On track for

[Conroy92]

90 plus points.
Record clean sheets.
Our longest undefeated spell since 1920/21.
Have achieved the best defence this league has ever seen.

Tell me at the start of the season you wouldn't have snapped my hand off for the above and not thought it likely we would be promoted with such a bunch of achievements.

I've asked it on previous threads but it gets lost. For the unhappy bunch. What were your expectations? It seems to me the only way anyone can be unhappy is if they thought we would achieve over 100 points.

The opening lines of this post should be something to take pride in, promotion or not.

I wish we could generate a happier feeling amongst the fan base. I wish we could take massive positives from our achievements this season and make the atmosphere even greater for the run in. It's all to play for and we have had a fantastic season whichever way you look at it.

[Dark Cloud]

No CJER for 3 (or more games) means you can safely close the record books and stop counting. (Imo)

[Conroy92]

Had Worral not suffered an injury and CJ made the spot his own, it is quite likely that we would have seen Worral starting there. He was signed to come in and play and im not writing him off yet. On paper Worral should be more than an adequate deputy at this level, for most clubs he would be starting week in week out.

[Bowclaret]

Positive opening post (which I totally agree with)

Followed by a negative, miserable reply !!

Dark Cloud !!!! Why did you choose that username?

[J_Grimshaw]

Burnley post CJER may be as from end of this season. Players come and go

[Dark Cloud]

Positive opening post (which I totally agree with)

Followed by a negative, miserable reply !!

Dark Cloud !!!! Why did you choose that username?

Tbf, I didn't. It was bestowed upon me many, many years ago by a well known local league cricketer, umpire and Lowerhouse luminary.
As for Worrall, I was at Preston for the fa cup tie. Enough said!!

[claretonthecoast1882]

Personally think there is a fair chance the red gets overturned.

If not he will miss Swansea, Bristol C & Coventry while Sheff Utd play Sheff Weds, Coventry & Oxford. I wouldn't be surprised to still see us pick up more points in those 3 than Sheff Utd do. As results have shown this week this division is a lot harder than just thinking some team is sure to win.

Portsmouth have just beat top of the league then lost to bottom of the league (who hadn't won an away game all season) on their own pitch in the pace of 4 days.

[pureclaret]

Positive opening post (which I totally agree with)

Followed by a negative, miserable reply !!

Dark Cloud !!!! Why did you choose that username?

Bowclaret I agree with your first 2 points
and have the same thought about Darkcloud
It got me thinking of why we use the names we do ,I thought about the idea of how Native Americans allegedly used to lookout of the tepee and what catches your eye,or is in your mind is the name used , so for me when I looked out the weather was a pure joy to see the sun, I had in my mind that im a Claret through and through hence Pureclaret, I put my self in Bow claret and when I looked out I saw a bow leaning against a tree and a claret scarf drying on a branch.
I put my self in Dark claret and thought as I looked out side the tepee it was a very dark cloudy day and that I had negative thoughts about the world (apologise to Darkcloud if things were really **** Im just using poetic views)

Id put a reply in before your reply lol

[dandeclaret]

Tbf, I didn't. It was bestowed upon me many, many years ago by a well known local league cricketer, umpire and Lowerhouse luminary.
As for Worrall, I was at Preston for the fa cup tie. Enough said!!

Players aren't allowed a single off day now - is that the bar of acceptance?

Ridiculous.

[Guller Bull]

I've asked it on previous threads but it gets lost. For the unhappy bunch. What were your expectations? It seems to me the only way anyone can be unhappy is if they thought we would achieve over 100 points.

I'm not in the unhappy bunch but am firmly in the "Bored/Unsatisfied" group.

My expectations were that SP would get us promoted with the wealth of talent we had/have. Still think he will.

Having said that I am not that bothered about being promoted back to a league where we have to endure VAR and humiliation. I know we have to be sustainable and have to get back up to survive but I would have been happy spending a year developing an attack minded entertaining team.

Bar the odd game here and there it has been tedious to the extreme with the odd flash of brilliance. I actually thought the game against WBA on Tuesday was a proper Championship blood and gut game and ENTERTAINING.

Really couldn't give a monkey's arse about 100 points or not. Just want to feel a buzz about us playing a game of football and for the first time in decades I personally haven't felt that.

[Barlickclaret]

Worrall is a good player but like every player at that level they need a run in team to get upto speed. CJ was the same nobody wanted him starting until he'd won everybody over after a few games. Us and leeds top 2 chill.

[Row x]

Tbf, I didn't. It was bestowed upon me many, many years ago by a well known local league cricketer, umpire and Lowerhouse luminary.
As for Worrall, I was at Preston for the fa cup tie. Enough said!!

If you're going to use the Preston game as the judgement, then there's 11 players you wouldn't pick, yet we know that is not the case, perhaps judge from other games? and leave the Preston game for what it was

[Rowls]

For the unhappy bunch. What were your expectations?

I’d probably fall into the category you’re seeking. I’m not unhappy, I’m dissatisfied. And bored.

It’s the dullest football we’ve seen in my lifetime.

[claretonthecoast1882]

I’d probably fall into the category you’re seeking. I’m not unhappy, I’m dissatisfied. And bored.

It’s the dullest football we’ve seen in my lifetime.

Count yourself lucky then you are too young to have watched us under Cotterill and Howe

[Guller Bull]

Count yourself lucky then you are too young to have watched us under Cotterill and Howe

It's getting better results but as a spectacle, it is by and large on a par imo.

[Dark Cloud]

If you're going to use the Preston game as the judgement, then there's 11 players you wouldn't pick, yet we know that is not the case, perhaps judge from other games? and leave the Preston game for what it was

Fair enough. I agree that pretty much everyone who played in the Preston cup tie looked utter bobbins and I'd be equally worried if say Sonne was coming into the team (maybe even more worried!) But he isn't, it's Worral and despite him having a couple of decent games early season, what I saw that day at Preston was alarming and made me realise all these records, unbeaten runs, clean sheets and whatever else, would never have been achieved if CJER hadn't somewhat fortuitously joined the defence. Losing him is definitely going to huge!!

[morninbob]

None of the above will matter if we don't go up.

[Rowls]

Count yourself lucky then you are too young to have watched us under Cotterill and Howe

Nope.

Saw it all. Cotterill had a bit of an excuse given what he was working with but even then, it was more entertaining on the occasions that it did work.

In Parker’s defence, not all the dullness can be put down to him. Some of it is just modern football tactics. WBA had 10 men behind the ball within seconds of us gaining possession the other night and they’re not alone in that.

The sides who haven’t managed to do this are the ones we’ve picked off.

We’ve also enjoyed decent games against sides who tried to tango: Sheffield United on Boxing Day remains the highlight of the season so far.

[Rowls]

It's getting better results but as a spectacle, it is by and large on a par imo.

Broadly agree on spectacle.

The other factor: it was on a minuscule budget.

[SydneyClaret]

Just to put it in to perspective…no team that has averaged 2 points per game has ever not been promoted to the premier league. The record was Leeds last year with 90 and Sunderland the same about 10 years prior.

If 92 points doesn’t get us up then we have the unluckiest season ever.

[AlargeClaret]

90 plus points.
Record clean sheets.
Our longest undefeated spell since 1920/21.
Have achieved the best defence this league has ever seen.

If we don’t get promoted ( I’m very confident we will ) it’s nothing but instantly forgettable fluff . This sort of window dressing is for the statisticians . Let’s not forget we’re talking the championship here which is nothing but an amusing bauble . Though yes , we have indeed had a very strong defence .

[CrosspoolClarets]

Just to put it in to perspective…no team that has averaged 2 points per game has ever not been promoted to the premier league. The record was Leeds last year with 90 and Sunderland the same about 10 years prior.

If 92 points doesn’t get us up then we have the unluckiest season ever.

The world has changed.

Parachute payments for (this year) four sides, along with the gap between the divisions, make over-performance against the rest more likely. Yet only two go straight up.

I feel 92-93 may not be enough this season.

To answer the OP - was bored to tears but signing Edwards gives me hope. Maybe Parker, to avoid Cotterill-like sentiments, needs money and needs flair players to offset his rigid framework and cautious style (which is basically, take a risk, but only in places where they cannot break).

[SydneyClaret]

92 will be enough. You only have to look at the 2 teams that dropped points in vital home games this week. Us and Sheffield Utd. More will be dropped over the next 10 games as teams become desperate for playoff places and to avoid relegation. It’s the same every single season despite the gap. It’s still the same championship where any team can beat any other on the day. Eg. Portsmouth beating Leeds.

[dsr]

The reason for any disappointment is that the defensive and unbeaten records look like costing us at the end of the season. We're still third, not top two. I get that (as in games like West Brom and many of the other home draws) it is a great thing to be unbeaten and (in most cases) to keep a clean sheet, but it's also a great thing to win the game and to get three points. All those last-20-minutes-of-matches when we could have pushed the boat out and changed the system slightly to play two up front - we might have won some, we might have lost some. I believe that if we hadn't been so very careful about not letting goals in and about not losing, we could have had quite a few more points - that's the frustration.

[Conroy92]

The reason for any disappointment is that the defensive and unbeaten records look like costing us at the end of the season. We're still third, not top two. I get that (as in games like West Brom and many of the other home draws) it is a great thing to be unbeaten and (in most cases) to keep a clean sheet, but it's also a great thing to win the game and to get three points. All those last-20-minutes-of-matches when we could have pushed the boat out and changed the system slightly to play two up front - we might have won some, we might have lost some. I believe that if we hadn't been so very careful about not letting goals in and about not losing, we could have had quite a few more points - that's the frustration.

So that's thing isn't it dsr. You believe we could have got quite a few more points. So what do you think we should be getting, 100plus?

[clarets1978]

Tbf, I didn't. It was bestowed upon me many, many years ago by a well known local league cricketer, umpire and Lowerhouse luminary.
As for Worrall, I was at Preston for the fa cup tie. Enough said!!

A lot of people on here wrote Egan-Riley off after the Blackburn home game as well

[Spijed]

Even Sheff United supporters are moaning about their team being too negative and they should have got more points:
https://www.s24su.com/forum/threads/sit ... e_vignette

[Clovius Boofus]

Good OP, unfortunately followed by the highly predictable. Thing is, even if it were possible to emulate VKs Championship winning season, we'd still have the same handful doomers pouring scorn on something or other. Maybe they have nothing else going on apart from dossing about indoors and posting on here.

[dsr]

So that's thing isn't it dsr. You believe we could have got quite a few more points. So what do you think we should be getting, 100plus?

It's specific occasions. When we're at home to QPR, say, and the world and his wife can see that it's going to finish 0-0 if nothing changes, then I reckon changing things would (on average) get us more points. Leeds played Sunderland and Sheffield recently, scores level late on, and they went for broke to try and win the game - which they did. We don't go for broke - even against bottom of the table - and far too often, we don't win.

[clarets1978]

It's specific occasions. When we're at home to QPR, say, and the world and his wife can see that it's going to finish 0-0 if nothing changes, then I reckon changing things would (on average) get us more points. Leeds played Sunderland and Sheffield recently, scores level late on, and they went for broke to try and win the game - which they did. We don't go for broke - even against bottom of the table - and far too often, we don't win.

You can go for broke and lose a game as well. We dont have the attacking threat of others.

[ChorltonCharlie]

There's still a question mark over whether our lack of attacking impetus in many games is down to flaws in Parker's management style (or maybe the coach recruited to work with him) or whether it's by design never to push for winning goals and trust in the system. Either way its seriously undermining all the good stuff he's done since at the club. There's plenty of people in the middle like myself who are happy enough with the points total, but fed up with seeing performances like the other night where there seems to be so little intent to try and get much needed wins. I don't think we have a divine right to go up or amass 100+ points. But I do think we have the players to pose the opposition more problems than we do in many games.

Last couple of days there's a tendency to talk up West Brom. We're talking about a team that will be lucky to get to 70 points and made 5 changes after de-prioritising their game against us. Yet they turned up for a tricky fixture away and showed more attacking intent against a side that's players are worth far more. The second half in particular was awful from a Burnley point of view.

if we fail to go up this season, it will be the year of what ifs and the dull football in the majority of games will add to the disappointment. I desperately want Parker to succeed. He seems like a good guy. But I think for many the final points total will feel like it's in spite of him, not because of him.

[Conroy92]

There's still a question mark over whether our lack of attacking impetus in many games is down to flaws in Parker's management style (or maybe the coach recruited to work with him) or whether it's by design never to push for winning goals and trust in the system. Either way its seriously undermining all the good stuff he's done since at the club. There's plenty of people in the middle like myself who are happy enough with the points total, but fed up with seeing performances like the other night where there seems to be so little intent to try and get much needed wins. I don't think we have a divine right to go up or amass 100+ points. But I do think we have the players to pose the opposition more problems than we do in many games.

Last couple of days there's a tendency to talk up West Brom. We're talking about a team that will be lucky to get to 70 points and made 5 changes after de-prioritising their game against us. Yet they turned up for a tricky fixture away and showed more attacking intent against a side that's players are worth far more. The second half in particular was awful from a Burnley point of view.

if we fail to go up this season, it will be the year of what ifs and the dull football in the majority of games will add to the disappointment. I desperately want Parker to succeed. He seems like a good guy. But I think for many the final points total will feel like it's in spite of him, not because of him.

I appreciate your view point but what I would say is that if this is by design and we hit whatever point target Parker set. Likely 2 per game. Then imo we have not fallen short, we have been beaten by two teams that will have had extraordinary seasons to beat us. I know that people won't like it but ultimately if that happens Parker has still succeeded even if we don't go up.

If Parkers target was 100 points and we get 90plus then he has come up short. But I don't think it was.

I would also say, as mentioned by others, we could go for it in games and ultimately drop points in them rather than gaining them. Come the end of the season it levels out, and imo should we have managed 2 points per game at the end of the season with the above achievements we will have had a fantastic season irrelevant of promotion.

I take the points that the performances have not been to everyone's liking but entertainment does not always equal more points.

I have enjoyed the season. For me the one thing though that has set this apart to other seasons, the feeling and atmosphere.
Sometimes that buzz and atmosphere is one of those extra forces in getting you over the line. We've had a terrific run, in with a shout of automatic promotion and the place should be buzzing every week. It's 9 more cup finals.
This season we havnt carried that same momentum and energy in the stands. A lot will say it's the football but I think the truth is a section of the support are not backing Parker.

[mickleoverclaret]

This season we havnt carried that same momentum and energy in the stands. A lot will say it's the football but I think the truth is a section of the support are not backing Parker.

I don't really get the sense there are many people in the stadium that aren't backing Parker, but if there are it would be because of the football, surely? As you say the results, records etc. are impressive, but like a few on this thread it's left me pretty cold.

[dandeclaret]

It's specific occasions. When we're at home to QPR, say, and the world and his wife can see that it's going to finish 0-0 if nothing changes, then I reckon changing things would (on average) get us more points. Leeds played Sunderland and Sheffield recently, scores level late on, and they went for broke to try and win the game - which they did. We don't go for broke - even against bottom of the table - and far too often, we don't win.

"Far too often we don't win".... but are still averaging over 2 points per season. Like in the best 3 or 4 seasons Burnley have ever had at this level points wise.

It lacks so much logic as a view point.

[Taffy on the wing]

Unread post by claretonthecoast1882 » Thu Mar 13, 2025 2:00 am

Personally think there is a fair chance the red gets overturned.

When will we know?......anyone.

[dandeclaret]

I don't really get the sense there are many people in the stadium that aren't backing Parker, but if there are it would be because of the football, surely? As you say the results, records etc. are impressive, but like a few on this thread it's left me pretty cold.

Or because they took an opinion on him pre season, and are steadfastly sticking by it, despite the team averaging over 2 points per game.

[claretonthecoast1882]

It's specific occasions. When we're at home to QPR, say, and the world and his wife can see that it's going to finish 0-0 if nothing changes, then I reckon changing things would (on average) get us more points. Leeds played Sunderland and Sheffield recently, scores level late on, and they went for broke to try and win the game - which they did. We don't go for broke - even against bottom of the table - and far too often, we don't win.

Why didn't Leeds go for broke at Preston or Blackburn home or away, or Portsmouth on Sunday.

[Dark Cloud]

Personally I like Parker. I honestly think he's set us up and shuffled the cards he has in his hand. The first two matches he held a totally different set of cards and we all saw how they turned out. Unfortunately he was dealt a completely new set of cards after that and he's absolutely done his best to get the maximum from the them, knowing their limitations. Ultimately they've frequently been good, but sometimes not quite good enough and we've had too many draws and I've felt all along that's going to be critical in the final analysis. Parker hasn't imo set out wanting draws, but he's ended up with a team which is far better defensively than offensively and going "gung ho" with the players available would largely have been reckless and suicidal. The only possible criticism I feel, is that having known for the first half of the season we seriously lacked fire power in the box, it wasn't really addressed in the January window. Edwards is a great offensive addition and I've no real issue with fetching Barnes back for the odd cameo, but we needed more.

[ChorltonCharlie]

I appreciate your view point but what I would say is that if this is by design and we hit whatever point target Parker set. Likely 2 per game. Then imo we have not fallen short, we have been beaten by two teams that will have had extraordinary seasons to beat us. I know that people won't like it but ultimately if that happens Parker has still succeeded even if we don't go up.

If Parkers target was 100 points and we get 90plus then he has come up short. But I don't think it was.

I would also say, as mentioned by others, we could go for it in games and ultimately drop points in them rather than gaining them. Come the end of the season it levels out, and imo should we have managed 2 points per game at the end of the season with the above achievements we will have had a fantastic season irrelevant of promotion.

I take the points that the performances have not been to everyone's liking but entertainment does not always equal more points.

I have enjoyed the season. For me the one thing though that has set this apart to other seasons, the feeling and atmosphere.
Sometimes that buzz and atmosphere is one of those extra forces in getting you over the line. We've had a terrific run, in with a shout of automatic promotion and the place should be buzzing every week. It's 9 more cup finals.
This season we havnt carried that same momentum and energy in the stands. A lot will say it's the football but I think the truth is a section of the support are not backing Parker.

I've already said I'm happy with the points total. From that angle we've given it a fair crack of the whip. But IF we don't go up and we miss out by a couple of points, the passive approach to games like Tuesday will come back to haunt Parker. We're in the business end of the season, we know how well the top 2 have done. The objective on Tuesday going into the game had to be to win it. Anyone looking at our remaining fixtures would see that we needed win most of them to stand a chance unless one of the others blows up. The only time we gave the appearance of a team desperate to score the winning goal was when Roberts took 2 long throws in injury time. There was a clear lack of tempo with no urgency or intensity to our game.

It is still too close to call. Tuesday could be the point that makes the difference with us going up instead of staying down. If it is, then fantastic and well done Parker. Stay down and it will be one of many occasions this season where as a fan watching a squad with so much talent we'll question why we didn't do more to try and win the game.

[aggi]

You can go for broke and lose a game as well. We dont have the attacking threat of others.

Winning one game is the equivalent of losing three draws though. If we lost half those draws and won the others (obviously very basic) then we'd have 50% more points than from drawn games.

[Guller Bull]

Or because they took an opinion on him pre season, and are steadfastly sticking by it, despite the team averaging over 2 points per game.

Dande - I was ambivalent at best about the appointment but wanted him to be a roaring success and be happy to be proved wrong.

I am still ambivalent but if we go up I can understand that he will have been successful in his goal. I will wish him success in the Big League and hope he proves me wrong but I wont be spending money to come and watch it until the style of play improves dramatically.

Also I will say he seems like a good bloke and seems to have created a good unity BUT

[aggi]

Unread post by claretonthecoast1882 » Thu Mar 13, 2025 2:00 am

Personally think there is a fair chance the red gets overturned.

When will we know?......anyone.

Before Saturday, they will make a decision in time to play against Swansea if it is overturned.

[ChorltonCharlie]

Unfortunately he was dealt a completely new set of cards after that and he's absolutely done his best to get the maximum from the them, knowing their limitations.

What limitations? Flemming, Barnes, Edwards, Foster, Koleosho, Benson, Anthony, Sarmiento, Brownhill. All in the matchday squad on Tuesday night. Reckon there's 21 managers in the Championship going cry me a river. Even Wilder would snap your hand off for most of them.

[THEWELLERNUT70]

"Far too often we don't win".... but are still averaging over 2 points per season. Like in the best 3 or 4 seasons Burnley have ever had at this level points wise.

It lacks so much logic as a view point.

The logic is people cast their dye early on Parker and seem unwilling to accept it's been a pretty good season so far

At the start you had people stating we'd struggle to make to playoffs because our squad wasn't good enough, yet as we sit well placed with a chance of automatic promotion there's a sizable number of those exact same posters who now claim Parker should be doing better with the squad he has at his disposal

Even if we get promoted people are already finding ways to show their dismay at what might happen next season under Parker

In other words he can't win those supporters over whatever happens

[dandeclaret]

Dande - I was ambivalent at best about the appointment but wanted him to be a roaring success and be happy to be proved wrong.

I am still ambivalent but if we go up I can understand that he will have been successful in his goal. I will wish him success in the Big League and hope he proves me wrong but I wont be spending money to come and watch it until the style of play improves dramatically.

Also I will say he seems like a good bloke and seems to have created a good unity BUT

I find the likening of style to Cotterill's pretty unfair Casper. One style of play is controlled pressure, retaining the ball, playing in the opposition half with a high line, prompting and probing to create gaps. The other was akin to a flat back 9 smashing the ball upfield to a lone striker to try and do something largely on their own. I personally quite enjoy watching this team play, but everyone will have their opionions.

[THEWELLERNUT70]

Unread post by claretonthecoast1882 » Thu Mar 13, 2025 2:00 am

Personally think there is a fair chance the red gets overturned.

When will we know?......anyone.

Parker has just stated we should know today

[clarets1978]

Winning one game is the equivalent of losing three draws though. If we lost half those draws and won the others (obviously very basic) then we'd have 50% more points than from drawn games.

Assuming that its 50%. What if we had 75% of those games? Its a fine line. 1pt is still better than nothing. We are still up there with the leaders.

[Guller Bull]

I find the likening of style to Cotterill's pretty unfair Casper. One style of play is controlled pressure, retaining the ball, playing in the opposition half with a high line, prompting and probing to create gaps. The other was akin to a flat back 9 smashing the ball upfield to a lone striker to try and do something largely on their own. I personally quite enjoy watching this team play, but everyone will have their opionions.

Dande - to be clear I don't think the style is anything similar. Under Cotterill it was as you say "hoof it up and hope it sticks." Plus we were poor on and off the pitch. Under SP it is "tip tap gain a yard pass it back start again, push it sideways launch it to the wing" It echoes the trend of many "successful" clubs but the execution is eye wateringly tedious. We do look fantastic at times but that just serves to make it even more frustrating because it shows us what we are capable of. If only we were not so intent on building a perfect effing platform rather than performing on it.

[RVclaret]

What limitations? Flemming, Barnes, Edwards, Foster, Koleosho, Benson, Anthony, Sarmiento, Brownhill. All in the matchday squad on Tuesday night. Reckon there's 21 managers in the Championship going cry me a river. Even Wilder would snap your hand off for most of them.

Barnes wasn’t getting in the Norwich team. Foster was injured for 3 months & Champ record leaves a fair bit to be desired. Benson injured for 6 months. Sarmiento was not rated at West Brom. Anthony I guess so but even he had just 1 goal in 31 sub appearances for Leeds last season. Think you are 1. Forgetting the availability of all them players this season (Edwards just joined) 2. Overrating a few.

[Conroy92]

Or because they took an opinion on him pre season, and are steadfastly sticking by it, despite the team averaging over 2 points per game.

This nails how I see it at the moment.