already know I could make that layout better, I've done it for other businesses.
Does the club have an ebay or Amazon store does anyone know?
Last time I ran an eBay store they offered a click a collection service from your nearest Argos branch, that would save people from having to travel all the way up to Burnley to buy stuff...
Missing a market there.

Delivery from the store is painful, just get vaguely told it will appear in the next 10 days...
Anywhere else I shop online, I get told when it's left and a due date and some places I can track it so I don't have to chase it.
I'm even happy paying for that shipping service.

Even when I visit the club store it feels amateurish, there wasn't anyone on the door to greet you when you walked in, or help you find stuff.


As darthlaw mentioned previously, Utd have official partners in all sorts of things from tyres, cars, clothing, electrical items, luggage etc.
That's a large amount of money.
We won't get near to their number, I think it's hundreds of deals, but we haven't barely even scratched the surface.

Our pre season tours aren't very international either, but they could be so much more profile raising.

We are in the most marketed league in the world and as a club we just don't do a lot because we just didn't think outside of our long standing small minded thinking.

It's all fairly basic stuff, it doesn't even require big thinking, just forward thinking more than anything.

I don't even know who the previous marketing person was, but I know they weren't very good at it...

The items you have mentioned there are going to improve the turnover of the club by a couple hundred thousand. Unless we can get significantly larger sponsorship deals, however I believe for a club our size we have one of the largest.

The items you mentioned could increase revenue but with the lowest fan base in the league you are talking penny’s in the grand scheme of things.

We would need to increase revenue significantly to improve the players we recruit, both for the first team and the academy.

[GodIsADeeJay81]

Leeds and Manchester United is a ridiculous comparison given the size of the 2 respective cities and fan bases it must be said.

If we get relegated our attendances will drop several thousand. That would be catastrophic for any vision that ALK has. We are going to lose several players in the summer including Tarky. Without proper investment short term in the playing squad, we could be in serious trouble in 12-18 months time

I've used examples of two clubs, one who grew it's revenue streams and one who's planning too.

Yet you sit there and say its ridiculous, because you're small minded.
Leeds have been marketed very well for decades so people automatically think they're a big club with a fantastic history of winning trophies when really they aren't.

[DomBFC1882]

For those at the back of the class who weren't paying attention then..

We have access to a world wide market, yet we have local businesses advertising within TM.
That doesn't make us much money, so we need to find bigger national and international companies for starters.

Match day revenue can be increased, better halftime food, better shop with a more varied range of products etc.
Ticket deals to entice people in.
I've seen other clubs do a deal for people who have a season ticket and get another match day ticket at a reduced price every so often.

Clarets player - isn't marketed very well, personally I've never used it yet I've paid for the NFL app because I know exactly the quality of content on there.
I don't recall if I've ever had an email about clarets player telling me what's on there...
Improve that and its marketing and off it goes making more money.

I get emails thrice weekly from Man City though, prior to a game, after a game, and with offers inbetween (did a tour of the ground a few years ago hence the emails)
Same with Utd after we went to watch Carricks testimonial for someone elses birthday.
Burnley lag behind here.

Every effing year we fail to release the new kit until the season is about to start, we miss out on a summer of sales pretty much

Oh and the club webstore, it's like wading through mud when I use it, I already know I could make that layout better, I've done it for other businesses.
Does the club have an ebay or Amazon store does anyone know?
Last time I ran an eBay store they offered a click a collection service from your nearest Argos branch, that would save people from having to travel all the way up to Burnley to buy stuff...
Missing a market there.

Delivery from the store is painful, just get vaguely told it will appear in the next 10 days...
Anywhere else I shop online, I get told when it's left and a due date and some places I can track it so I don't have to chase it.
I'm even happy paying for that shipping service.

Even when I visit the club store it feels amateurish, there wasn't anyone on the door to greet you when you walked in, or help you find stuff.


As darthlaw mentioned previously, Utd have official partners in all sorts of things from tyres, cars, clothing, electrical items, luggage etc.
That's a large amount of money.
We won't get near to their number, I think it's hundreds of deals, but we haven't barely even scratched the surface.

Our pre season tours aren't very international either, but they could be so much more profile raising.

We are in the most marketed league in the world and as a club we just don't do a lot because we just didn't think outside of our long standing small minded thinking.

It's all fairly basic stuff, it doesn't even require big thinking, just forward thinking more than anything.

I don't even know who the previous marketing person was, but I know they weren't very good at it...

You make many good points there it has to be said

I do think though more or less everything you have said is dependent on us staying in the Premier league. Merchandise and ticket sales for example are only going to reach their potential by playing in the Premier league.

A wider audience isn't going to go mad to buy a Burnley shirt when we're in the Championship, likewise match day tickets.

[GodIsADeeJay81]

The items you have mentioned there are going to improve the turnover of the club by a couple hundred thousand. Unless we can get significantly larger sponsorship deals, however I believe for a club our size we have one of the largest.

The items you mentioned could increase revenue but with the lowest fan base in the league you are talking penny’s in the grand scheme of things.

We would need to increase revenue significantly to improve the players we recruit, both for the first team and the academy.

This is why I call you Mr Negative, because you're only happy when you're putting the club down.

[DomBFC1882]

I've used examples of two clubs, one who grew it's revenue streams and one who's planning too.

Yet you sit there and say its ridiculous, because you're small minded.
Leeds have been marketed very well for decades so people automatically think they're a big club with a fantastic history of winning trophies when really they aren't.

You just going to ignore the size of their cities then?

[Newcastleclaret93]

This is why I call you Mr Negative, because you're only happy when you're putting the club down.

I didn’t put the club down at all.

I said the suggestion you have made would increase turnover by a couple hundred thousand. All of the items you said are dependant on a paying fan base. As I highlighted we have the smallest fan base by some distance in the league. Where do you think the extra paying customers are gonna come from?

I am not having a dig or being “negative” I just don’t understand your proposals.

As I mentioned given the current finances and now the extra debt interest we have to play our revenue would have increase exponentially to buy the players you have highlighted.

[GodIsADeeJay81]

You make many good points there it has to be said

I do think though more or less everything you have said is dependent on us staying in the Premier league. Merchandise and ticket sales for example are only going to reach their potential by playing in the Premier league.

A wider audience isn't going to go mad to buy a Burnley shirt when we're in the Championship, likewise match day tickets.

So how do clubs have better non tv revenues in the championship than we do?

[elwaclaret]

For the love of God I hope you're right Elwa

Me too Dom.

[GodIsADeeJay81]

You just going to ignore the size of their cities then?

Manchester?
They don't target Manchester with their marketing campaigns, they don't need to worry about that.

They look at the world around them... Think big remember.

[GodIsADeeJay81]

And it all happens without us spending a penny or costing us anything at all. Simples.

Nope, it requires money, time and the sheer will/enthusiasm to grow the revenue streams.

You could throw money at a marketing team, but if they aren't willing to put the long days into it then it's a waste of time.
Our last lot were clearly on a jolly taking the money for minimal return.

[DCWat]

For those at the back of the class who weren't paying attention then..

We have access to a world wide market, yet we have local businesses advertising within TM.
That doesn't make us much money, so we need to find bigger national and international companies for starters.

Match day revenue can be increased, better halftime food, better shop with a more varied range of products etc.
Ticket deals to entice people in.
I've seen other clubs do a deal for people who have a season ticket and get another match day ticket at a reduced price every so often.

Clarets player - isn't marketed very well, personally I've never used it yet I've paid for the NFL app because I know exactly the quality of content on there.
I don't recall if I've ever had an email about clarets player telling me what's on there...
Improve that and its marketing and off it goes making more money.

I get emails thrice weekly from Man City though, prior to a game, after a game, and with offers inbetween (did a tour of the ground a few years ago hence the emails)
Same with Utd after we went to watch Carricks testimonial for someone elses birthday.
Burnley lag behind here.

Every effing year we fail to release the new kit until the season is about to start, we miss out on a summer of sales pretty much

Oh and the club webstore, it's like wading through mud when I use it, I already know I could make that layout better, I've done it for other businesses.
Does the club have an ebay or Amazon store does anyone know?
Last time I ran an eBay store they offered a click a collection service from your nearest Argos branch, that would save people from having to travel all the way up to Burnley to buy stuff...
Missing a market there.

Delivery from the store is painful, just get vaguely told it will appear in the next 10 days...
Anywhere else I shop online, I get told when it's left and a due date and some places I can track it so I don't have to chase it.
I'm even happy paying for that shipping service.

Even when I visit the club store it feels amateurish, there wasn't anyone on the door to greet you when you walked in, or help you find stuff.


As darthlaw mentioned previously, Utd have official partners in all sorts of things from tyres, cars, clothing, electrical items, luggage etc.
That's a large amount of money.
We won't get near to their number, I think it's hundreds of deals, but we haven't barely even scratched the surface.

Our pre season tours aren't very international either, but they could be so much more profile raising.

We are in the most marketed league in the world and as a club we just don't do a lot because we just didn't think outside of our long standing small minded thinking.

It's all fairly basic stuff, it doesn't even require big thinking, just forward thinking more than anything.

I don't even know who the previous marketing person was, but I know they weren't very good at it...

I think a lot of the items you’ve mentioned, whilst they would all be great, would predominantly benefit the everyday or visiting fan. That’s certainly no bad thing, but I don’t see it pulling in the sort of sums we are talking about needing to achieve.

That’s not to say that we shouldn’t do them and it’s not to say that I’m right - we might bring in huge sums. I just don’t see it from ticket deals, earlier shirt releases or improved food offerings. What I would say is that doing lots of smaller things well will certainly do us no harm, helping to improve perception of us as a brand.

There’s no denying that the website, shop and app offerings aren’t great. That’s an area we have to improve in order to make the most of any interest from further afield. Perhaps driven by overseas trips, as you say.

I don’t know how much of an untapped market there is out there when it comes to foreign countries. You certainly see Liverpool and United being swamped with supporters on foreign trips to China and the like, perhaps there’s a slice of that pie, but that’s a pie that’ll take a lot of cooking.

I’m blatantly not a marketing expert, but I’d think that many of the more global brands would have to look a long way past other options to see Burnley as an appealing and viable partnership. They’re after the clubs that they know will have the bigger viewing figures.

Now, the how we might get to those sort of levels (assuming they are attainable) is the interesting bit. How do we attract a greater audience and in turn obtain bigger sponsorship deals to increase revenue?

We need a better product that appeals or be everyone’s favourite underdog. Quite how we do that, I don’t know but we’ll certainly need to invest significantly in the team. Where is that investment coming from ahead of the bigger deals and greater fan base that we are aiming for?

[KRBFC]

Better marketing, more fans, more revenue, better players, higher league position. It’s just basic business growth. Simples.

Sounds very simple and vague, how do we attract more paying fans? even then fans aren't allowed in yet. I don't think its quite as simple as sell more shirts worldwide and even then we'd have to sell an awful lot more even just to cover the yearly interest on the loan and that's before we even start talking about bringing players in. We are absolutely skint and our only main source of income atm is the TV money, we've further eaten into our chance of competing in the market by draining our resources on debt.

[DomBFC1882]

Manchester?
They don't target Manchester with their marketing campaigns, they don't need to worry about that.

They look at the world around them... Think big remember.

Well United are a massive club in history so they've never been in a position like ours.

Regarding Leeds, it's quite clear when you've got a city of around a million people and a ground that holds under 40k then it is not as difficult to market and attract new fans. Easy maths.

For a club like ours however, where are these fans coming from? What is going to attract them to Burnley so much thst they are going to start buying merchandise and paying for match day tickets? This is the point. We would love to know you're answer to these critical questions.

If you're plan is just to hope that a bit of marketing here and there works then just say it. These supposed new fans need something to attract them to the club. At the minute that's neither marquee signings, style of football etc

[DCWat]

Sounds very simple and vague, how do we attract more paying fans? even then fans aren't allowed in yet. I don't think its quite as simple as sell more shirts worldwide and even then we'd have to sell an awful lot more even just to cover the yearly interest on the loan and that's before we even start talking about bringing players in. We are absolutely skint and our only main source of income atm is the TV money, we've further eaten into our chance of competing in the market by draining our resources on debt.

It was a bit of a tongue in cheek post, KRBFC

[DomBFC1882]

I think a lot of the items you’ve mentioned, whilst they would all be great, would predominantly benefit the everyday or visiting fan. That’s certainly no bad thing, but I don’t see it pulling in the sort of sums we are talking about needing to achieve.

That’s not to say that we shouldn’t do them and it’s not to say that I’m right - we might bring in huge sums. I just don’t see it from ticket deals, earlier shirt releases or improved food offerings. What I would say is that doing lots of smaller things well will certainly do us no harm, helping to improve perception of us as a brand.

There’s no denying that the website, shop and app offerings aren’t great. That’s an area we have to improve in order to make the most of any interest from further afield. Perhaps driven by overseas trips, as you say.

I don’t know how much of an untapped market there is out there when it comes to foreign countries. You certainly see Liverpool and United being swamped with supporters on foreign trips to China and the like, perhaps there’s a slice of that pie, but that’s a pie that’ll take a lot of cooking.

I’m blatantly not a marketing expert, but I’d think that many of the more global brands would have to look a long way past other options to see Burnley as an appealing and viable partnership. They’re after the clubs that they know will have the bigger viewing figures.

Now, the how we might get to those sort of levels (assuming they are attainable) is the interesting bit. How do we attract a greater audience and in turn obtain bigger sponsorship deals to increase revenue?

We need a better product that appeals or be everyone’s favourite underdog. Quite how we do that, I don’t know but we’ll certainly need to invest significantly in the team. Where is that investment coming from ahead of the bigger deals and greater fan base that we are aiming for?

Superb post DC

[GodIsADeeJay81]

Well United are a massive club in history so they've never been in a position like ours.

Regarding Leeds, it's quite clear when you've got a city of around a million people and a ground that holds under 40k then it is not as difficult to market and attract new fans. Easy maths.

For a club like ours however, where are these fans coming from? What is going to attract them to Burnley so much thst they are going to start buying merchandise and paying for match day tickets? This is the point. We would love to know you're answer to these critical questions.

If you're plan is just to hope that a bit of marketing here and there works then just say it. These supposed new fans need something to attract them to the club. At the minute that's neither marquee signings, style of football etc

Leeds are more well known world wide and more spoken about that Burnley even when Leeds were in the championship.

That's because for years the narrative has been pushed that they're a big successful team.
The reality is they aren't that successful, but it didn't matter because people believed the hype.

The football can be changed, Dyche has proven he can do it with the right players.
The owners have two fronts to work on that are intertwined.

Revenue to invest into the club and better players so we can play better football.

[KateR]

OK, I'll leave it there. While people persist with the delusional nonsense that a debt from ALK is as good as cash, or even worse an 'improvement in the overall business', there really is no point engaging.

while you're leaving it there I will try to add some perspective to what I am trying to say and also to point what DJ81 is saying and I will try two ways for you to think about and to engage from an informed position rather than an entrenched one you and others seem to be in.

I do business, I have worked for fortune 500 companies, I had a 10% ownership of a small company into which I put my own hard earned cash because the cash was doing nothing.

Today, we personally own our home out right, no mortgage, we manage to save every month, there are investments I can't touch and there is cash in the bank, the cash makes little to no interest and when measured against inflation it is losing money.

I, just me have found a business proposition, I want to buy it because I think I can make it better and earn more money from it that what the present owners are doing. Therefore, we have applied for a loan and we have been accepted for a loan amount that is worth/valued at 80% of our home, I am seriously considering this and going through details with the lender, I will also have to add to that 90% of the free cash we have in the bank.

At the end of the day this means we take on some serious risk, it's my idea and of course hubby is on the deed as joint owner with me therefore he needs to sign off on it for it to happen, he would never do this himself or even bring it up as he is naturally more cautious than I am, so I have had to sell the idea to him. Bottom line is, we will go into substantial debt, take over a business neither of us has done before, added risk.

I keep asking myself is it worth it to make this move and the answer keeps coming back yes it is in order to try and ensure a higher base for when I retire plus I'll help with the business, for a long time we worked to the aim of paying off the mortgage and not having to worry about that as a monthly outgoing.

This in itself is not an exact analogy to ALK & BFC but it is in terms of money in the bank, well I think so.

In regard to much of the chatter above, think about what might happen if:
We buy a US young player, a S Korean young player or a few other countries, it has been proven that even a single player can attract lot's of fans and purchases from places we have little to no basis in.

Marketing can make a huge difference and while the previous owners did well and there was cash little to no money was spent on bringing new fans or corporate funding to BFC, this is a strong point for the new owners. That is why as DJ81 says you need to look at the big picture and not be myopic in looking at what BFC has traditionally been for the last decade, let's face it, they were getting a lot of abuse for having no ambition and for not spending.

I am not trying to lecture but trying to engage, I understand what you see but in order to engage you have to see the other person's point of view and not dismiss them as nonsense just because they don't align with yours. In no way shape or form am I saying what I think they want to do will work but since it has happened, we should give them sometime to prove it out, it will be a journey and not a step change.

[DomBFC1882]

Leeds are more well known world wide and more spoken about that Burnley even when Leeds were in the championship.

That's because for years the narrative has been pushed that they're a big successful team.
The reality is they aren't that successful, but it didn't matter because people believed the hype.

The football can be changed, Dyche has proven he can do it with the right players.
The owners have two fronts to work on that are intertwined.

Revenue to invest into the club and better players so we can play better football.

Tbf Leeds were in the champions league which is fantastic marketing in itself.

I admire you're optimism I genuinely do, I just can't see where millions and millions of pounds of extra revenue are coming from as DCwat has said

[jrgbfc]

I think a lot of the items you’ve mentioned, whilst they would all be great, would predominantly benefit the everyday or visiting fan. That’s certainly no bad thing, but I don’t see it pulling in the sort of sums we are talking about needing to achieve.

That’s not to say that we shouldn’t do them and it’s not to say that I’m right - we might bring in huge sums. I just don’t see it from ticket deals, earlier shirt releases or improved food offerings. What I would say is that doing lots of smaller things well will certainly do us no harm, helping to improve perception of us as a brand.

There’s no denying that the website, shop and app offerings aren’t great. That’s an area we have to improve in order to make the most of any interest from further afield. Perhaps driven by overseas trips, as you say.

I don’t know how much of an untapped market there is out there when it comes to foreign countries. You certainly see Liverpool and United being swamped with supporters on foreign trips to China and the like, perhaps there’s a slice of that pie, but that’s a pie that’ll take a lot of cooking.

I’m blatantly not a marketing expert, but I’d think that many of the more global brands would have to look a long way past other options to see Burnley as an appealing and viable partnership. They’re after the clubs that they know will have the bigger viewing figures.

Now, the how we might get to those sort of levels (assuming they are attainable) is the interesting bit. How do we attract a greater audience and in turn obtain bigger sponsorship deals to increase revenue?

We need a better product that appeals or be everyone’s favourite underdog. Quite how we do that, I don’t know but we’ll certainly need to invest significantly in the team. Where is that investment coming from ahead of the bigger deals and greater fan base that we are aiming for?

We could get Paul Fletcher back with his megaphone to try and drive people into the clubshop on matchdays.

[GodIsADeeJay81]

I think a lot of the items you’ve mentioned, whilst they would all be great, would predominantly benefit the everyday or visiting fan. That’s certainly no bad thing, but I don’t see it pulling in the sort of sums we are talking about needing to achieve.

That’s not to say that we shouldn’t do them and it’s not to say that I’m right - we might bring in huge sums. I just don’t see it from ticket deals, earlier shirt releases or improved food offerings. What I would say is that doing lots of smaller things well will certainly do us no harm, helping to improve perception of us as a brand.

There’s no denying that the website, shop and app offerings aren’t great. That’s an area we have to improve in order to make the most of any interest from further afield. Perhaps driven by overseas trips, as you say.

I don’t know how much of an untapped market there is out there when it comes to foreign countries. You certainly see Liverpool and United being swamped with supporters on foreign trips to China and the like, perhaps there’s a slice of that pie, but that’s a pie that’ll take a lot of cooking.

I’m blatantly not a marketing expert, but I’d think that many of the more global brands would have to look a long way past other options to see Burnley as an appealing and viable partnership. They’re after the clubs that they know will have the bigger viewing figures.

Now, the how we might get to those sort of levels (assuming they are attainable) is the interesting bit. How do we attract a greater audience and in turn obtain bigger sponsorship deals to increase revenue?

We need a better product that appeals or be everyone’s favourite underdog. Quite how we do that, I don’t know but we’ll certainly need to invest significantly in the team. Where is that investment coming from ahead of the bigger deals and greater fan base that we are aiming for?

We are in the most marketed league in the world.
We should be able to attract a better quality of advertisers for TM than local businesses.
That's just for starters.

We are one of 20 teams in this league and we have advertising spots that can be seen by millions around the world on an almost weekly basis, yet we will have small local businesses taking up prime spots, it's time to stop being all for eyed about local businesses, they won't and don't make us enough money.

One of my bosses always said look after the pennies and the pounds will look after themselves.
In this instance the pennies (the basics) haven't been looked after so the pounds aren't bothered about coming here.

Someone else mentioned the tech that our owners plan to use and appeared to dismiss it but it works perfectly well at Brentford.

Fans on here bemoan the lack of physical scouts after Howe etc, but Brentford use Tech along with people, we should be looking to emulate them, we are a league above them ffs.

[GodIsADeeJay81]

Tbf Leeds were in the champions league which is fantastic marketing in itself.

I admire you're optimism I genuinely do, I just can't see where millions and millions of pounds of extra revenue are coming from as DCwat has said

They then spent virtually a generation outside of the top flight after that absolutely hysterical financial collapse though and still they got more airtime and were talked about more than us when we were in the PL.
That's because of decades of narrative being pushed about them being some sort of giant of English football...

You can't see it because you don't want to, guessing it's outside of your comfort zone.

[BurnleyFC]

and how do we do that without significant investment into the playing side? money ALK doesn't have.

We could always borrow money off Mike Garlick and John B at very preferential rates.