Any news on Ben Mee ?

[Rileybobs]

Lots of people quite rightly praise Kompanys purported data driven approach to football (an approach Dyche had).
If you actually look at the data the idea that Ben Mee can't play football well is a total myth. I could post an in-depth analysis but I'll just limit to- going off FBRef data he's ahead of Tarkowski this season, and across every season since 17-18 (when the data goes back to) for passing accuracy, progressive distance gained, successful passing through the back and middle third, ball retention, progressive ball carries, adjusted per 90 minutes (bit of a disparity in match time, but been on absolutes he's ahead on some). He's behind on long passes both attempted and completed which puts him fractionally behind on assists and shot creation per 90 (to the tune of roughly 1 fewer assist every 100 games).
On defensive actions he's usually ahead too, behind this season on everything (except mistakes- Tarks has made more mistakes leading to shots) which is a rare exception, but even his supposed bad season of 18-19 he had an astonishingly high 68% success rate on 1v1 tackles with dribblers.
On Sofascore it's a similar picture they use slightly different metrics, but his heatmaps put him further forward and wider.
He's actually the better player than Tarkowski at slower, back third and midfield buildup play and shorter passing. He's marginally worse at long balls up top from the back but still advances possession better.
But I'm sure people will say you can just prove anything with stats, so going purely off the eye test I can think of a few occasions he's actually skinned a player- Chelsea and Leicester come to mind.
His limitations are grossly exaggerated.

Interesting points thanks. And whilst I wouldn’t go as far to agree that he’s a better player than Tarkowski, I do agree that he is underrated as a player and his limitations are exaggerated.

[gawthorpe_view]

I wonder if there’s a football pitch which straddles international time zones?

Brentford.

Apparently.

[spt_claret]

Interesting points thanks. And whilst I wouldn’t go as far to agree that he’s a better player than Tarkowski, I do agree that he is underrated as a player and his limitations are exaggerated.

The reality is the stats I'm going off can only be used so far- they're free access thus inherently less useful and more simple than the sort of complex data collected for money by professional analytics services. After all so much of things like pass accuracy, ball carrying, positioning and passing distance depends on where your teammates are and who is receiving your pass, which will affect the result in ways you can't easily account for with open source datasets. So yeah, can't conclusively say "he's better", but the point is more just that off of the data that is available,he's at the least certainly no worse a ball player than Tarkowski, and would appear to outperform him in certain metrics/situations.

[GodIsADeeJay81]

Lots of people quite rightly praise Kompanys purported data driven approach to football (an approach Dyche had).
If you actually look at the data the idea that Ben Mee can't play football well is a total myth. I could post an in-depth analysis but I'll just limit to- going off FBRef data he's ahead of Tarkowski this season, and across every season since 17-18 (when the data goes back to) for passing accuracy, progressive distance gained, successful passing through the back and middle third, ball retention, progressive ball carries, adjusted per 90 minutes (bit of a disparity in match time, but been on absolutes he's ahead on some). He's behind on long passes both attempted and completed which puts him fractionally behind on assists and shot creation per 90 (to the tune of roughly 1 fewer assist every 100 games).
On defensive actions he's usually ahead too, behind this season on everything (except mistakes- Tarks has made more mistakes leading to shots) which is a rare exception, but even his supposed bad season of 18-19 he had an astonishingly high 68% success rate on 1v1 tackles with dribblers.
On Sofascore it's a similar picture they use slightly different metrics, but his heatmaps put him further forward and wider.
He's actually the better player than Tarkowski at slower, back third and midfield buildup play and shorter passing. He's marginally worse at long balls up top from the back but still advances possession better.
But I'm sure people will say you can just prove anything with stats, so going purely off the eye test I can think of a few occasions he's actually skinned a player- Chelsea and Leicester come to mind.
His limitations are grossly exaggerated.

You're on a forum where people claim Pope can't kick a ball, despite the stats proving he's actually pretty good at it, so they're not going to use stats when slating Mee.

[Devils_Advocate]

You're on a forum where people claim Pope can't kick a ball, despite the stats proving he's actually pretty good at it, so they're not going to use stats when slating Mee.

and a forum where people equate a goalkeeper being good with his feet as simply how well he can kick the ball.

[clarethomer]

I'm glad we are seeing that Ben is in talks with a club like Brentford.

if he goes to Brentford, I am sure he will be able to get bigger and better wages than Burnley could offer and will continue to secure financial security for his family.

Great servant, captain and representative of our club.

No point getting in to debates about how capable he would be for Burnley as he isn't a player anymore. Clearly the discussion has taken place in the club which has made the decision that means that Mee now has a chance to be a fantastic professional for them also.

[Spijed]

I'm glad we are seeing that Ben is in talks with a club like Brentford.

if he goes to Brentford, I am sure he will be able to get bigger and better wages than Burnley could offer and will continue to secure financial security for his family.

With all due respect, if he can't already offer financial security with what he's previously earnt in his career then he needs different advice. He's already more wealthy than the vast majority of the public.

[warksclaret]

Hope he gets sorted soon as he will need to get to know his new colleagues pre season and be involved in training and friendlies. Not sure how London will suit him, being native to the North West and having a young family.Doubt he will want to relocate them for the purpose of two years playing

[Wembley09]

Expected him to join Saudi fc and team up with Eddie Howe again.

[fatboy47]

Hope he gets sorted soon as he will need to get to know his new colleagues pre season and be involved in training and friendlies.

Just me that doesn't give a Brad Pitt then?

[tiger76]

Just me that doesn't give a Brad Pitt then?

No it's not just you, happy to salute ex players for their service, but once they've left the building I'm only concerned about those we still have at the club, as they'll be the guys we'll be relying on this season.

[clarethomer]

With all due respect, if he can't already offer financial security with what he's previously earnt in his career then he needs different advice. He's already more wealthy than the vast majority of the public.

With all due respect back - what is your point? Yes he has the earnings to put him in the top % of earners?

Can't I wish him well and be happy that he can continue to work to support his family and build security for his family's future.

Just bizarre someone would take offence to that?

[Rileybobs]

No it's not just you, happy to salute ex players for their service, but once they've left the building I'm only concerned about those we still have at the club, as they'll be the guys we'll be relying on this season.

Pretty sure you’ve followed Arfield’s career since leaving Burnley, for example haven’t you? Nothing wrong with wanting the best for someone who played such a key role at the club over the past decade.

[tiger76]

Pretty sure you’ve followed Arfield’s career since leaving Burnley, for example haven’t you? Nothing wrong with wanting the best for someone who played such a key role at the club over the past decade.

I wish Ben Mee well wherever he ends up, but as a club we now need to move on from that era, and hopefully create new memories and heroes under Vincent Kompany.

Living in Glasgow it's hard not to follow Arfield given the press coverage both old firm sides get in the Scottish media.

[dougcollins]

https://amp.theguardian.com/football/20 ... e-transfer

[Rileybobs]

It is strange that such a poor, over the hill player, who is not capable of gracing our defence is signing for Brentford having turned down offers from two other Premier League clubs.

[ecc]

I'm glad he's gone there and not Riyadh upon Tyne.

[Stayingup]

It is strange that such a poor, over the hill player, who is not capable of gracing our defence is signing for Brentford having turned down offers from two other Premier League clubs.

He obviously relishes relegation dog foghts because he'll very likely be in one with Brentford this coming season.

Nonetheless good luck to Ben.

[Jakubclaret]

No sour grapes from me & from a pure football perspective politics aside I wish him well at his next club.

[boatshed bill]

It is strange that such a poor, over the hill player, who is not capable of gracing our defence is signing for Brentford having turned down offers from two other Premier League clubs.

it's all about money, not his ability.
these are financial decisions by both player and BFC.

[clarethomer]

It is strange that such a poor, over the hill player, who is not capable of gracing our defence is signing for Brentford having turned down offers from two other Premier League clubs.

We have fans who seem to think that the style of play wouldn't suit Mee because all they see and know is what they have seen and known with their own eyes. A more than competent defender who they see could be less than comfortable in a team that wants to play out from the back and dominate possession.

We have fans who seem to think that he does have this in his locker and it's just that those who haven't seen him do it for Burnley are wrong to assume this and that his experience alone should be enough to convince anyone that he should have been retained.

Then we now have the assumptions of both sets of fans above that because Mee has signed for another club this somehow either proves/disproves the view of the person who thinks differently to them and confirms the view that they have had all along.

No one knows whether Mee not being here was down to him or the club and regardless, its a pointless discussion to be having as it's not going to change anything.

Mee has been a great servant, captain and representative of our club. He deserves respect for this alone and I am sure he will be welcomed with applause and gratitude if and when he crosses paths with the club and its fans. To keep arguing over him in this way is just a bit sad and pointless.

[Rileybobs]

We have fans who seem to think that the style of play wouldn't suit Mee because all they see and know is what they have seen and known with their own eyes. A more than competent defender who they see could be less than comfortable in a team that wants to play out from the back and dominate possession.

We have fans who seem to think that he does have this in his locker and it's just that those who haven't seen him do it for Burnley are wrong to assume this and that his experience alone should be enough to convince anyone that he should have been retained.

Then we now have the assumptions of both sets of fans above that because Mee has signed for another club this somehow either proves/disproves the view of the person who thinks differently to them and confirms the view that they have had all along.

No one knows whether Mee not being here was down to him or the club and regardless, its a pointless discussion to be having as it's not going to change anything.

Mee has been a great servant, captain and representative of our club. He deserves respect for this alone and I am sure he will be welcomed with applause and gratitude if and when he crosses paths with the club and its fans. To keep arguing over him in this way is just a bit sad and pointless.

Of course it’s pointless. I’m just showing how daft the idea is that he wasn’t good enough to play for us next season. Him turning down 2 Premier League offers and signing for Brentford backs that up.

[dandeclaret]

Blow me down with a feather duster....... a premier league player, deemed by too many not good enough for Burnley, signs for a premier league club who.... (checks notes)..... play "Attractive football".

I"m shocked I tell you, because he's apparently only fox to be a coach, and not up to championship standard.

[Steve1956]

Blow me down with a feather duster....... a premier league player, deemed by too many not good enough for Burnley, signs for a premier league club who.... (checks notes)..... play "Attractive football".

I"m shocked I tell you, because he's apparently only fox to be a coach, and not up to championship standard.

brilliant.

[bobinho]

With all due respect back - what is your point? Yes he has the earnings to put him in the top % of earners?

Can't I wish him well and be happy that he can continue to work to support his family and build security for his family's future.

Just bizarre someone would take offence to that?

And with all due respect from someone watching from the sidelines, I don’t think he’s taken offence to that. He’s merely suggested that Ben has earned more during his career than most of us will earn in a lifetime, and as a result of that he and his family should already be financially secure for the rest of their lives. And he’s right.

Fair play to Ben if he gets more money elsewhere. Suggesting he’s doing it to become financially secure is what’s bizarre. Unless he’s a complete buffoon, he’s already sorted. Ben always struck me as a clever lad, he’ll be fine even if he hangs his boots up tomorrow.

I wish him all the best in whatever he does next, and I’m happy he played for us and represented our club in the way he did.

But the king is dead….long live the king, whoever that may be.

[clarethomer]

And with all due respect from someone watching from the sidelines, I don’t think he’s taken offence to that. He’s merely suggested that Ben has earned more during his career than most of us will earn in a lifetime, and as a result of that he and his family should already be financially secure for the rest of their lives. And he’s right.

Fair play to Ben if he gets more money elsewhere. Suggesting he’s doing it to become financially secure is what’s bizarre. Unless he’s a complete buffoon, he’s already sorted. Ben always struck me as a clever lad, he’ll be fine even if he hangs his boots up tomorrow.

I wish him all the best in whatever he does next, and I’m happy he played for us and represented our club in the way he did.

But the king is dead….long live the king, whoever that may be.

Must be something In the water around here. Goodness grief.

[AlargeClaret]

Great news and good for him , they’ll face a tough season and the sheer never say die attitude of Mee will be a great asset to them I’m sure .