Football Heritage - the Orient Game

[scouseclaret]

Don’t know if it’s any good as I haven’t had chance to listen to it yet, but just come across this…

https://linktr.ee/footyheritage

[Chester Perry]

A potentially very interesting discussion absolutely ruined by the host presenter - a real shame

[wilks_bfc]

A potentially very interesting discussion absolutely ruined by the host presenter - a real shame

Why? Who’s the host presenter?

[Leon_C]

I just tried to listen on Youtube, in the background whilst doing some work. The audio mismatch between the host/guest makes it difficult to listen to. The host (I assume, from this one episode) audio is strong and clear, but the guest is dialling in whilst wearing a motorcycle helmet.

[Claret Till I Die]

I just tried to listen on Youtube, in the background whilst doing some work. The audio mismatch between the host/guest makes it difficult to listen to. The host (I assume, from this one episode) audio is strong and clear, but the guest is dialling in whilst wearing a motorcycle helmet.

Was he on the bike as well?

[Leon_C]

Was he on the bike as well?

Possibly in a sidecar, I've tried to detect the engine notes...

[Leon_C]

I will persevere - because it looks like the kind of thing I'd be interested in... it's just a difficult listen.

[THEWELLERNUT70]

It doesn't sound too bad on Spotify tbf

[scouseclaret]

Not sure what the issue with the sound is - seemed ok to me on Apple Podcasts.

Equally not sure about the content though. It feels like an undergraduate sociology tutorial about “mythology in football”. The guest (who is a Burnley fan) is basically challenging the “myth” that the Orient Game was the major turning point in the Club’s recent history based on the fact that it took us another 5 years to get promoted. To me, that would seem to overlook the fact that thousands of fans (myself included) who had become disconnected re-engaged with club directly as a result of what happened that season, in a way they might not have had we got relegated. Attendances certainly took a significant turn for the better.

Deep football introspection seems to be a bit of a thing at the moment as anyone who listens to Out of My Tiny Mind will attest…

[Oshkoshclaret]

Anyone trying to advance the idea that the Orient Game wasn't a major turning point in the club's recent history is talking complete ********.

[RammyClaret61]

Possibly in a sidecar, I've tried to detect the engine notes...

So it was Gromit?

[THEWELLERNUT70]

No mention of The Sherpa Van Final which happened the season after which further reconnected supporters with the club which began with "The Orient Game"

[Culmclaret]

If you don’t think the Orient game was a turning point, you weren’t around at the time. Yes, it took a while to get promoted, but the passion returned. For a start our home attendances doubled the following season. Wembley added to that momentum.

[ChorltonCharlie]

Not sure what the issue with the sound is - seemed ok to me on Apple Podcasts.

Equally not sure about the content though. It feels like an undergraduate sociology tutorial about “mythology in football”. The guest (who is a Burnley fan) is basically challenging the “myth” that the Orient Game was the major turning point in the Club’s recent history based on the fact that it took us another 5 years to get promoted. To me, that would seem to overlook the fact that thousands of fans (myself included) who had become disconnected re-engaged with club directly as a result of what happened that season, in a way they might not have had we got relegated. Attendances certainly took a significant turn for the better.

Deep football introspection seems to be a bit of a thing at the moment as anyone who listens to Out of My Tiny Mind will attest…

Definitely a turning point. The well known analogy like turning an oil tanker would describe it.

[martin_p]

Well, what a load of ballcocks!

I know the person putting forward the theory of the football myth around the Orient match is a season ticket holder, but I suggest he probably wasn’t at that time in the clubs history. To suggest that Orient wasn’t a turning point is the clubs history is just wrong. Yes, he accurately identifies we didn’t get promoted for another five years (but equally we were never close to relegation from the 4th again) but it’s about so much more than that. Since the mid 70s Burnley had been on a steady downward trajectory and by the mid 80s there was a feeling a complete hopelessness about the place, both from the fans and the club itself. The Orient match finally turned that around and we started to look forward, culminating in the Wembley appearance 12 months later which finally gave club and supporters a sense of pride. Ever since then, certainly up until around about 2017, it felt like the club was slowly moving forward. Yes there were bumps in the road where we stalled for a season or three, but the general trend was upwards. Anyone who doesn’t believe the Orient game was a turning point should look at this graph. Guess where the Orient game is!

[Herts Clarets]

The Orient game HAD to be the turning point, we couldn't realistically have gone any lower without leaving the Football League or going out of business. I would suggest that anyone who says otherwise was not around at the time to witness the depressing site of a ground that had a capacity of 38k in the format still prevalent on 9th May 1987, with a smattering of die hard supporters dotted around the place and being able to hear the players whilst the game was in progress. Agreed promotion took 5 years to be achieved, in between was a memorable trip to Wembley with a reported 35k Burnley fans present. To put this into perspective, that is over 20 times the total number of fans, 1696, who attended the home game v Colchester United just over a year before. That, more than anything demonstrates the shift in not only the club's fortunes but also the awakening of many a supporter who had allowed their allegiances to lapse and bring themselves to watch Burnley again.

[CrosspoolClarets]

I really like that chart, never seen it before and it is certainly dramatic (though representing something we all know). I do think it shouldn’t end in 2010 if used nowadays, even though it won’t change the substance of it.

[keith1879]

I really like that chart, never seen it before and it is certainly dramatic (though representing something we all know). I do think it shouldn’t end in 2010 if used nowadays, even though it won’t change the substance of it.

Agreed - although I doubt very much if any team identifiably linked with Burnley FC were actually playing in 1082

[Leon_C]

Burnley_FC_League_Performance.svg.png (275.36 KiB) Viewed 579 times

These images, from "EclecticArkie" are commonly found on Wikipedia. This is more up to date.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_B ... rmance.svg

[Ric_C]

These graphics are amazing. My first game as a 9 year old was Scunthorpe at home in 1986 where we lost 2-1. I supported Everton at the time as everyone in my school supported Liverpool.

The next season I only went on a few games, I remember losing a midweek game 3-1 at home to Cardiff the following season, and I remember even as a young kid, everything seemed a bit grim. Just looked up the gate and it was 1,717

My dad didn't take me to the Orient game as he thought there would be trouble if we lost, but the next season I remember the crowds returning and us looking half decent, culminating in us reaching Wembley. It felt like we were a proper club again, and I've been a season ticket holder ever since.

Looking back on it all, I've been incredibly lucky to start following Burnley at that time, as you appreciate the highs a lot more when we've been in the doldrums for so long.

[Dressinggown]

The Orient game which, for me, was still just a rescue situation.

The turning point came in the 2nd leg of the Sherpa Van semi at Preston the season after. Nobody gave us a chance on their plastic pitch but you could hear the 6,500 Clarets from miles away.

Belief starting to become reality.

[Woodleyclaret]

The game at Deepdale beating a better side in PNE was great We lived 5 mins walk from Deepdale and our daughter enjoyed bragging rights the day after at Fulwood School. A great day out at Wembley and the atmosphere at The Orient Game unbelievable. Yes it did galvanise support with a boost in support from us then exiles with the London Clarets.

[nil_desperandum]

The Orient game which, for me, was still just a rescue situation.

The turning point came in the 2nd leg of the Sherpa Van semi at Preston the season after. Nobody gave us a chance on their plastic pitch but you could hear the 6,500 Clarets from miles away.

Belief starting to become reality.

Had it not been for the pivotal Orient game we would never have played at Deepdale in that memorable game,

[agreenwood]

The guest on the pod made the point that the Orient game wasn’t the “rebirth” of the club because we were stuck in the old Div 4 for another 4 years.

However, I recall (as a child back then) that the feeling about the club seemed to change. The attendances the following season as good as doubled and it felt to me like we were headed in a better direction, helped by the Wembley trip just 12 months later.

Taking a view purely based on whether we were immediately promoted seems to be a very narrow way of looking at it.

[martin_p]

The guest on the pod made the point that the Orient game wasn’t the “rebirth” of the club because we were stuck in the old Div 4 for another 4 years.

However, I recall (as a child back then) that the feeling about the club seemed to change. The attendances the following season as good as doubled and it felt to me like we were headed in a better direction, helped by the Wembley trip just 12 months later.

Taking a view purely based on whether we were immediately promoted seems to be a very narrow way of looking at it.

It is an incredibly narrow way of looking at things and, as I’ve posted above, leads me to believe the person making the statement probably wasn’t a claret at the time. We were never going up straight away, we needed a dozen new (and better) players and still had no money. The team that won the 4th Division in 1992 was built over a number of years it didn’t just materialise.

[scouseclaret]

The Orient game which, for me, was still just a rescue situation.

The turning point came in the 2nd leg of the Sherpa Van semi at Preston the season after. Nobody gave us a chance on their plastic pitch but you could hear the 6,500 Clarets from miles away.

Belief starting to become reality.

We would never have taken 6,500 anywhere if it weren’t for the Orient game!