Next manager

[COBBLE]

Cooper fine. Moyes has respect and could get us up, keep us up, and become D of F in a few years time. With the right structure and people there is no reason, indeed a good reason, to continue the strategy of bringing in young technically good players but efficiently, at a rate that we can play and develop them, and that we can afford.

[CoolClaret]

You named Rice, Paqueta, Kudus and Bowen. Only Rice have they actually sold so the others are hypotheticals (and Paqueta is practically worthless at this moment in time). But sure, I'll play, Sergio Gomez and Lokonga whilst at Anderlecht. Then if we're allowing hypotheticals there's no way we sell Odobert, Muric or Koleosho for anything but a profit. You could also look at what he did to the value of Tella and Maatsen.

I've been very clear about why he's a terrible fit and that's his tactical approach above all - I've given you the statistics to put substance on that. If you want to ignore them because it's "tactico" to say he doesn't coach possession based football when his team ranked 17th last season and 18th the season before then fine, no skin off my nose.

I said Paqeuta because City were about to pull the trigger until the betting allegations came to light.

I'll concede on Gomez- Lokonga a little different seen as he was there for a bit before Kompany signed and even then didn't go for big money to Arsenal.

It doesn't matter if he's not a possession based coach at all. We could easily tweak this side to being a bit more organised and a counter-attacking side with wingers, we quite literally have the players that could do that no problem.

The thing is as well, it goes deeper than just the 'tactics' - I want Moyes (or someone of that calibre) because of what he will bring to the backroom.

As CT and others have alluded to - heck even stuff coming from JBG & Cork - suggests that it isn't quite as hunky dory at Burnley as 'The Arrogant One' would have had you believe. We need a good footballing man that can pull a disjointed squad together and get them performing... I also think that it'd be great for the board to see how another experienced, top manager operates. They're still wet behind the ears and would learn from him, imo.

[Clovius Boofus]

Wrong thread

[Conroy92]

For me we need to take a step backwards in terms of direction. I don't want to see the club turn 180 with it's managerial choice or even 90 but maybe 45. We've flown too close to the sun in my opinion and it's created the biggest disconnect between the club the team and the fans in some time. While I am happy to see a manager in charge in favour of youth and continuing this style of play, we also need to get back to a team that's giving 110percent every week for the manager and that has some grit and determination in there with an ability to mix it up, maybe some added experience.

Based on the above for me Cooper would probably be the best candidate right now although I've got to be honest I'm not sold on him.

[Mattster]

I said Paqeuta because City were about to pull the trigger until the betting allegations came to light.

I'll concede on Gomez- Lokonga a little different seen as he was there for a bit before Kompany signed and even then didn't go for big money to Arsenal.

Lokonga is a bit different because he was there before Kompany but Rice counts for Moyes because reasons. Lokonga was a big fee in terms of Belgian clubs (14th highest at the time).

[CoolClaret]

Lokonga is a bit different because he was there before Kompany but Rice counts for Moyes because reasons. Lokonga was a big fee in terms of Belgian clubs (14th highest at the time).

No, not what I meant but well done on trying to score internet points.

He quite literally turned Rice into a top, top class international and one of the most expensive signings of all time. Vastly differentness.

[Clive 1960]

Pace needs to make sure the next manager isn't a sweet talking guy..

[Superjohnnyfrancis]

Watching west ham a few times last season there not as bad a watch as their fans think and actually winning a European trophy goes a long way.

Their fans come across as pretty deluded to me.

Moyes although not a sexy name manager would be a good fit if he wants to drop down. We need experience of the leagues to move forward again.

I’d give him a fair bit of control over the squad wheeling and dealing , maybe that’s not something Pace wants to do after Kompany though.

[LincsWoldsClaret]

Given the number of nationalities we have, a multi-lingual manager or assistant would be useful.

[Buxtonclaret]

Reckon we need someone with experience.
Can't see Moyes being interested in sorting out the mess we've been left with but, would be happy if he fancied it.
We definitely don't want someone who regards us as a shop window for how good he thinks he is.

[claretspice]

Of the inexperienced options, an interesting left field name might be Jonny Heitinga. Played under Moyes at Everton, but from the Ajax school as player and coach and very highly regarded there (including just under half a season as interim head coach) before joining the West Ham set up last summer. Also played in Germany and at Atletico Madrid. Reportedly on Ipswich's hit list should McKenna move on.

Cooper would remain my choice mind, and either way I'm firmly of the view its time for a director of football.

[RVclaret]

When do we hope a new man is in by, regardless of who?

Given serious planning is required for the squad then I’m thinking 8/9 June latest.

[Rileybobs]

I think we’ve got to look beyond style of play, although obviously that is a consideration both in terms of long term strategy and short term getting the best out of this squad of players. But more importantly is a manager who can galvanise a squad of misfits and a disengaged fanbase.

We need a strong character and above all a good man-manager, something that I really don’t think Kompany is. We don’t have to over-complicate things from a tactical perspective as we should have one of, if not the strongest squad in the Championship next season.

[Bowclaret]

Ben Mee. It’s going to happen one day so why not now ?

Get an old head with him. Ex Clarets back room staff and go for it !

[Murger]

Ben Mee. It’s going to happen one day so why not now ?

Get an old head with him. Ex Clarets back room staff and go for it !

Because he’s still a player.

[Rileybobs]

Ben Mee. It’s going to happen one day so why not now ?

Get an old head with him. Ex Clarets back room staff and go for it !

I’m sure there are plenty of reasons why not, but two off the top of my head…

1.) He plays for Brentford
2.) He’s never managed a game in his life

[gandhisflipflop]

Ben Mee. It’s going to happen one day so why not now ?

Get an old head with him. Ex Clarets back room staff and go for it !

Along with duff I couldn’t think of a more unimaginative appointment

[Bowclaret]

Because he’s still a player.

And what a player - still !

An option at the back for us.

Get him in !

[ksrclaret]

Ben Mee. It’s going to happen one day so why not now ?

Get an old head with him. Ex Clarets back room staff and go for it !

However long the search for a new manager lasts, it’s going to feel a lot longer.

[Swizzlestick]

I have reservations, but Steve Cooper is looking like the most natural fit - he's available therefore ready to start straight away, he's got a team promoted from the Championship, he's dealt with big squads and managed to mould a successful team from it, and he comes across as a good man-manager. He should certainly be on the shortlist at the very least.

[Rileybobs]

I have reservations, but Steve Cooper is looking like the most natural fit - he's available therefore ready to start straight away, he's got a team promoted from the Championship, he's dealt with big squads and managed to mould a successful team from it, and he comes across as a good man-manager. He should certainly be on the shortlist at the very least.

Agree with this, he doesn't get the juices flowing but I think he ticks most boxes.

[Swizzlestick]

Agree with this, he doesn't get the juices flowing but I think he ticks most boxes.

I think if the situation was a little different - happier camp, less bloated squad/player turnover etc - I’d be more inclined towards a more ‘progressive’ appointment like Still or Rosenior, but we need somebody who can get their hands dirty, so to speak, and a steady hand on the tiller (if any of that makes sense!)

[Rileybobs]

I think if the situation was a little different - happier camp, less bloated squad/player turnover etc - I’d be more inclined towards a more ‘progressive’ appointment like Still or Rosenior, but we need somebody who can get their hands dirty, so to speak, and a steady hand on the tiller (if any of that makes sense!)

Yes, this is where I'm at. As I just posted on another thread it seems like we're in a precarious position on and off the pitch, so I would be more inclined to go for a known quantity than a gamble.

[Vegas Claret]

it will all depend if Pace and Co stick to the plan of attracting young players to sell them on, I'm not sure many names on here would inspire a Koleosho type. I still think the sensible choice from those we know about would be Cooper, we will probably end up with Ruud Van Nistlerooy

[agreenwood]

Think Cooper is my preferred choice.

Only downside is for the marketing department. He ain’t flogging any baseball caps. They may need to introduce a balaclava line.

[mikeS]

Wouldn't be surprised if Pace gives JJ Watt and Dude Perfect the reins.
For the amazing contribution they've both made to the club.

[roperclaret]

I think for me Cooper would be a great appointment. Not only is his Championship record up there with the best, he had to mould a team the Forest owner bought for the Prem very quickly (and there was some right shite in there). Also his history with Liverpools academy and the England Under 17’s is very impressive too.

[daveisaclaret]

I think Moyes is the ideal candidate but I'm not totally convinced it's feasible. Every Premier League vacancy next season will probably be one where he will be considered, so the Championship would be a step down.

Cooper would be good and probably more realistic. Rob Edwards would be a good target too as would Mark Robins. I like Rosenior too.

Feels like we can't miss really. Hope Pace doesn't think he can pluck a candidate from somewhere in Europe and expect success every time.

[PIE]

I would prefer someone like Knutsen, Rohl or a Thomas Frank/VK replica. Moyes and Cooper are just lazy uninspiring options imo. VK was a superb choice that has almost worked too well. He shouldn't be capable of getting the Bayern job just yet, but because of who is, he's managed to bag it.
I'm not sad that Kompany has gone, but a similar philosophy is a must. We've got a properly talented squad that can do very well next season. If the rumours are true about rifts and fallings-out, then a new face (with a less inflated ego) that plays the same system could see the squad come together very quickly. The style of football we played under VK, and attempted to play in the EPL, is 100% the way football is going. Can't back off now.

[Rileybobs]

I would prefer someone like Knutsen, Rohl or a Thomas Frank/VK replica. Moyes and Cooper are just lazy uninspiring options imo. VK was a superb choice that has almost worked too well. He shouldn't be capable of getting the Bayern job just yet, but because of who is, he's managed to bag it.
I'm not sad that Kompany has gone, but a similar philosophy is a must. We've got a properly talented squad that can do very well next season. If the rumours are true about rifts and fallings-out, then a new face (with a less inflated ego) that plays the same system could see the squad come together very quickly. The style of football we played under VK, and attempted to play in the EPL, is 100% the way football is going. Can't back off now.

Why would Cooper be a lazy choice? Not sure I really get what that means.

[Clovius Boofus]

I'm so glad that Spudface got sorted out at Plymouth. We dodged one there.

[PIE]

Why would Cooper be a lazy choice? Not sure I really get what that means.

Because he's available and an obvious option to so many.

Doesn't make him the right option for me though. It lacks imagination and wouldn't be particularly inspiring. It also doesn't strike me as a clear continuation of what we're supposed to be building.

[claretspice]

Because he's available and an obvious option to so many.

Doesn't make him the right option for me though. It lacks imagination and wouldn't be particularly inspiring. It also doesn't strike me as a clear continuation of what we're supposed to be building.

What are we supposed to be building? If its a young team comfortable playing possession football, then I'd have thought a manager with a proven record of nurturing young talent, and playing possession football, whilst being successful in the Championship, would be a reasonable continuation. That is Cooper's CV.

[helmclaret]

He’s the perfect choice for me.

[warksclaret]

We are never all going to agree on a manager. But what qualities do we want him to have ie

plays attractive football
makes us hard to beat
knows the championship, enjoyed the success there and can progress to the PL
a good man manager and motivator who can get the best out the team
has an eye for up and coming British players in the championship and below

[RVclaret]

What are we supposed to be building? If its a young team comfortable playing possession football, then I'd have thought a manager with a proven record of nurturing young talent, and playing possession football, whilst being successful in the Championship, would be a reasonable continuation. That is Cooper's CV.

Cooper’s Forest had 50% possession in their promotion season (10th highest) and 37% in the Prem (lowest). His Swansea team had 50%. Not that I think this stat is significant but not sure how it equates to him playing possession football.

[FeedTheArf]

Cooper’s Forest had 50% possession in their promotion season (10th highest) and 37% in the Prem (lowest). His Swansea team had 50%. Not that I think this stat is significant but not sure how it equates to him playing possession football.

We had a high possession rate this season, but if that possession consists of passing between your centre backs then what’s the point?

It’s what you do with the possession that counts.

[CoolClaret]

Possession is literally defined as the number of passes your team makes as a % of the total passes of the game. It's utterly irrelevant.

[equinox]

Kevin De Bruyne won't be at City next year, would he fancy a player-manager role?

[RVclaret]

Possession is literally defined as the number of passes your team makes as a % of the total passes of the game. It's utterly irrelevant.

If the style of play is to stifle the opposition and retain possession as a means of game management (like us last season) then it’s not irrelevant.

We had a high possession rate this season, but if that possession consists of passing between your centre backs then what’s the point?

It’s what you do with the possession that counts.

Of course, that’s why it’s useful to look at metrics like xG to see if possession is resulting in high quality chances, and where that possession is being maintained (to your point, passing between cbs for a while in your own third isn’t really effective). Metrics such as Field Tilt help us understand this better. Here we see the relationship between possession and npxG in the Champ this season. Does this look like there is a relationship or not?

[NewClaret]

We had a high possession rate this season, but if that possession consists of passing between your centre backs then what’s the point?

It’s what you do with the possession that counts.

For me, what happened last season is not relevant. I agree we proved last season that we weren’t good enough to play that style in the premier league. We were getting there but over a season came up well short.

But in the championship we proved we could absolutely dominate every game and win. We retained the ball almost constantly, were in control of every single game and eventually broke down teams while giving away very few chances.

Plus I just prefer to see us in control of the ball. My nerves handle it much better!

I’m way less confident now of an immediate return than I was at the end of the season. Huge decision coming up for Pace now. Absolutely huge.

[NewClaret]

Kevin De Bruyne won't be at City next year, would he fancy a player-manager role?

Dream land stuff.

[CrosspoolClarets]

The obvious choice is Graham Potter because he has more experience including many years at that Scandinavian club, plus his teams played a similar style to us and BHA are probably the club we are attempting to copy and he would have a lot of behind the scenes info.

Would he come? If the Man Utd job misses him, he may. What other options are there apart from his former clubs? 12 months he could be back in the Premier League. Probably feels he has done his stint abroad hence Ajax not signing him. Also, the environment at Burnley is likely to be conducive to success, as opposed to somewhere like Forest and Everton with all their politics.

After that, Cooper. He has a great face for radio and won’t sell many US Youtube clips, but he has a lot of experience with young players including England U18s and his time with the Liverpool Academy.

I just hope we don’t duff the choice up because we really are now in the last chance saloon with 2 years parachutes left and no benefactor, thanks for that Vincent.

[RVclaret]

Every team that’s finished 1st in the Champ since 18/19 has had >60% possession.

Only 2/36 teams have finished in the play offs with less than 45% possession in the same time period.

Basically, suggesting it’s ’irrelevant’ is statistically incorrect.

[Newcastleclaret93]

Every team that’s finished 1st in the Champ since 18/19 has had >60% possession.

Only 2/36 teams have finished in the play offs with less than 45% possession in the same time period.

Basically, suggesting it’s ’irrelevant’ is statistically incorrect.

From what I can tell the conversation isn’t about possession in the championship.

It’s about possession in the premier league

[FeedTheArf]

From what I can tell the conversation isn’t about possession in the championship.

It’s about possession in the premier league

Completely. I’d like to see the equivalent graphs for this season in the Premier League. Lots of pointless possession from Burnley is my prediction.

Our possession based game in the Championship worked a treat. The issue was we didn’t change our tactics when it wasn’t working in the Prem.

[Rileybobs]

Every team that’s finished 1st in the Champ since 18/19 has had >60% possession.

Only 2/36 teams have finished in the play offs with less than 45% possession in the same time period.

Basically, suggesting it’s ’irrelevant’ is statistically incorrect.

Again showing how stats can be misleading. The team with the best players is likely to win the Championship, and the team with the best players is likely to have more possession than their opposition because they’re better. That’s not to say that possession stats are completely irrelevant, just that your stats don’t prove whether the possession was a cause or effect of the team winning the Championship.

[HahaYeah]

When do we hope a new man is in by, regardless of who?

Given serious planning is required for the squad then I’m thinking 8/9 June latest.

That's two weeks away, I think it will be longer by a week, it certainly will seem an age.

[RVclaret]

Again showing how stats can be misleading. The team with the best players is likely to win the Championship, and the team with the best players is likely to have more possession than their opposition because they’re better. That’s not to say that possession stats are completely irrelevant, just that your stats don’t prove whether the possession was a cause or effect of the team winning the Championship.

Or clubs with the best players appoint coaches who can dominate games (greater possession) for a reason because it gives the best chance of success? Btw Ipswich certainly didn’t have the best players.

[CoolClaret]

Every team that’s finished 1st in the Champ since 18/19 has had >60% possession.

Only 2/36 teams have finished in the play offs with less than 45% possession in the same time period.

Basically, suggesting it’s ’irrelevant’ is statistically incorrect.

You're naturally going to have more of the ball as a better team with better players - I bet we did with Dyche during our Champ 1st and 2nd place finishes.

That doesn't mean to say that it has to be the be all and end all priority - I think looking at data like that and coming to hard conclusions like 'well we just need to do this then and we will be successful' is a bit silly.