JBG, Defour.... Hendrick?

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Re: JBG, Defour.... Hendrick?

Post by Lancasterclaret » Mon Feb 20, 2017 1:47 pm

The desire from one or two fans to see Barton banned is more than a bit weird.
I've had another look at my post that appears to have upset you.

Has "weird" developed a different context recently or something? I certainly don't have an issue with people having a different opinion to me, but IO do think it slightly odd that Burnley fans would want one of our own players banned.

Does that come across any better? I think it comes across exactly the same ie that I don't agree with those and don't understand the motivations of those who want him banned.

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Re: JBG, Defour.... Hendrick?

Post by Steve1956 » Mon Feb 20, 2017 1:51 pm

Lancasterclaret wrote:I've had another look at my post that appears to have upset you.

Has "weird" developed a different context recently or something? I certainly don't have an issue with people having a different opinion to me, but IO do think it slightly odd that Burnley fans would want one of our own players banned.

Does that come across any better? I think it comes across exactly the same ie that I don't agree with those and don't understand the motivations of those who want him banned.
Barton saw a red mist on Saturday ....normal service will be resumed at Hull and he will be back focused..I find it strange that our own fans would want Barton Banned,we certainly need him.

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Re: JBG, Defour.... Hendrick?

Post by leedsdave » Mon Feb 20, 2017 1:57 pm

Come on guys, there are enough threads discussing Joey's behaviour on Saturday. This thread is about injuries to other members of our midfield team.

Anyway, to bring it back on track (well almost), quoting mdd2:

"I know he JBG left on crutches with his knee strapped up then we are suddenly in deep do do.
It would mean of our squad of 23 we are missing Marney, Defour (for another game or so) Hendick and JBG for Saturday and JBG for poss rest of season.
Throw in the loss of Barton for who knows how long and suddenly the we will be OK brigade may be as predictive as most of us were for Saturday's result."

Oh dear. No need to revert to type doctor. We will be OK, trust me. Before Joey suffers any ban we will be safe. Joey & Ashley at Hull then Hendrick will be back, along with Defour possibly. We've still got Brady, Boyd & Arfield and Tarkowski can play in midfield if necessary. In fact he's looked better there than he did in his normal position against Lincoln.

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Re: JBG, Defour.... Hendrick?

Post by mdd2 » Mon Feb 20, 2017 2:04 pm

Not so sure you are correct there Dave. Safe before Joey's hearing that is. The way we were punished as the innocent victim of Andre's past "offences" far from sure Joey will be playing much longer for us. Given that he has accepted the charge it cannot too long before we know the outcome. I hope things are delayed until April but I doubt it.

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Re: JBG, Defour.... Hendrick?

Post by ShabbaRanks » Mon Feb 20, 2017 2:06 pm

We're going round in circles a bit now so i'll say this and leave it there.

I feel like you're now pinning this solely on the door of twitter. It's not just twitter. For example, I've had 2 conversations with different colleagues today where it's been a variation of "that Joey Barton eh". That will have been the same up and down the region and surely a good number of coffee machines across the country.

These conversations across varying platforms paint Joey Barton in a bad light. This then reflects poorly on us. This will then be anchored in the memory for another time they want to give an opinion about our club.

"Burnley scored to beat Hull in the last minute? Joey Barton again? I hate that dirty ****, they can go down if he's playing for them"

If you think that people's opinions aren't influenced by things like this, then you are wrong. That is your opinion and you are welcome to it but it is an opinion that lacks knowledge of the subject matter.

This again brings us back around to what the real question is. How much are you bothered? Some folk are undoubtedly taking it too far if they want him banned. Are people who think Sean should at the very least be having a quiet word with him weird? No. Of course they're not. Don't be so bloody stupid.
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Re: JBG, Defour.... Hendrick?

Post by Sidney1st » Mon Feb 20, 2017 2:09 pm

I've spoken to people online who thought Barton was on the receiving end of the most amount of red/yellow card last season, calling him dirty, should never play again etc.
The fact that he didn't get sent off once last season and didn't even get a ban that I can recall just shows that people dislike him because it's the trend to do so.

We all know he can be a dick, but Savage was the same and both were good players in their own way.

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Re: JBG, Defour.... Hendrick?

Post by leedsdave » Mon Feb 20, 2017 2:10 pm

That's what I was getting at mate. With a delayed hearing then an appeal following whatever punishment is doled out, Joey should be able to continue playing until we are safe. In my view we are virtually there now. But you know me, always the optimist. Here's one for you:

If you worry, you die - if you don't worry, you still die - so why die miserable?

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Re: JBG, Defour.... Hendrick?

Post by Lancasterclaret » Mon Feb 20, 2017 2:14 pm

Everyone I've met today has talked about one thing. Lincoln. Lincoln are being talked about quite rightly by everybody, not Joey Barton and certainly not the Burnley fc the brand.

The radio has been on all day, talking about football, and when they talked about our match, they talked about Lincoln.

Again, not us, or the brand, or JB

I've called you out for coming out with stuff that isn't backed. You can't refute that. So I'm not surprised you are "ending it here"

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Re: JBG, Defour.... Hendrick?

Post by Lancasterclaret » Mon Feb 20, 2017 2:22 pm

Are people who think Sean should at the very least be having a quiet word with him weird?
Yup, because that is exactly what I said. I'm sure you know it isn't, but if you are insist on making stuff up thats up to you.

Look, you know as well as I do that Burnley the brand is dominated by one man, and it isn't JB, its the manager.

The manager has been on record saying how he deals with Joey.

Joey has already admitted (pretty much) that he was wrong, and SD treats him like an adult. He'll probably have marched straight up to SD this morning and said "Sorry gaffer, I let myself down a bit on Sat" and that will be that.

Worst thing that might happen to him is that he'll be sat in the Calder on Friday!

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Re: JBG, Defour.... Hendrick?

Post by Woodleyclaret » Mon Feb 20, 2017 2:27 pm

All the players who chocked v Lincoln owe the fans big time.We need 100% from everyone at Hull and nothing less than an away win is a must.

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Re: JBG, Defour.... Hendrick?

Post by bfcmik » Mon Feb 20, 2017 3:20 pm

I would expect a midfield of Boyd, Barton, Westwood, Brady on Saturday with Arfield and, hopefully, Defour on the subs bench.

Doubt we will see JBG play again this season. Even if it takes until the start of April (best case) it would probably be better to get him ready for pre-season.

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Re: JBG, Defour.... Hendrick?

Post by ablueclaret » Mon Feb 20, 2017 4:53 pm

The values that SD likes to uphold were badly undermined by Barton and Flanagan's actions, it would have been good to hear SD speak out about them but he chose not to, he lost credibility by not doing so. Actions as they say speak louder than words but in this case words were needed to put our truculent behaviour and mean actions to the sword. SD and the clubs reputation for fair play came away tarnished from that encounter, that is fairly obvious.

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Re: JBG, Defour.... Hendrick?

Post by SammyBoy » Mon Feb 20, 2017 4:54 pm

At the end of the day as a club we're here to win football matches, and that's all I care about - not a squeaky clean 'brand' we've created. Yes Joey got out of line on Saturday, yes Dyche should have a word but as long as he's busting a gut wearing a Burnley shirt he'll certainly have my 100% backing.
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Re: JBG, Defour.... Hendrick?

Post by ablueclaret » Mon Feb 20, 2017 4:57 pm

Just lets not have the guff about playing fair etc, let's just be a mean cheating outfit.

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Re: JBG, Defour.... Hendrick?

Post by bfcmik » Mon Feb 20, 2017 5:11 pm

I have posted on another thread what I thought about Joey's dubious antics last Saturday and have no wish to repeat my comments. However, when he comes out to play for us on Saturday at Hull he, along with all the others wearing a BFC kit, will get my full support because the Lincoln game is in the past and we have to go on with the one game at a time mentality that has stood us in such good stead over the last few years.

FA Cup disappointment is just one more flavouring in the pot of being a BFC supporter for life!

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Re: JBG, Defour.... Hendrick?

Post by gawthorpe_view » Mon Feb 20, 2017 5:18 pm

Has there been an official statement released regarding the extent ofJBG's injury?

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Re: JBG, Defour.... Hendrick?

Post by lakesclaret » Mon Feb 20, 2017 7:57 pm

Above is one of the most sensible posts of the yr re:Barton
Simply 2 real men playing the game to win by whatever means,not pretty but some do need to get over it or empty their colostomy bags

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Re: JBG, Defour.... Hendrick?

Post by Falcon » Tue Feb 21, 2017 8:42 am

ShabbaRanks wrote:
"Burnley scored to beat Hull in the last minute? Joey Barton again? I hate that dirty ****, they can go down if he's playing for them"

If you think that people's opinions aren't influenced by things like this, then you are wrong. That is your opinion and you are welcome to it but it is an opinion that lacks knowledge of the subject matter.

If Barton scores a last minute winner against Hull then I personally won't give a flying fig what fans of other clubs think about him, or BFC, I'll be bloody ecstatic that we've taken a giant step toward Premier League survival and hurt one of our rivals in the process.

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Re: JBG, Defour.... Hendrick?

Post by Blackrod » Tue Feb 21, 2017 8:45 am

Nothing is tarnished. Manager is defending his players in public. He will try and Gt the best out of them for the next fixture I hope. Hopefully he has done his research this time, have them well drilled and up for it.

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Re: JBG, Defour.... Hendrick?

Post by Firthy » Tue Feb 21, 2017 9:02 am

ablueclaret wrote:The values that SD likes to uphold were badly undermined by Barton and Flanagan's actions, it would have been good to hear SD speak out about them but he chose not to, he lost credibility by not doing so. Actions as they say speak louder than words but in this case words were needed to put our truculent behaviour and mean actions to the sword. SD and the clubs reputation for fair play came away tarnished from that encounter, that is fairly obvious.
Why would he comment on it on TV or in public and draw even more attention to it. I'm sure he's spoke to them in private and maintained a dignified public silence. Exactly what I'd expect from him.

I like most supporters was disappointed and disgusted at Joey's antics because one thing I hate in current football is the diving and feigning injuries but let's be realistic here Joey's was no worse than a lot of other things happening every week in the Premier League.

It's all a bit hypocritical. We slag Joey off for this one incident but on the other hand keep saying that Vokes is too nice and soft on occasions and needs to toughen up. We can't have both, we either want nice polite friendly players and lose every match or hard tough players who want to win and give us a chance of staying up.

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Re: JBG, Defour.... Hendrick?

Post by martin_p » Tue Feb 21, 2017 9:10 am

Clearly 'no one likes us and we don't care' isn't a thing anymore!!
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Re: JBG, Defour.... Hendrick?

Post by KRBFC » Tue Feb 21, 2017 9:13 am

Does it really matter about the fitness of Defour, he won't play either way unless he's stuck out at left wing.

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Re: JBG, Defour.... Hendrick?

Post by Sidney1st » Tue Feb 21, 2017 9:13 am

martin_p wrote:Clearly 'no one likes us and we don't care' isn't a thing anymore!!
Does this mean we need to change the words to the song?

"No one likes and we really care"

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Re: JBG, Defour.... Hendrick?

Post by martin_p » Tue Feb 21, 2017 9:17 am

'No one likes us and it's because that nasty man Joey Barton has tarnished our lovely reputation', but it doesn't really scan.
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Re: JBG, Defour.... Hendrick?

Post by KRBFC » Tue Feb 21, 2017 9:18 am

ShabbaRanks wrote:I have no strong feelings either way but I can absolutely see where people are coming from and it is in no way "weird" or "beyond weird".

We have managed to create an impression of ourselves in the media, fuelled in no small part by Dyche, that we are a club with a strong culture and a working moral compass.

We have been in the papers as recent as last week, proudly proclaiming that our players have to undergo dares for even the most minor of transgressions. Dyche has been in the press on a few occasions lamenting diving and "the dark arts". This is the characterization we have fashioned for ourselves.

So then, when one of our players acts like a toe-rag - and he has by the way - anyone trying to say that he's not is "beyond weird", because of this image we've created for ourselves, these people want us to be seen to act strongly on this, lest we reveal ourselves to be hypocrites just after a quick soundbite.

Sometimes, doing the right thing transcends football and the results we want. What he did is worthy of some sort of internal action - whether that's a reminder of our values, an explanation of his actions and an assurance it won't happen again or something firmer. That's more important to some people, and it's the mark of what sort of man you are. By any measure it is most certainly not "beyond weird".

I name anyone who has proudly boasted about our well publicized internal culture and structure, and think Joey's actions are not worthy of any sort of internal repurcussions a hypocrite.
I agree, no Burnley fan wants him banned (surely not) but the way he acted was completely embarrassing and some fans believe he could be banned for it. Thinking something could happen and wanting it to happen are completely different.

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Re: JBG, Defour.... Hendrick?

Post by martin_p » Tue Feb 21, 2017 9:24 am

By the way, I didn't hear anyone calling for Sam Vokes to 'fess up after he controlled the ball with his hand for the Leicester goal. It's against the rules and therefore by definition 'cheating'. Or is one form of cheating more acceptable than others? Surely it's against our values?
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Re: JBG, Defour.... Hendrick?

Post by Sidney1st » Tue Feb 21, 2017 9:26 am

Values tend to go out the window when it's in our favour.
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Re: JBG, Defour.... Hendrick?

Post by ShabbaRanks » Wed Feb 22, 2017 1:26 pm

Yesterdays news that no one is talking about......today.

http://newsthump.com/2017/02/22/joey-ba ... ate-a-pie/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

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Re: JBG, Defour.... Hendrick?

Post by Lancasterclaret » Wed Feb 22, 2017 1:32 pm

You do know that is a satirical account don't you?

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Re: JBG, Defour.... Hendrick?

Post by ShabbaRanks » Wed Feb 22, 2017 1:39 pm

martin_p wrote:By the way, I didn't hear anyone calling for Sam Vokes to 'fess up after he controlled the ball with his hand for the Leicester goal. It's against the rules and therefore by definition 'cheating'. Or is one form of cheating more acceptable than others? Surely it's against our values?
The point that I still feel that some folks are spectacularly missing is that no, you won't find many that will want the goal disallowed or Sam punished or anything else (even though whether he meant it/was avoidable is open to debate.)

The point is, don't pick the bits and pieces of being honest and playing fair and having a strong culture when it suits you, when you're on the soapbox in front of some cameras, and then turn a blind eye or even acknowledge it when your team has been involved in something more unsavoury. Either do it right or don't do it at all. It makes you look hypocritical and insincere.

Another example of that would be the howls of derision and fun poked at the Chelsea team after Courtois mentioned they found the conditions and the pitch difficult to play on. It was referenced in Tony's writing and there were plenty on here gleefully queuing up to get stuck in to the pontification.

Funny that when George Boyd said that the pitch caused issues for us V Lincoln, no one has had very much to say about it. Not seen any articles about it, or many comments from anyone at all. Again, makes us look like hypocritical mugs.

Either put up, or shut up. That's all that is being asked.
Last edited by ShabbaRanks on Wed Feb 22, 2017 1:41 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: JBG, Defour.... Hendrick?

Post by ShabbaRanks » Wed Feb 22, 2017 1:40 pm

Lancasterclaret wrote:You do know that is a satirical account don't you?
Are they or are they not discussing what occurred on Saturday?

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Re: JBG, Defour.... Hendrick?

Post by Lancasterclaret » Wed Feb 22, 2017 1:41 pm

No it d......

Frankly can't be arsed arguing with very strange people today

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Re: JBG, Defour.... Hendrick?

Post by Lancasterclaret » Wed Feb 22, 2017 1:43 pm

Who else is discussing it?

Or put in another way, which serious media outlets are discussing it?
Last edited by Lancasterclaret on Wed Feb 22, 2017 1:49 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: JBG, Defour.... Hendrick?

Post by Lancasterclaret » Wed Feb 22, 2017 1:49 pm

Actually, scratch that, its a bit too harsh.

I can just about see the point that you are trying to make, though you haven't got a lot to back it up, and I suppose we will have to disagree that this kind of thing will affect a clubs statue as there is always something else to talk about the next day.

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Re: JBG, Defour.... Hendrick?

Post by ShabbaRanks » Wed Feb 22, 2017 1:50 pm

I present my case as is.

"Postby Lancasterclaret » Mon Feb 20, 2017 2:14 pm

Everyone I've met today has talked about one thing. Lincoln. Lincoln are being talked about quite rightly by everybody, not Joey Barton and certainly not the Burnley fc the brand."

And here are a selection of articles from Monday, as well as the one posted earlier today which were gleaned from a literal minutes worth of earching.

http://www.givemesport.com/990113-watch ... utoplay=on" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
http://www.umaxit.com/index.php/columns ... punishment" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
http://www.talkingbaws.com/2017/02/vide ... ey-defeat/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
http://www.scotzine.com/2017/02/world-c ... ms-barton/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

"Saxo levels of stupidity" - it's ok to admit that you're wrong.

Aaaah - I see your latest post. It's not that people aren't discussing it. It's now that they're just not places you deem reputable. Goalposts moving and all of that, got ya.

Feel free to be as harsh as you like. I'd say there's no need to get wound up over it though.

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Re: JBG, Defour.... Hendrick?

Post by Lancasterclaret » Wed Feb 22, 2017 2:08 pm

I'm not the one who is wound up over it Shabba!

its something that I'm sure JB regrets and that it will have zero effect on Burnley FC from here on in*

*unless of course we completely collapse after this loss

You seem to be fixating on this line from me

"Its not being talked about by anybody today, or tomorrow, or next week. They are rightly concentrating on Lincolns success."

It was one of the main news stories on Sat (quite rightly), got mentioned a lot less as Sunday went on and then really disappeared from the media we clearly both use a lot (twitter/facebook).

I think you can agree that it won't affect Burnley FC and their standing in the football world at all surely?

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Re: JBG, Defour.... Hendrick?

Post by Silkyskills1 » Wed Feb 22, 2017 4:31 pm

[quote="ShabbaRanks'

Either put up, or shut up. That's all that is being asked.[/quote]

Doesn't sound like a question to me more like an order. Don't do orders, never have,never will.

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Re: JBG, Defour.... Hendrick?

Post by Stayingup » Wed Feb 22, 2017 7:54 pm

In the Prem we always seem to end up with a lack of midfielders. Can't get enough of them. Would have won in Saturday with Marney and Defour alongside Barton. Alas.

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Re: JBG, Defour.... Hendrick?

Post by Fretters » Thu Feb 23, 2017 11:09 am

claretspice wrote:The only Burnley player brave enough to try and make things happen on Saturday, Lancaster. He wasn't great - no-one was - but he got into more positions to make things happen than any other Burnley player (loads of intelligent runs in behind, or into the pockets between the lines, didn't always get the ball and when he did he often lost it) and as is always the case with Arfield, he covered the ground, kept trying and never hid.

As I say, if we are going to go to Hull and play something akin to the game plan we deployed against Chelsea, Westwood and Barton is fine. But if we want to go and engage Hull and play on the front foot, then Arfield presses up the pitch better than either of them.

As for Barton, there's no defending the fact that play-acting on Saturday, but that's a yellow card offence. I dislike players standing on opponents toes too, but that's one of those dark arts which has been taking place since god was a boy. He might have got sent off had it been seen, but if the FA were to take retrospective action on that one, there'd be an absolute avalanche of similar incidents being highlighted next weekend.
This. At one point, Arfield put Gray through by flicking the ball behind him with the outside of his boot. It was brilliant. If Gray had scored and we'd gone on to win, we'd have been praising Scotty's sublime skill and nobody would have an issue with him starting games. It's fine margins.
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Re: JBG, Defour.... Hendrick?

Post by Rammy1968 » Thu Feb 23, 2017 1:26 pm

Joey just went toe to toe with the big fella from Lincoln................they both gave as good as they got. I thought if you really wanted to analyse anything it would be the number of fouls Rhead committed especially the penalty that was missed and the elbow on Joey without action from the referee. Joey was just trying to take action due to the inaction of the referee.

For me Joey is one of, if not the most influential player I have ever had the pleasure to watch in a Claret and Blue shirt. Quality player who always gives 100%.

I have played football all my life and have had numerous broken toes with players standing on my toes, I can't see what all the fuss is about.

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