Boro: CFS and the Hand Ball

2 Bee Holed · Post by **2 Bee Holed** » Tue Dec 27, 2016 8:55 am

IMO.
The match changed after their blatant handball, whilst they attacked in the 2nd half.
Needless to say it wasn't given and Barnes? was booked.
This certainly whipped up the CFS and probably 1/2 the ground, I couldn't tell
due to my anger. From that point onwards I thought we would win.
How either the ref or the linesman couldn't see that handball is worrying.

On the down side, this incident caused grown men to surge down the CFS
towards the front. This happened again when we scored,
but this time towards the away supporters. If you are reading this,
you don't seem to care which Burnley fans you knock over in the process.

It is stressing the stewards and I just wonder if we will be allowed
back in there next season, personally I doubt it.

Quickenthetempo · Post by **Quickenthetempo** » Tue Dec 27, 2016 11:21 am

I think you may be better off going in the Bob Lord if you think yesterday had got out of hand.

bfccrazy · Post by **bfccrazy** » Tue Dec 27, 2016 11:27 am

I ended up with my nephew on my shoulder - about 15 people hugging me and pushing me all over and then ended up on my seat singing away when we scored .......... This is why I want to sit in the CFS though and accept that it happens when goals go in....especially against our bitter rivals.

Along with the frenzy being built up .... A surge/standing/pushing etc... Will always happen after a goal....... We could bring back Tom Hark after a goal and all dance instead of celebrate properly??

TheFamilyCat · Post by **TheFamilyCat** » Tue Dec 27, 2016 12:23 pm

I do find the need to rush at away fans when we score a little odd, as I do when folk face them to sing.

Some fans seem to spend more time facing opposition fans than the game.

HatfieldClaret · Post by **HatfieldClaret** » Tue Dec 27, 2016 12:32 pm

Having seen the handball several times on TV it is clearly a handball. However, I could understand if the ref didn't get a clear view of it and i've seen more obvious ones given.

If you were my brother and you had my son on your shoulders joining in the pushing and shoving thinking it was a gas then we might be having a quiet chat about it over a pint.

When I see grown men flicking v-signs at opposition supporters and offering them outside from 50 metres away it always makes me cringe.

Am I just getting old ? Bob Lord stand sounds quite inviting.....

Andreshotboots · Post by **Andreshotboots** » Tue Dec 27, 2016 12:40 pm

Quickenthetempo wrote:I think you may be better off going in the Bob Lord if you think yesterday had got out of hand.

Excuse me ill have you know, it kicked off in the Bob lord yesterday next to me.. one gentleman lost a lense for his glasses for 10 minutes and a full scale search ensued

Quickenthetempo · Post by **Quickenthetempo** » Tue Dec 27, 2016 12:53 pm

Andreshotboots wrote:Excuse me ill have you know, it kicked off in the Bob lord yesterday next to me.. one gentleman lost a lense for his glasses for 10 minutes and a full scale search ensued

To be fair it looked like it got quite lively in the Bob Lord when the subs ran down the touchline warming up.

Colburn_Claret · Post by **Colburn_Claret** » Tue Dec 27, 2016 2:13 pm

I'm not in the CFS, but would still be gutted if the home fans were removed. That said they will only be removed if other home fans complain. I would suggest if you don't like the crowd surges you move to another area of the ground. Each to their own, surges on the Longside were part and parcel of the joy of being on the Turf, age might knock that back today, but there's nothing like being in a scrum when the Clarets score.

bob-the-scutter · Post by **bob-the-scutter** » Tue Dec 27, 2016 2:16 pm

I see some of you don`t remember the old Cricket Field End!.......now that WAS a place to be

Redbeard · Post by **Redbeard** » Tue Dec 27, 2016 2:35 pm

I'm sure my friends Ashington (happy 70th tomorrow

), Doctor 'Mdd' Doom and Green_parrot all remember the old CF terrace, though nowadays they are safely- and warmly-ensconced Bob-Lorders.

Yet it was I - far younger and still a CF fanatic - who needed a pee halfway through the second half yesterday.

And - yes - missed both the goal and the bloody surge.

dsr · Post by **dsr** » Tue Dec 27, 2016 2:38 pm

Colburn_Claret wrote:I'm not in the CFS, but would still be gutted if the home fans were removed. That said they will only be removed if other home fans complain. I would suggest if you don't like the crowd surges you move to another area of the ground. Each to their own, surges on the Longside were part and parcel of the joy of being on the Turf, age might knock that back today, but there's nothing like being in a scrum when the Clarets score.

I don't think that's the point. The point is, if there are surges and scrums, the police are likely to lean on the club to ensure that people sit down in accordance with the law. (Which would probably mean no home supporters in the CF Stand).) At present, there appears to be a bit of a blind eye being turned. Take the liberty too far, and it will be stopped.

turfytopper · Post by **turfytopper** » Tue Dec 27, 2016 4:34 pm

dsr wrote:I don't think that's the point. The point is, if there are surges and scrums, the police are likely to lean on the club to ensure that people sit down in accordance with the law. (Which would probably mean no home supporters in the CF Stand).) At present, there appears to be a bit of a blind eye being turned. Take the liberty too far, and it will be stopped.

Perhaps the away supporters should be removed as well as they never sit down?

Rileybobs · Post by **Rileybobs** » Tue Dec 27, 2016 4:44 pm

turfytopper wrote:Perhaps the away supporters should be removed as well as they never sit down?

He's not saying that. He's saying that the CFS has been unofficially accepted as a standing area and so far it has worked very well. But if there is inappropriate and/or dangerous behaviour, which charging at away fans certainly is, then it is likely that Burnley fans will be removed from the stand. That would be a great shame.

Quickenthetempo · Post by **Quickenthetempo** » Tue Dec 27, 2016 5:39 pm

I was at the back near the away section and didn't see any surges. Plenty of stick given but that's what makes the great atmosphere.
Have there been any arrests in there this season?

k90bfc · Post by **k90bfc** » Tue Dec 27, 2016 7:44 pm

Put the rail seats in for the standing area in the Home Fans half,problem solved,everybody Happy!hope it is allowed,but dont bank on common sense from the FA!

QSclaret · Post by **QSclaret** » Wed Dec 28, 2016 11:59 am

TomBenderson wrote:It was blatant from where I was sat in the Jimmy Mac upper. But the linesman is paid to watch the line not what's happening in play so a blocked view for the ref means no-one sees it. The ref was seriously rubbish yesterday but incidents like that one are understandable.

What a stupid comment. Linesmen are 'Assistant Referees' and are not just paid to watch the line, hence why they flag for more than just throw ins and offsides. The fact the two officials missed that handball is absolutely atrocious. Poor performance from them for both teams imo.

Shore claret · Post by **Shore claret** » Wed Dec 28, 2016 12:03 pm

TomBenderson wrote:It was blatant from where I was sat in the Jimmy Mac upper. But the linesman is paid to watch the line not what's happening in play so a blocked view for the ref means no-one sees it. The ref was seriously rubbish yesterday but incidents like that one are understandable.

It was the linesman the got ward booked.

fatboy47 · Post by **fatboy47** » Wed Dec 28, 2016 12:08 pm

""Yet it was I - far younger and still a CF fanatic - who needed a pee halfway through the second half yesterday.

And - yes - missed both the goal and the bloody surge.

""

That must have been some pee Redders if you went for it halfway through the half and missed our 81st minute winner !!!

bfccrazy · Post by **bfccrazy** » Wed Dec 28, 2016 12:57 pm

HatfieldClaret wrote: If you were my brother and you had my son on your shoulders joining in the pushing and shoving thinking it was a gas then we might be having a quiet chat about it over a pint...

Guessing you also wouldnt like him standing on a seat to be able to see or singing for most of the game either. Each to their own.

It was more of a firemans lift for a few seconds and I pit him down. Not charging at Boro fans as if he was a projectile.

If people dont want the possible after effects of a goal then they wont sit in that stand. I told my nephew we could move stands after trialling him for half a season in the CFS last season. Theres no other place in the ground he wants to sit.

Shore claret · Post by **Shore claret** » Wed Dec 28, 2016 1:24 pm

TomBenderson wrote:So, explain how you watch the line and the play simultaneously. This should be good.

If your not watching the game what are you doing?

Bordeauxclaret · Post by **Bordeauxclaret** » Wed Dec 28, 2016 1:33 pm

TomBenderson wrote:So, explain how you watch the line and the play simultaneously. This should be good.

The same way they give throw ins???

Bordeauxclaret · Post by **Bordeauxclaret** » Wed Dec 28, 2016 1:48 pm

They give descions other than offside all the time.

You are talking absolute balls.

aggi · Post by **aggi** » Wed Dec 28, 2016 1:49 pm

If they're only watching the line, not the game, how do they know when the ball has been played to judge an offside?

aggi · Post by **aggi** » Wed Dec 28, 2016 2:16 pm

TomBenderson wrote:That's why you sometimes get those instances where the ref has to clear up who touched the ball last. The assistant can't afford to be watching the play. When there's a chance of an offside decision becoming necessary - his focus will be the line. His ears will tell him the moment of the ball being kicked.

That's still not an answer to the question, though. How are they supposed to watch the ball being hit and the line of play at the exact moment it was played?

By rapidly moving their eyes and head? Otherwise in a noisy stadium the linesman would be raising his flag for every ball that a striker runs onto, throw-ins, accidental backpasses (unless his ears tell him who kicked the ball), etc

bob-the-scutter · Post by **bob-the-scutter** » Wed Dec 28, 2016 2:22 pm

TomBenderson wrote:Neither of those are explanations. It's a pretty simple question. How do you watch two things that are that far apart? Your primary responsibility as an assistant ref - the job that no-one else is doing - is to make the split-second decision as to whether someone is offside as the ball is played. The fact that someone thinks assistant refs should be "watching the game" tells me everything about the validity of the criticisms they get week in, week out.

This has to be a wind-up.....Assistant ref`s that don`t follow the game????
It`s called peripheral vision........do you drive by any chance?

Redbeard · Post by **Redbeard** » Wed Dec 28, 2016 2:30 pm

fatboy47 wrote:That must have been some pee Redders if you went for it halfway through the half and missed our 81st minute winner !!!

I used the term 'halfway' very loosely, Fats.

'Ten minutes from time' would have been more accurate, I agree.

2 Bee Holed · Post by **2 Bee Holed** » Wed Dec 28, 2016 5:54 pm

Oh dear oh dear.
I am clearly going to have to watch this again.
My initial thoughts in real time on the ground was that there was nothing
to block either officials view.
The assistant referee gave the free kick against Ward, so he obviously saw that incident rather than looking at the line.
I would think the A.R. has to watch both the line and the player with the ball, otherwise he cannot know when the ball was passed.
Crikey if he can hear a ball being kicked and who kicked it, in that sort of atmosphere, then he is clearly in the wrong job.
If they award it on hearing the sound of the pass, how would he know it wasn't a defender passing it back?

Yes, I am aware of the atmosphere in that part of the ground. I have a season ticket there.
However, having acquired two further tickets for the day, for my wife and daughter, I decided to take the new tickets
in Block 22 as I thought it might be more lively. I wasn't disappointed!

I am telling you now, the Boss female steward, who I talk to each match, and who was injured against Palace, is
getting more stressed by each match. I would say at the moment our time in there is limited.
Ignore me, belittle me if you want. I am giving you the truth, why else issue warning letters?

turbo5 · Post by **turbo5** » Wed Dec 28, 2016 6:40 pm

I sit in the James Hargreaves lower near the half way line with my young son, both he and I would rather be amongst the masses in the cricket field stand. Unfortunatley he is too small to see over grown adults who stand up so I sit on the front row on he JHL.
I don't complain, I find somewhere suitable to sit that suits our needs why should an area of the ground change and adapt for a minority who want to sit, don't want to sing at the opposing fans and don't want to rush when a goal is scored. If we keep mixing up the fans scattering them around the ground a sterile souless atmosphere will follow. Thats why I prefer away games (except the results) die hard fans all together and in good voice.
I thought the Boro game was the quietest the CF stand had been all season, (it sounded like that from where I was sat) Maybe too many none regulars buying those blocks of seats that they issue out for the bigger games .
I attend all home and away games and majority of the premiership stadiums have become boring. souless domes with hardly any atmosphere.

Bordeauxclaret · Post by **Bordeauxclaret** » Thu Dec 29, 2016 9:31 pm

Linesman in Villa Leeds game has just indicated a penalty for handball?
How's he done that???????

Transpennine · Post by **Transpennine** » Thu Dec 29, 2016 9:35 pm

From the 'sound' of ball hitting hand....?

QSclaret · Post by **QSclaret** » Thu Dec 29, 2016 10:20 pm

TomBenderson wrote:So, explain how you watch the line and the play simultaneously. This should be good.

Because when the incident happens the ball is not being hit forward towards a player that may potentially be offside. The linesman therefore should be looking at the play.

they don't just stand there and watch the line, they are there to assist the referee with all decisions and imo there is no way that between them both they should have missed that incident.

Bordeauxclaret · Post by **Bordeauxclaret** » Thu Dec 29, 2016 10:23 pm

The one tonight was clearly a magician.

IanMcL · Post by **IanMcL** » Thu Dec 29, 2016 10:36 pm

HatfieldClaret wrote:
When I see grown men flicking v-signs at opposition supporters and offering them outside from 50 metres away it always makes me cringe.

Am I just getting old ?

I agree. Grown men whose brai s have departed for a couple of hours. If they could see what they look like....

Bordeauxclaret · Post by **Bordeauxclaret** » Thu Dec 29, 2016 10:47 pm

Nope. Unfortunately that's not going to help the ridiculous argument you tried putting forward as there were players further back than the one who committed the offence.
Try again.

Classof92 · Post by **Classof92** » Thu Dec 29, 2016 11:40 pm

Maybe didn't get hand ball because the cricket field shouts hand ball taking the p iss
And when it is hand ball we don't get it
Maybe ref was taking ****
Lines man was to busy looking at ref miss
I saw hand ball were I was sat top o pendle hill
**** miss it

2 Bee Holed · Post by **2 Bee Holed** » Fri Dec 30, 2016 8:06 am

I have watched it back.
I wish I knew how to screen shot.

In a straight line (ok this is diagonal to the pitch),
we have ref, player who handballs it, and then the linesman.
There are no other players within 8 yards of the straight line.
Ok, I can forgive the ref, because the player who handles it has his back to the ref
and probably blocks his view. However, the linesman cannot have any excuse.
His job is to watch the line and the player with the ball for the instant he passes.
Mind you, it was very fast and a very cute handball, but it was very obvious to me in the
CFS and Phil Bird in the Longside. So at least 1/3 of the crowd should have seen it and
the Boro fans must have seen it too.

Bordeauxclaret · Post by **Bordeauxclaret** » Fri Dec 30, 2016 9:00 am

TomBenderson wrote:Yeah. Two yards away. What a stretch that would be to see that.

Ah ok so their job is only to watch the line and not what is happening in play although something may sometimes catch their eye up to a few yards away.

Stan Tastic · Post by **Stan Tastic** » Fri Dec 30, 2016 10:44 am

Linesman at the Villa v Leeds game flagged for a penalty last night for handball when the ref wasn't going to give it.

Steve1956 · Post by **Steve1956** » Fri Dec 30, 2016 2:14 pm

I love the CFS I think it's time to have that stand just for our support alone,the noise and atmosphere it generates is surely a bonus and we should start attacking the CFS in the second half as well,I was in the JML on Boxing Day as I couldn't get a seat for my son next to me in the CFS .........the atmosphere in the JML is abysmal.

MK-Claret · Post by **MK-Claret** » Wed Jan 11, 2017 10:37 am

As a old regular of the Longside and CFS . I don't know why people are complaining,well i do because that is what a lot of Burnley fans like doing the best.
Surely you know when you buy a ticket for the CFS what its going to be like in there? I took my youngest in there for her first Burnley game v Bournemouth she enjoyed it so much she was back for the Sunderland game.
To many people like to go in the CFS for the atmosphere but don't want to contribute to it.I am sure having Burnley fans in the CFS is an advantage and drowns out the opposition and makes it more intimidating?
Agreed some of the actions of fans in there is cringe worthy but on the whole the best end we have.
If you don't like it sit somewhere else.(By the way i will be a half century old in March and love the CFS and the atmosphere it creates)

bob-the-scutter · Post by **bob-the-scutter** » Wed Jan 11, 2017 12:26 pm

MK-Claret wrote:As a old regular of the Longside and CFS . I don't know why people are complaining,well i do because that is what a lot of Burnley fans like doing the best.
Surely you know when you buy a ticket for the CFS what its going to be like in there? I took my youngest in there for her first Burnley game v Bournemouth she enjoyed it so much she was back for the Sunderland game.
To many people like to go in the CFS for the atmosphere but don't want to contribute to it.I am sure having Burnley fans in the CFS is an advantage and drowns out the opposition and makes it more intimidating?
Agreed some of the actions of fans in there is cringe worthy but on the whole the best end we have.
If you don't like it sit somewhere else.(By the way i will be a half century old in March and love the CFS and the atmosphere it creates)

I was telling my boys it was almost like being back in the mid 60s in the old CCE.....all we need is a few dozen bog-rolls!

NRC · Post by **NRC** » Wed Jan 11, 2017 12:44 pm

Next you'll be telling me those at the front of the urinal queue are getting the back of their legs wet - just like in the old long side days