its obvious we are dropping

Stayingup · Post by **Stayingup** » Fri Dec 31, 2021 10:55 am

Tall Paul wrote: ↑
Fri Dec 31, 2021 10:07 am
If it looked likely they wouldn't be unexpected.

It is a great plearure when we beat a top team. This season it looks unlikely we will. But what worried me more was our inability to beat Norwich at home.

warksclaret · Post by **warksclaret** » Fri Dec 31, 2021 11:02 am

THe big question is-can we step up a level, because for a bottom three we have been playing pretty well. However stepping up the next level is making and taking more chances, whilst the defence continues to operate pretty resolutely as it has all year. WE are very quick to capitalise on mistakes, but at times its blinding goals that have beaten us as we saw from McTominey last night, and Sancho attacking us. In fact I could see all our 4 strikers missing the goal Ronaldo scored as it came off the post. My worry is the longer the team continue to play without a win, the more confidence and belief will come under pressure. Big job for SD

ClaretAndJew · Post by **ClaretAndJew** » Fri Dec 31, 2021 11:06 am

That table on page 1 is grim reading. The literal worst points per game team in the entirety of the football league in 2021.

tiger76 · Post by **tiger76** » Fri Dec 31, 2021 11:06 am

Stayingup wrote: ↑
Fri Dec 31, 2021 10:49 am
As you know what I mean is I think we will not be dishing out bloody noses to the top teams. That is unlikely.

Anything clubs of our stature can nick against the top teams has to be seen as a bonus, where we've shot ourselves in the foot is failing to amass wins against our fellow strugglers.

However despite all the negativity ATM, we do still have plenty of games to preserve our PL status.

Equally we have to start winning, and preferably Sunday would be an ideal time to start.

ElectroClaret · Post by **ElectroClaret** » Fri Dec 31, 2021 11:36 am

tiger76 wrote: ↑
Fri Dec 31, 2021 11:06 am
...where we've shot ourselves in the foot is failing to amass wins against our fellow strugglers.

This is the nub of this seasons problems.
And the main failing has been the pretty dreadful finishing we've come up with. Our defending on the whole isn't bad, our back line is good.
Its not the games against the likes of Man U that are going to define our season, but as said, the games against those around us.
Our finishing simply has to improve when we play those sides, ideally by a very good striker coming in next month, and a good midfielder to complement him.

Here's hoping.

claret2018 · Post by **claret2018** » Fri Dec 31, 2021 11:50 am

Everyone keeps saying we will be fine if we can start converting more chances.

We obviously can’t convert chances because we’ve spent the last 12 months absolutely failing to do so. Why is this going to change all of a sudden?

Tall Paul · Post by **Tall Paul** » Fri Dec 31, 2021 11:53 am

Stayingup wrote: ↑
Fri Dec 31, 2021 10:49 am
As you know what I mean is I think we will not be dishing out bloody noses to the top teams. That is unlikely.

But it's always been unlikely, that's why it's unexpected

RVclaret · Post by **RVclaret** » Fri Dec 31, 2021 11:54 am

claret2018 wrote: ↑
Fri Dec 31, 2021 11:50 am
Everyone keeps saying we will be fine if we can start converting more chances.

We obviously can’t convert chances because we’ve spent the last 12 months absolutely failing to do so. Why is this going to change all of a sudden?

Probably relies on Cornet being available and Wood finding a purple patch that he usually has once a season

Jakubclaret · Post by **Jakubclaret** » Fri Dec 31, 2021 11:55 am

dsr wrote: ↑
Fri Dec 31, 2021 10:55 am
Chelsea away?

Which was only 1 point it’s possible that the teams in & around could do the same & maybe better & who else this season apart from Chelsea have we picked up when not expected? Apart that 1 away result we did ok but that’s offset with drawing against Norwich & palace ect at home. Nothing is consistently followed up.

Quickenthetempo · Post by **Quickenthetempo** » Fri Dec 31, 2021 12:08 pm

If we had scored 3 last night they would simply kept attacking and scored 7.
We are a poor defensive unit who are easy to walk through.
Unless we go all out defence and not bother attacking.

Vegas Claret · Post by **Vegas Claret** » Fri Dec 31, 2021 12:08 pm

jedi_master wrote: ↑
Fri Dec 31, 2021 9:11 am
I thought we were down after the double header of Wolves and Newcastle. Whichever way I did a realistic points prediction (and that's all it ever is) for our remaining games this season, I saw that as a pair of games we needed four points from. We got one and lost the crucial six pointer against Newcastle.

We remain only one win from safety (for now), but show no signs of winning a game sadly. If Watford beat Spurs and we don't beat Leeds (which is an entirely plausible scenario, let's be honest) then we would be cut too far adrift and I think at that point there would be a more widespread acceptance of our fate. It's not that it's 'impossible' to get out of our situation, it's that we are showing no signs to imply that we have it within us to turn this around. The form is terminal, and one win this season is indefensible. Our key players are not showing the form we need of them such as Wood and Westwood, and our only creativity in Cornet has barely been available and is shortly going away for a month to Africa. Our fate could (and probably will be with our upcoming fixtures) sealed by the point he returns. The postponed games killed us right when we needed them, as I really feel we could have beaten Watford and Everton with their injuries (INJURIES, not Covid) - that could have acted as a springboard and got us some points on the board and out of the relegation zone before the upcoming slate of horrific games (which we are likely to lose the lot of).

We are then left with a January window where we will need to be very careful what we do. I am nervous over us spending any more money considering what almost seems a foregone conclusion. Indeed, there is even going to have to be a bit of perspective shown when it comes to flogging Tarky if we are 8-10 points adrift from 17th coming towards the end of January - including to Newcastle. We need to start at that point to show some perspective and begin to think of preparing our finances for relegation.

This is incredibly negative for a New Years Eve post, so I apologise for that! I generally try to be realistic, this isn't 'The Sky is Falling', just what I see when I look at the games we have left I am afraid.

I agree with all of that.

Shaggy · Post by **Shaggy** » Fri Dec 31, 2021 12:10 pm

Absolute bottom of the PPG for 12 months we really should be potting Dyche. He would have been sacked at any other premier league club by now.

We need new ideas and some serious incomings pronto.

arise_sir_charge · Post by **arise_sir_charge** » Fri Dec 31, 2021 12:15 pm

The one thing that confuses me is the notion that spending money in January is a risk, it implies that as soon we spend say £15m on a player that players value immediately becomes zero.

Anyone we buy at that money would in all likelihood have a good sell on value should the need arise.

We have enough players of value within the squad to plug financial gaps should the worst happen.

tarkys_ears · Post by **tarkys_ears** » Fri Dec 31, 2021 12:17 pm

Quickenthetempo wrote: ↑
Fri Dec 31, 2021 12:08 pm
If we had scored 3 last night they would simply kept attacking and scored 7.
We are a poor defensive unit who are easy to walk through.
Unless we go all out defence and not bother attacking.

Utd were so bad last night, like our Newcastle game, the worst team was us.

Anyone in the PL would have beaten Newcastle when we played them and any team would have beaten Utd last night.

Newcastleclaret93 · Post by **Newcastleclaret93** » Fri Dec 31, 2021 12:23 pm

arise_sir_charge wrote: ↑
Fri Dec 31, 2021 12:15 pm
The one thing that confuses me is the notion that spending money in January is a risk, it implies that as soon we spend say £15m on a player that players value immediately becomes zero.

Anyone we buy at that money would in all likelihood have a good sell on value should the need arise.

We have enough players of value within the squad to plug financial gaps should the worst happen.

Who in our squad currently sells for more than 20m?

JohnDearyMe · Post by **JohnDearyMe** » Fri Dec 31, 2021 12:25 pm

Newcastleclaret93 wrote: ↑
Fri Dec 31, 2021 12:23 pm
Who in our squad currently sells for more than 20m?

Cornet, Pope & McNeil

Newcastleclaret93 · Post by **Newcastleclaret93** » Fri Dec 31, 2021 12:26 pm

JohnDearyMe wrote: ↑
Fri Dec 31, 2021 12:25 pm
Cornet, Pope & McNeil

So we think Cornets value has gone up by more than 50% after what 7 games?

Pope is a great keeper but who is paying that sort of money for him?

McNeil is a fair shout, but again who’s going to pay 20m for a lad with 1 assist in his last 20 games.

TsarBomba · Post by **TsarBomba** » Fri Dec 31, 2021 12:28 pm

No doubt about it, we are going down.

The wage budget will be slashed, we’ll sell a few of our assets, and hopefully we’ll have enough about us to mount a serious promotion push at the first attempt.

Our complete failure over the past 3-4 years to improve the squad has finally caught up with us.

Credit to Dyche, I think he is trying this season to change a little how we set up and play, but it’s too little too late.

joey13 · Post by **joey13** » Fri Dec 31, 2021 12:28 pm

JohnDearyMe wrote: ↑
Fri Dec 31, 2021 12:25 pm
Cornet, Pope & McNeil

McNeil is nowhere near the 20million mark

JohnDearyMe · Post by **JohnDearyMe** » Fri Dec 31, 2021 12:31 pm

Newcastleclaret93 wrote: ↑
Fri Dec 31, 2021 12:26 pm
So we think Cornets value has gone up by more than 50% after what 7 games?

Pope is a great keeper but who is paying that sort of money for him?

McNeil is a fair shout, but again who’s going to pay 20m for a lad with 1 assist in his last 20 games.

If we were to sell Cornet for less than 20m in January there would be uproar. No question his value will have jumped given his contributions and the fact he has a lengthy contract.

Pope hasn't had a great season but again i think we'd all be disappointed if he went for below 20m given his longer term record and regular presence in the England squad.

McNeil is struggling again this season but we'll see poorer players sold for more than 20m this January I'm sure

Spijed · Post by **Spijed** » Fri Dec 31, 2021 12:31 pm

joey13 wrote: ↑
Fri Dec 31, 2021 12:28 pm
McNeil is nowhere near the 20million mark

Dan James went for silly money and what had he done at Man U.?

Zenwisdom · Post by **Zenwisdom** » Fri Dec 31, 2021 12:35 pm

We lack pace in the defence we made Luke Shaw
Look like Usain Bolt
Utd did enough to win but can’t see them catching City anytime soon .

claret2018 · Post by **claret2018** » Fri Dec 31, 2021 12:39 pm

McNeil has got £12m written all over him.

Pope probably a bit more, who knows with Cornet.

Backofthenet · Post by **Backofthenet** » Fri Dec 31, 2021 12:51 pm

claret2018 wrote: ↑
Fri Dec 31, 2021 12:39 pm
McNeil has got £12m written all over him.

Pope probably a bit more, who knows with Cornet.

Cornet would have to play a lot more games, and score a lot of goals for any club to offer what we would want for him
And if he did do that, we'd probably be staying up.

Mala591 · Post by **Mala591** » Fri Dec 31, 2021 1:00 pm

We need to have a very close (and urgent) look at all the central midfield players in the Scottish Premiership. Purchase budget of £15 million and £60k a week should be tempting for both the club and the right player.

Quickenthetempo · Post by **Quickenthetempo** » Fri Dec 31, 2021 1:00 pm

TsarBomba wrote: ↑
Fri Dec 31, 2021 12:28 pm
No doubt about it, we are going down.

The wage budget will be slashed, we’ll sell a few of our assets, and hopefully we’ll have enough about us to mount a serious promotion push at the first attempt.

Our complete failure over the past 3-4 years to improve the squad has finally caught up with us.

Credit to Dyche, I think he is trying this season to change a little how we set up and play, but it’s too little too late.

Interested to hear what you think Dyche has changed?

We were playing long balls up to Lennon last night.

ecc · Post by **ecc** » Fri Dec 31, 2021 1:02 pm

The club has to decide whether to strengthen in January or face the prospect of relegation. It's as simple as that. You would hope - hope does spring eternal after all - the powers that be have been looking at potential solutions. We will know in a month's time.

Norman · Post by **Norman** » Fri Dec 31, 2021 1:02 pm

Lyon is paying a part of Cornet's wages and we don't know if he has a relegation release clause. I'd be pleasantly surprised if he was with us next season if we were in the Championship.

Ric_C · Post by **Ric_C** » Fri Dec 31, 2021 2:20 pm

Couple of things:

1. Our current squad would absolutely p!ss the Championship

2. Our strikers have let us down big style this season. Cornet has been injured loads, and the rest are either unavailable or out of form.

I do agree it is a very tricky window in January in terms of what we do. I'd personally settle for a couple of decent loans who would improve our1st eleven. We STILL need a right winger and a decent CM to give ourselves a chance of staying up.

And regarding the out of contract 10, I agree only Mee needs retaining

BurnleyFC · Post by **BurnleyFC** » Fri Dec 31, 2021 2:31 pm

TsarBomba wrote: ↑
Fri Dec 31, 2021 12:28 pm
No doubt about it, we are going down.

The wage budget will be slashed, we’ll sell a few of our assets, and hopefully we’ll have enough about us to mount a serious promotion push at the first attempt.

Our complete failure over the past 3-4 years to improve the squad has finally caught up with us.

Credit to Dyche, I think he is trying this season to change a little how we set up and play, but it’s too little too late.

I love Sean Dyche for what he has done for us, but he doesn’t come out of this smelling of roses with the state of the squad.

We were always going to get relegated eventually, but still…

Papabendi · Post by **Papabendi** » Fri Dec 31, 2021 2:40 pm

Ric_C wrote: ↑
Fri Dec 31, 2021 2:20 pm
Couple of things:

1. Our current squad would absolutely p!ss the Championship

would it? It's looking like a big rebuild job to me.

Norman · Post by **Norman** » Fri Dec 31, 2021 2:43 pm

Vydra and JT look to be leaving in the summer. We'd bounce straight back up if we kept the rest of the squad.

Ric_C · Post by **Ric_C** » Fri Dec 31, 2021 2:46 pm

Papabendi, I mean if our current squad played in the championship now.

ElectroClaret · Post by **ElectroClaret** » Fri Dec 31, 2021 2:49 pm

Ric_C wrote: ↑
Fri Dec 31, 2021 2:20 pm
Our current squad would absolutely p!ss the Championship

This.

The quality of the Championship is dire.

The problem, if it comes to the worst and we drop, is keeping the squad together.

Newcastleclaret93 · Post by **Newcastleclaret93** » Fri Dec 31, 2021 2:51 pm

ElectroClaret wrote: ↑
Fri Dec 31, 2021 2:49 pm
This.

The quality of the Championship is dire.

The problem, if it comes to the worst and we drop, is keeping the squad together.

I would love to know why people think this?

Targetman · Post by **Targetman** » Fri Dec 31, 2021 2:54 pm

Norman wrote: ↑
Fri Dec 31, 2021 1:02 pm
Lyon is paying a part of Cornet's wages and we don't know if he has a relegation release clause. I'd be pleasantly surprised if he was with us next season if we were in the Championship.

Where did you get the info from regarding Lyon paying part of Cornet's wages?

ClaretTony · Post by **ClaretTony** » Fri Dec 31, 2021 2:58 pm

Papabendi wrote: ↑
Thu Dec 30, 2021 11:45 pm
Just get with it, and all will be OK. We aren't going to win 8-9 games next year, we are done as a team at this level.
Don't be the addict thinking next time will be different x

Any reason why you felt the need to start this thread given you've posted it elsewhere in the middle of threads.

Spijed · Post by **Spijed** » Fri Dec 31, 2021 3:01 pm

Newcastleclaret93 wrote: ↑
Fri Dec 31, 2021 2:51 pm
I would love to know why people think this?

Probably because Norwich constantly look out of their depth in the Prem yet get promoted from the Championship with ease.

ElectroClaret · Post by **ElectroClaret** » Fri Dec 31, 2021 3:01 pm

Newcastleclaret93 wrote: ↑
Fri Dec 31, 2021 2:51 pm
I would love to know why people think this?

Think what?

Ric_C · Post by **Ric_C** » Fri Dec 31, 2021 3:02 pm

Newcastleclaret93 wrote: ↑
Fri Dec 31, 2021 2:51 pm
I would love to know why people think this?

Can you name 6 teams who would finish above our current squad if we played in the championship this season?

Jakubclaret · Post by **Jakubclaret** » Fri Dec 31, 2021 3:07 pm

Spijed wrote: ↑
Fri Dec 31, 2021 3:01 pm
Probably because Norwich constantly look out of their depth in the Prem yet get promoted from the Championship with ease.

So do West Brom but if you look at the squads ours is far different in terms of age a massive rebuild is required similar to palaces when that exodus started last season before this season the difference being do we have the cash to throw at it. Palace didn’t have the transfer sales outgoing but significantly lowered the wage bill & had the financial backing for incomings.

Norman · Post by **Norman** » Fri Dec 31, 2021 3:09 pm

Ric_C wrote: ↑
Fri Dec 31, 2021 3:02 pm
Can you name 6 teams who would finish above our current squad if we played in the championship this season?

I can't think of 2, nevermind 6. Newcastle would buy promotion if they went down with us. But that's about it.

ClaretAL · Post by **ClaretAL** » Fri Dec 31, 2021 3:20 pm

I think Dyche disagrees.....

https://www.skysports.com/watch/video/s ... ll-stay-up

Norman · Post by **Norman** » Fri Dec 31, 2021 3:25 pm

ClaretAL wrote: ↑
Fri Dec 31, 2021 3:20 pm
I think Dyche disagrees.....

https://www.skysports.com/watch/video/s ... ll-stay-up

Surprising. I thought he'd come out and say we're going down

buzzclarets79 · Post by **buzzclarets79** » Fri Dec 31, 2021 3:31 pm

The table on page one of the 2021 pts haul is more than worrying, there’s not many clubs that would then give the manager a 4yr deal….

This could be the year that we do drop, but the number of OOC players in 2022 means I don’t think it’ll be the financial disaster it could of been.

A back four of:- Roberts, Collins, Mee, Taylor would be more than capable in the championship. Would also like to see Bobby Thomas used.

Midfield:- This is the worry, but Brownhill and Westwood I think be ok. Bring in two wingers as McNeil will leave.

Strikers:- Keep Wood and maybe it’s time for Richardson to break through and get some game time.

Dare say McNeil, Tarks, Cornet & Pope will all leave along with the OOC players.

Norman · Post by **Norman** » Fri Dec 31, 2021 3:33 pm

buzzclarets79 wrote: ↑
Fri Dec 31, 2021 3:31 pm
The table on page one of the 2021 pts haul is more than worrying, there’s not many clubs that would then give the manager a 4yr deal….

This could be the year that we do drop, but the number of OOC players in 2022 means I don’t think it’ll be the financial disaster it could of been.

A back four of:- Roberts, Collins, Mee, Taylor would be more than capable in the championship. Would also like to see Bobby Thomas used.

Midfield:- This is the worry, but Brownhill and Westwood I think be ok. Bring in two wingers as McNeil will leave.

Strikers:- Keep Wood and maybe it’s time for Richardson to break through and get some game time.

Dare say McNeil, Tarks, Cornet & Pope will all leave along with the OOC players.

I think it depends on the contract with Cornet.
As Lyon are paying some of his wages will that continue in his second year?
Does he have a release clause?

ClaretAndJew · Post by **ClaretAndJew** » Fri Dec 31, 2021 3:34 pm

Cornet is our player, how are Lyon still paying some of his wages?

Norman · Post by **Norman** » Fri Dec 31, 2021 3:39 pm

ClaretAndJew wrote: ↑
Fri Dec 31, 2021 3:34 pm
Cornet is our player, how are Lyon still paying some of his wages?

How or why? I've no idea why, but guess it's because they needed upfront cash and wanted some of his wages off the bill and this was the only way. No idea on the % but been told from several sources that Lyon are paying a part of it.

tiger76 · Post by **tiger76** » Fri Dec 31, 2021 3:41 pm

ClaretAL wrote: ↑
Fri Dec 31, 2021 3:20 pm
I think Dyche disagrees.....

https://www.skysports.com/watch/video/s ... ll-stay-up

Good! I'm glad he still has faith in the squad, unlike many posters on here who've already thrown in the towel seemingly.

SkiptonClaret · Post by **SkiptonClaret** » Fri Dec 31, 2021 3:41 pm

KRBFC wrote: ↑
Fri Dec 31, 2021 8:43 am
I mean which of the 10 are you keeping? Mee maybe?

Rodriguez, Vydra, Barnes, Bardsley, Pieters, Stephens, Cork, Lennon.

I don't think any of them are good enough, young enough, cheap enough. Quite frankly I don't think any of them are deserving of a new deal either, I'd rather we looked to the future than hand out short term contracts to players we know are past it.

Problem is that SD will want to keep the majority of those players.