Today's Game

[Clarets4me]

Absolute joke for the last three penalties, where was Sterling ?

[NewClaret]

The very best is that referee imo

Class above anything I’ve seen in a long time. Got every call right, I thought.

[boatshed bill]

Overall they were tactically the better team, though we did play better than them in the first half. Bringing two young lads on in the last minute to take penalties was a nonsense. The last three penalty attempts for us were awful, wrong choice of penalty takers.

Even in the first half the possession stats were 65-35 in favour of Italy, plus 6-1 on goal efforts.

[IWOODLOVETT]

2 shots on goal all game, Home ground, 60,000 fans, easy passage to the final, the over-hyped bubble has burst.
Not good enough. Well done Italy.

[KRBFC]

Class above anything I’ve seen in a long time. Got every call right, I thought.

The use of VAR was refreshing or should I say, lack of. The PL has a bunch of spineless referees who don't let the game flow at all, there's nothing worse than watching football with a whistle happy referee.

[KRBFC]

Even in the first half the possession stats were 65-35 in favour of Italy, plus 6-1 on goal efforts.

We were 1-0 up, why does possession stats matter? Have you watched Burnley? 6-1 in goal efforts maybe but England were the better side first half.

[RVclaret]

Gutted. Not going to go at Southgate as we’ve got this far but felt he got most of the big decisions wrong tonight.

[Funkydrummer]

Would love to know what Trippier was saying to Southgate at the end. Didn’t look happy.

" Gareth, ..... Gary, .... oi Gaz, WTF"

[joey13]

The very best is that referee imo

So what about the challenge on Grealish then ?
Straight red

[joey13]

Class above anything I’ve seen in a long time. Got every call right, I thought.

Clearly you missed the challenge on Grealish

[boatshed bill]

We were 1-0 up, why does possession stats matter? Have you watched Burnley? 6-1 in goal efforts maybe but England were the better side first half.

Because they were gaining control, and protecting their "aging central defenders" (how many times have I read and heard that comment this week?)

Anyhow, we should all be really happy for the breweries who have made a fortune while rate payers have footed the bill for policing the mobs and the clean-up operation

[willsclarets]

I've been a defender of Southgate, but he got it badly wrong tonight. Essentially we went 1-0 up, and sh*t our pants. It was clear as day by half time we needed to change things, and he did nothing. Mount was atrocious all night and stayed on far too long, Sterling wasn't at it, and the formation wasn't working second half. Saka has potential but he's miles behind Grealish or Sancho.
It was basically a repeat of Croatia in the semi final of the world cup, the inevitability of the equaliser was painful to watch.

[KRBFC]

So what about the challenge on Grealish then ?
Straight red

I thought it was a red too, I can see why it was a yellow though, Jorginho wasn't high with the tackle, it was the sidewards angle of Grealish that made Jorginho make contact with the knee area.

[Leisure]

Was it too much to ask that our players keep their medals around their necks after they were presented with them ?
Most of them showed disrespect in my opinion. A Final losers medal should still be something to be proud of .

Totally agree with this. Obviously they were disappointed to have lost but the disrespect shown was very poor!

[tiger76]

Clearly you missed the challenge on Grealish

So did the VAR official, was there even a check?

[Darthlaw]

Aye first decent side we played!

We lost a penalty shootout, it's a 50/50 thing, it is what it is. Devastated

Remind me of the result. Yes, the first decent side we played.

Croatia, Czechia, Ukraine, Denmark.

Even A lacklustre Germany don’t even get near this Italy side, bo matter how much you don’t want to admit it.

[bfcjg]

Sorry, BIMHO Southgate is to defensive, to cautious and perhaps to naive. The Italian defence were never tested, Kane was isolated, Mancini out thought him, his squad was to weighted towards defensive midfielders Harvey Barnes should have been included as a plan B but hey ho we lost to a better team, just annoying that we could and should have won if we'd have gone for the jugular and their goal would have been a token gesture.

[Vintage Claret]

For what it's worth, my take on it is that over the 120 mins, Italy were the better side overall however that counts for nothing once it gets to penalties.

To miss 3 out of 5 pens when the Manager appears to have hand picked those 3 to take them and made subs and adjusted tactics accordingly is a bit of an own goal after getting everything else tactically right prior to that

[BabylonClaret]

Trouble is Sterling has been one of our key matchwinners so you can't hook him really. But agree Mount was awful. I'd have had Grealish for Mount at 55-60 pencilled in at half time anyway.

[ClaretMat]

The German ref was the standout for me and I was surprised he didnt get the final.
Should have been a red for the challenge on Graelish tonight, you go for that with a flick, not studs down.
Overall though, the officiating has been so, so much better to the prem with the allowance of physicality and dismissal of play acting. The games have flowed so much better and have been far more enjoyable for it.

[Rileybobs]

Italy weren’t creating a great deal so I could see why we thought we may be able to see the game out at 1-0, and on another day we would have. I did think our slightly negative mindset would leave us in big trouble after the equaliser but we regained composure and had the better of extra time without creating enough.

Penalties are always a toss of a coin, but having taken the advantage with the first miss we were in a position where 3 good penalty kicks (as it turns out 2 would have been enough in the end) would win the tournament. Rashford totally misread the room with his ‘clever’ attempt, and his bad miss shifted momentum. Presumably Saka and Sancho are proven strong penalty takers in training but they both completely went against what they must do in practice by taking penalties that are always saved when the keeper guesses right. They effectively handed the goalkeeper the advantage. All we had to do was smash three shots as hard as we could somewhere down the middle of the goal and we’d have been lifting the trophy. Small margins.

On reflection a very positive tournament from an impressive group of players and coaches. Let’s hope we can carry this into the next World Cup and we have more big nights like we have enjoyed this summer.

[Rileybobs]

Remind me of the result. Yes, the first decent side we played.

Croatia, Czechia, Ukraine, Denmark.

Even A lacklustre Germany don’t even get near this Italy side, bo matter how much you don’t want to admit it.

Saying that Italy are the first decent side we’ve played is utter b0llocks.

[boatshed bill]

It's funny what people see, and what forms their opinions.

Rice: won the ball on numerous occasions for sure, but all too often just dribbled with it until tackled.
Sterling: won the ball no times at all, but dribbled with it until tackled.

Reminded me of schoolboy football.

[NewClaret]

I've been a defender of Southgate, but he got it badly wrong tonight. Essentially we went 1-0 up, and sh*t our pants. It was clear as day by half time we needed to change things, and he did nothing. Mount was atrocious all night and stayed on far too long, Sterling wasn't at it, and the formation wasn't working second half. Saka has potential but he's miles behind Grealish or Sancho.
It was basically a repeat of Croatia in the semi final of the world cup, the inevitability of the equaliser was painful to watch.

Totally agree, particularly about Mount being poor and Saka being a million miles off Sancho/Grealish.

Also thought he took the wrong holding midfielder off as Rice (who I’m not a fan of) was having a brilliant game and Phillips looked dead on his feet.

[KRBFC]

Remind me of the result. Yes, the first decent side we played.

Croatia, Czechia, Ukraine, Denmark.

Even A lacklustre Germany don’t even get near this Italy side, bo matter how much you don’t want to admit it.

You make yourself sound stupid saying that's the first decent side we played.

Germany are a very good national side.
Denmark are a top 10 ranked national side.
Czech beat Holland.
Croatia pushed Spain all the way and were WC finalists.
We drew with Italy over 120 minutes.

Italy were probably the best side in the tournament in the end, I thought it was a tight game. Coming on here whining with hindsight after England lose a final

[CrosspoolClarets]

At the start of the tournament I said Southgate wasn’t good enough and would show a lack of judgement. I feel that happened today, like in 2018 after a similarly easy run. Too negative, stayed on the back foot after 15 mins, even after they scored. Pragmatism is often fear in disguise. I say that about Dyche at times (not all the time), I feel I know it when I see it.

Then the pens. Far too few takers who have ever taken pens. Saka - never taken them, why did he get the crucial high pressure one? An obvious judgement error by GS.

Gary Lineker said will people think Mancini outcoached him. All I would say to that is can we imagine Gareth getting the Man City job? Never.

He has reformed the England setup to his credit, all the way up. He would make a great FA footballing director.

EDIT: I have had another thought about judgement - regarding the lack of penalty experience in the squad. It adds to the questions about why some players like White were chosen and not someone like Ings, to bring on at these moments. Vardy too. No way can we expect a kid to suddenly become Messi.

[willsclarets]

You can say they weren't creating a great deal, but to me watching it, it felt the most inevitable thing in the world they would score. Don't want to be too harsh because we've done really well this tournament, but feels like a chance wasted especially with the talent we had say on the bench.

[Boss Hogg]

Those young lads should not have taken penalties. Rashford’s was just awful. Grealish should have been on for Mount way earlier. That’s a good Italian side though and we took them the whole way.

[Jakubclaret]

Remind me of the result. Yes, the first decent side we played.

Croatia, Czechia, Ukraine, Denmark.

Even A lacklustre Germany don’t even get near this Italy side, bo matter how much you don’t want to admit it.

Definitely the best side we played by far, the rest we edged past apart from Ukraine who were poor, we was fortunate against the Danes & the muller miss, why he choose them penalty takers in such a high pressure game is beyond me.

[Iloveyoubrady]

Sorry what?
Why not in the squad?

Has potential but simply not good enough. Grealish is miles ahead. So is foden and sancho, even rashford. Can not understand why he has played.

[Darthlaw]

Germany lost to north Macedonia in the buildup
Denmark are a top 10 ranked national side. Just like Switzerland were #1 not long ago
Czech beat a poor Holland.
Croatia pushed Spain all the way and were WC finalists. In other history, Uruguay won the World Cup in 1950.
We stayed in the game with Italy over 118 minutes.

Italy were the best side in the tournament.

Helped you out there.

You’re devotion is admirable, if misguided,

[boatshed bill]

I wonder, do players volunteer to take pens in a shoot out?

[mdd2]

Two late subs to take penalties and they both miss

[GodIsADeeJay81]

Has potential but simply not good enough. Grealish is miles ahead. So is foden and sancho, even rashford. Can not understand why he has played.

He's done well when played though.
I agree Sancho wasn't utilised enough, but we made it to the final without him, or the others doing a great deal.

[addisclaret]

Terrific tournament but they came up well short tonight. Whether it was nerves or more likely a well drilled Italian side, it was still a good effort overall but seemed to be lacking any sort of cutting edge after the first 20 minutes.

As a tournament overall though it has been quite enjoyable and there have been some terrific games. Hard to explain to my middle son though that he may well be in his 70's before he sees us in a final again. Let's hope not.

[PeterWilton]

Totally agree, particularly about Mount being poor and Saka being a million miles off Sancho/Grealish.

Also thought he took the wrong holding midfielder off as Rice (who I’m not a fan of) was having a brilliant game and Phillips looked dead on his feet.

Rice was exhausted. Had a brilliant game but it came at the price of him not being able to last 120 mins (or even 90 as it turns out).

[Iloveyoubrady]

He's done well when played though.
I agree Sancho wasn't utilised enough, but we made it to the final without him, or the others doing a great deal.

Yes - we made the final, but we weren’t overly challenged by anyone we played along the way. In the final we clearly have a better squad on paper than Italy but we don’t play the right 11 and lose.

[Vegas Claret]

The very best is that referee imo

not for me, no idea how Italy weren't reduced to 10 tbh. I find the Spanish guy Antonio Mateu Lahoz better

[NewClaret]

Right, I’m off to bed.

Will just point out the obvious: the reason we didn’t win is we didn’t have Pope in nets. He’d have saved 4.

[KRBFC]

Helped you out there.

You’re devotion is admirable, if misguided,

You clearly don't know anything about football if you don't think Denmark/Germany are decent sides. I'm not claiming they're better than Italy because they aren't but they're absolutely decent sides. Unless you just don't understand the definition of decent. By the nonsense you're typing, Italy are the only decent side at the tournament.

[kentonclaret]

Yes - we made the final, but we weren’t overly challenged by anyone we played along the way. In the final we clearly have a better squad on paper than Italy but we don’t play the right 11 and lose.

Playing 6 out of the 7 tournament matches at Wembley, and with minimal travelling compared to some of the other nations, England would have been fully expected to beat teams such as Czechoslovakia and Croatia without being over extended. In the semi-final and final we benefitted from huge home support but unfortunately just couldn't get over the line tonight.

[KRBFC]

Hopefully i'm still alive to see England play in another final.

[GodIsADeeJay81]

Yes - we made the final, but we weren’t overly challenged by anyone we played along the way. In the final we clearly have a better squad on paper than Italy but we don’t play the right 11 and lose.

Can only beat what's in front of you.
Now you're whinging cos we had an easy route, but if we'd won you wouldn't give a toss.

Some of you just need to give it a rest tonight.

We should be proud of the team, they actually looked like a team and were so so close to bringing home a trophy, closer than any England team since 66.
The world cup is next year and these lads will be a better team for it, but a S/Final followed by a Final is something to be proud of.

[KRBFC]

Can only beat what's in front of you.
Now you're whinging cos we had an easy route, but if we'd won you wouldn't give a toss.

Some of you just need to give it a rest tonight.

We should be proud of the team, they actually looked like a team and were so so close to bringing home a trophy, closer than any England team since 66.
The world cup is next year and these lads will be a better team for it, but a S/Final followed by a Final is something to be proud of.

Italy are a better side than I thought they would be at the start, we pushed them all the way to penalties, absolutely no shame in that. Immense progress under Southgate overall, shitty way to lose but I can't fault Southgate or the players at all, especially not based on the lottery penalty shootout. People are criticizing choice of takers/running up style/time on pitch but their argument is completely null because Jorginho is a penalty master, was on the pitch for 120 minutes and missed Harry Maguire scored the best penalty of them all and Rashford (a normal pen taker) missed.

We were well in that tournament until the very very end, the first time I can say that in my lifetime and hopefully not the last.

[Spijed]

When you look at the limits of Rice and Phillips in comparison to the Italian midfield is it any wonder that England were on the back foot for so much of the game?

[Cirrus_Minor]

Created little after the goal and cannot score more than two penalties.

[KRBFC]

When you look at the limits of Rice and Phillips in comparison to the Italian midfield is it any wonder that England were on the back foot for so much of the game?

Yeah we lack options in midfield, we lack world class. I thought Henderson was gash tbh. A Paul Scholes/Carrick/Gerrard/Lampard would fit into this team wonderfully. A midfield two of Leeds United and West Ham aren't scaring anyone, as well as they did, they're the best we have.

[Vegas Claret]

When you look at the limits of Rice and Phillips in comparison to the Italian midfield is it any wonder that England were on the back foot for so much of the games

Rice was outstanding

The mistake was not replacing Mount (who did nothing) with Grealish after 60 minutes

[boatshed bill]

Yeah we lack options in midfield, we lack world class. I thought Henderson was gash tbh. A Paul Scholes/Carrick/Gerrard/Lampard would fit into this team wonderfully. A midfield two of Leeds United and West Ham aren't scaring anyone, as well as they did, they're the best we have.

You may be able to explain this:
When GS made his tactical change, what was the intention behind it? I genuinely didn't understand it, and Chiesa loved it.

[Vegas Claret]

one thing for sure is if you can't keep the ball in the heat of Qatar you might as well not go. Time to build the team around Grealish