New striker?

burnley007 · Post by **burnley007** » Thu Apr 20, 2017 1:20 pm

Just read this on BBC...

Captain Troy Deeney says he has been "linked with everyone" but could leave Watford this summer "if they want to get rid of me", with West Brom eyeing a £20m move for the 28-year-old English striker

It would be a perfect signing for SD. I really can see him coming to us this summer, for BIG money...£15-£20m!

Him and Gray would have the potential to be an excellent partnership, I really like the look of it.

Funkydrummer · Post by **Funkydrummer** » Thu Apr 20, 2017 1:28 pm

Not sure he and Gray would complement each other. He would have to lose some weight too.

KefkaClaret · Post by **KefkaClaret** » Thu Apr 20, 2017 1:34 pm

Leicester had a £25m bid rejected last summer

PWBFC · Post by **PWBFC** » Thu Apr 20, 2017 1:35 pm

Isn't he on something ludicrous like £100K a week?

ThinLizzy · Post by **ThinLizzy** » Thu Apr 20, 2017 1:37 pm

Not for me. I'd hope, over time we are going to go back to proper football. It's a gradual transformation but too similar to Gray. I can see the positive though, knock on to Gray but we need a plan B and a plan C. This season we've been lucky to have a plan A.

ablueclaret · Post by **ablueclaret** » Thu Apr 20, 2017 1:40 pm

ThinLizzy · Post by **ThinLizzy** » Thu Apr 20, 2017 1:47 pm

ablueclaret wrote:No.

Tarkowski up fron in a 10-0-1?

ThinLizzy · Post by **ThinLizzy** » Thu Apr 20, 2017 1:47 pm

Tarkowski up fron in a 10-0-1?[/quote]

FCBurnley · Post by **FCBurnley** » Thu Apr 20, 2017 1:53 pm

IF he did come it would be in place of Gray

minnieclaret · Post by **minnieclaret** » Thu Apr 20, 2017 1:55 pm

SD is a fan but no.

ThinLizzy · Post by **ThinLizzy** » Thu Apr 20, 2017 1:59 pm

OK! How THE HELL DO YOU DELETE A POST? As soon as a post is deleted it should go. Not here. What's that about?

Wile E Coyote · Post by **Wile E Coyote** » Thu Apr 20, 2017 2:03 pm

not so keen on deeney, hes not all that good. hope he never comes here.

Funkydrummer · Post by **Funkydrummer** » Thu Apr 20, 2017 2:04 pm

ThinLizzy wrote:Tarkowski up fron in a 10-0-1?

[/quote]

No keeper ? Now that's living dangerously.

Don't think you can delete a post, just it's contents I think.
Could be wrong though, it has been known.

claretfern · Post by **claretfern** » Thu Apr 20, 2017 2:13 pm

Would prefer Swansea's Fernando Llorente. (Possible drawback him being 32) JBG and Brady to get some crosses in for him...

ThinLizzy · Post by **ThinLizzy** » Thu Apr 20, 2017 2:16 pm

Funkydrummer wrote:

No keeper ? Now that's living dangerously.

Don't think you can delete a post, just it's contents I think.
Could be wrong though, it has been known.

[/quote]

Thanks. Oh now I know.

ablueclaret · Post by **ablueclaret** » Thu Apr 20, 2017 2:51 pm

A quicksilver striker for me rather than a battering ram.

MiltonKeynesClaret93 · Post by **MiltonKeynesClaret93** » Thu Apr 20, 2017 3:10 pm

PWBFC wrote:Isn't he on something ludicrous like £100K a week?

At Watford? Nahhh surely not

PWBFC · Post by **PWBFC** » Thu Apr 20, 2017 10:24 pm

MiltonKeynesClaret93 wrote:At Watford? Nahhh surely not

Just checked and Watford Observer says 100K!

bobinho · Post by **bobinho** » Thu Apr 20, 2017 10:48 pm

I'm not so sure we'd bang crosses in if we signed Peter crouch fern!

That's a joke, btw.

HelloHiGoodbye · Post by **HelloHiGoodbye** » Thu Apr 20, 2017 10:50 pm

claretfern wrote:Would prefer Swansea's Fernando Llorente. (Possible drawback him being 32) JBG and Brady to get some crosses in for him...

We've had Vokes for years and never got enough crosses into the box.

claretfern · Post by **claretfern** » Thu Apr 20, 2017 11:53 pm

HelloHiGoodbye wrote:We've had Vokes for years and never got enough crosses into the box.

I know...but we need to. Hopefully a different game plan next season?

Blackrod · Post by **Blackrod** » Fri Apr 21, 2017 12:00 am

No thanks. He's from Birmingham

DCWat · Post by **DCWat** » Fri Apr 21, 2017 12:02 am

I'd be amazed if the gameplan was significantly different. At most, I think it will be the same style with a little more pace and creativity. At a push a five man midfield away from home.

We all want to see great football but realistically, for the short term at least, we can't move too far away from what has served us so well.

Wile E Coyote · Post by **Wile E Coyote** » Fri Apr 21, 2017 12:40 am

we definately require a ball player with a decent shot, Aguerro type, but a ten bob version obviously, because its Burnley.
Maradona didnt rely on crosses, he just set off towards goal and did it all himself if the passes didnt arrive for him.
Lumping it around for hefty target men is ineffective. Also, Burnley can rarely find anyone to put in a decent cross.
Usually overhit by thirty yards for a throw in.

MT03ALG · Post by **MT03ALG** » Fri Apr 21, 2017 12:44 am

Torres on his way allegedly....

burnley007 · Post by **burnley007** » Fri Apr 21, 2017 8:07 am

100k a week??
Bloody hell.

That scuppers that idea...

claretdom · Post by **claretdom** » Fri Apr 21, 2017 8:11 am

The funniest link I've seen so far was one claiming we had joined the race for Anthony Modeste (once of ewood) who is 29 and the fee was between 30m and 40m euros.

HiroshimaClaret · Post by **HiroshimaClaret** » Fri Apr 21, 2017 8:16 am

HelloHiGoodbye wrote:We've had Vokes for years and never got enough crosses into the box.

Hard to argue with this at all and most honest supporters would agree that the service to the front men, this season at least, has been pretty dire. It`s no wonder that Vokes at times has looked cumbersome (like when he first came to us) and Gray has cut a frustrated figure. Hopefully with the addition of Brady (a `real` winger unlike Boyd `n`Arfield) we can see some quality going into the box from out wide and some more directness and breaking ability from Gudmundsson too (he has been a BIG miss).

Akin to last summer, we really need to address the midfield, how it`s set up and maybe more importantly, how they are allowed to operate.

ablueclaret · Post by **ablueclaret** » Fri Apr 21, 2017 8:28 am

We need to buy 2 midfielders, one who can control the game from the back with good vision, passing ability and decent defensively, mind you I think we already have him, and a player who has that mecurial something which enables them to unlock defences. That has to be our priority, along with another centre-half. I fancy Agyei can add something up front.

claretspice · Post by **claretspice** » Fri Apr 21, 2017 9:37 am

We've got a good crop of midfielders currently - we've signed 6 in the last 12 months, all of them technically better than the ones they replaced. It is a mistake to think that our lack of craft can be solved by just bringing in more of them.

The next level for Burnley is bringing in a forward who has a bit more subtlety. Its not just the midfield's job to unlock defences - in a 4-4-2, the second striker is the key man in linking it all together, and Ashley Barnes for all his strengths is hardly the most subtle craftsman in the world. If we're going to play with one up front, or if Gray leaves, then we'll be in the market for pace, either out wide or down the middle, perhaps in the mould of someone more like Ings, who can play behind Vokes or a target man rather than the other way round. It is no coincidence our best football under Dyche was played when Ings was at his best, buzzing around Vokes, dropping deep and linking the game together.

HiroshimaClaret · Post by **HiroshimaClaret** » Fri Apr 21, 2017 10:02 am

claretspice wrote:We've got a good crop of midfielders currently - we've signed 6 in the last 12 months, all of them technically better than the ones they replaced. It is a mistake to think that our lack of craft can be solved by just bringing in more of them.

The next level for Burnley is bringing in a forward who has a bit more subtlety. Its not just the midfield's job to unlock defences - in a 4-4-2, the second striker is the key man in linking it all together, and Ashley Barnes for all his strengths is hardly the most subtle craftsman in the world. If we're going to play with one up front, or if Gray leaves, then we'll be in the market for pace, either out wide or down the middle, perhaps in the mould of someone more like Ings, who can play behind Vokes or a target man rather than the other way round. It is no coincidence our best football under Dyche was played when Ings was at his best, buzzing around Vokes, dropping deep and linking the game together.

We did indeed play some excellent, attacking football under Dyche in his first promotion season. Of course we don`t expect those same levels in the Premier League but a modicum of it would be nice. We HAVE seen it in a few home games and away in Merseyside. I think Kightly and as you rightly pointed out a fantastic, buzzing Ings, were big parts of that. We have an upgrade on Kightly (although Kightly`s work ethic were immense) in Brady. Is there an Ings #2 out there????????

Reference your point regards the midfield, of course you`re right BUT I feel Dyche does set us up in midfield MORE to protect the defence (absolutely fine at home to Chelsea et al) and not so much to supply and get involved with the attack (Sunderland and Boro away).

claretspice · Post by **claretspice** » Fri Apr 21, 2017 10:53 am

HiroshimaClaret wrote:We did indeed play some excellent, attacking football under Dyche in his first promotion season. Of course we don`t expect those same levels in the Premier League but a modicum of it would be nice. We HAVE seen it in a few home games and away in Merseyside. I think Kightly and as you rightly pointed out a fantastic, buzzing Ings, were big parts of that. We have an upgrade on Kightly (although Kightly`s work ethic were immense) in Brady. Is there an Ings #2 out there????????

Reference your point regards the midfield, of course you`re right BUT I feel Dyche does set us up in midfield MORE to protect the defence (absolutely fine at home to Chelsea et al) and not so much to supply and get involved with the attack (Sunderland and Boro away).

There are certainly a few players out there who are in the Ings mould - Tom Lawrence (currently on loan at Ipswich from Leicester, where he seems to be well down the pecking order) and Jacob Murphy at Norwich are in the right sort of mould. Sheyi Ojo at Liverpool or even (injuries permitting) Ings himself, might be others.

But I'm not sure any of those would be the right fit if we keep Gray because we're always going to want a centre forward who can play with his back to goal and give us a base from which to play - we're not alone in this, virtually every team in the league plays with a strong centre forward, even Arsenal (Giroud), but it is important to us given the relatively direct way in which we play. And so if Gray stays, you'd be looking for a more mobile and delicate target man, which is why I've previously suggested Rodriguez. These are hard to find and it is one reason why we've been more direct with Gray at centre forward.

To some extent, determining Gray's future is key to the sorts of player we target this summer in attacking options, although we might be able to use someone like Lawrence, Ojo, or Murphy regardless because they can also give us a wide option.

ablueclaret · Post by **ablueclaret** » Fri Apr 21, 2017 11:05 am

if you think our midfield is fine Spice I'm afraid the ball retention figures tend to show different, it is the area of the park in which we are consistently outplayed.

Bordeauxclaret · Post by **Bordeauxclaret** » Fri Apr 21, 2017 11:08 am

What did you think of our ball retention last season?

claretspice · Post by **claretspice** » Fri Apr 21, 2017 11:24 am

ablueclaret wrote:if you think our midfield is fine Spice I'm afraid the ball retention figures tend to show different, it is the area of the park in which we are consistently outplayed.

Not at all Ablue. Apart from anything else, ball retention figures reflect the ability of all 11 players to keep the ball, not just the midfield 4. We aren't particularly a possession side so our retention stats will always suffer, but at present we play with 2 strikers who aren't particularly adept at keeping the ball and playing fluid football. You can't take one unit of a football team and look at it in isolation, and Hendrick, Westwood, Barton and Defour are all very decent passers of the ball.

ablueclaret · Post by **ablueclaret** » Fri Apr 21, 2017 1:58 pm

Sadly none of them have the spark needed at this level, Defour might but he will never be physically ready. Hendrick Westwood Barton solid players but don't expect too much out of the usual from them, we desperately lack creativity.

ablueclaret · Post by **ablueclaret** » Fri Apr 21, 2017 2:01 pm

Gray in particular needs balls played through to him which nobody is able to provide, you have to be able to find your man and retain sufficient possession to set-up moves or to have exceptional passers who can deliver fast, we really have neither, although I still believe Tarkowski is actually a better option than any of our midfield, but he won't stay within the framework.

claretspice · Post by **claretspice** » Fri Apr 21, 2017 2:09 pm

As I've said elsewhere, we don't currently have the ideal partner for Gray in a 4-4-2, and unless he's playing in a particularly good footballing team (i.e. a top 4 team) Gray is a striker who needs to play in a 4-4-2 because his link up game, particularly with his back to goal, is too raw. Most teams outside your fantasy world play with two central midfielders who first and foremost provide a solid base, which is what all those central midfielders do. Brady has been signed to add some extra creativity out wide, and we have Gudmundsson as an option on the other flank. Find someone to do more do link things and feed Gray from between the lines in the Sheringham-type mould and you'd solve your problem. Playi 4-5-1 with a central defender in the holding role and no-one supporting Gray and playing with their back to goal and you'll come a cropper.

You've become one-dimensional, ABC. You've fixated on a particular, theoretical style which we've tried once (at Leicester) when it ended badly, and which doesn't have too much on paper to commend another crack.

ablueclaret · Post by **ablueclaret** » Fri Apr 21, 2017 2:28 pm

I'm afraid there's only one person who's one dimensional Spice. There a variety of options available to SD within this squad as you well know, football hasn't suddenly becoming stereotyped, but he has become stagnant in his thinking.

3-5-2. 4-4-2. 4-3-3 4-5-1 the options are there and the players to do it, what is lacking is the will.

claretspice · Post by **claretspice** » Fri Apr 21, 2017 2:37 pm

ablueclaret wrote:I'm afraid there's only one person who's one dimensional Spice. There a variety of options available to SD within this squad as you well know, football hasn't suddenly becoming stereotyped, but he has become stagnant in his thinking.

3-5-2. 4-4-2. 4-3-3 4-5-1 the options are there and the players to do it, what is lacking is the will.

All your current ideas revolve around getting Tarkowski into the side, whether as a 3rd centre back or holding midfielder, and then adding Defour or other players perceived as more dashing to the midfield.

Dyche has certainly been consistent in his thinking, although he's shown the flexibility to play 4-5-1 on occasions until it became clear that wasn't working away from home. But he's been consistent - rather than stagnant because we've been successful. You want change for change's sake, when we're doing as well as could possibly be expected. The rest of us have moved on from that.

claretdom · Post by **claretdom** » Fri Apr 21, 2017 2:38 pm

ablue have you ever considered offering your services to the club ?

You could be a scout in that area, with Blake now gone they maybe open to the idea even more so with the fact you can spot a player after a few minutes.

HiroshimaClaret · Post by **HiroshimaClaret** » Fri Apr 21, 2017 2:43 pm

I`m not really up on viable options regards another striker but as spice says Gray is the issue. I REALLY like him but feel for him particularly away from home. I DO hope he stays but fear he may not. In a way, if he didn`t, it would free us up to go for the Vokes/Ings type partnership so successfully deployed a couple of years ago. Spice`s Lawrence, Ojo or Murphy options I suppose.

It`s all a good problem to have, of course, if we stay in the Premier League (surely we will!).

I have no qualms about the 4-4-2 (4-4-1-1) at home but Dyche has to earn his corn next season with a degree more flexibility away from home. We were excellent for the most part at Everton and very good for the first 20 at Liverpool (we looked UP FOR IT which I don`t think we have mostly away from home) I still reckon a 4-3-2-1 might work but it wouldn`t be with Gray or any of our other current front men. IF Vokes rediscovers his zip (good service might help) then he could do the part BUT as others have said a Jay Rodriguez OR Rondon type (for differing reasons) would fit the bill perfectly. Gonna be an interesting summer!

Heaton or NEW (hopefully not)

Lowton Tarkowski (surely to goodness!) Mee Ward

Hendrick Barton Defour (hopefully still here x2)

Gudmundsson Brady

****************

claretandy · Post by **claretandy** » Fri Apr 21, 2017 2:53 pm

claretspice wrote:As I've said elsewhere, we don't currently have the ideal partner for Gray in a 4-4-2, and unless he's playing in a particularly good footballing team (i.e. a top 4 team) Gray is a striker who needs to play in a 4-4-2 because his link up game, particularly with his back to goal, is too raw. Most teams outside your fantasy world play with two central midfielders who first and foremost provide a solid base, which is what all those central midfielders do. Brady has been signed to add some extra creativity out wide, and we have Gudmundsson as an option on the other flank. Find someone to do more do link things and feed Gray from between the lines in the Sheringham-type mould and you'd solve your problem. Playi 4-5-1 with a central defender in the holding role and no-one supporting Gray and playing with their back to goal and you'll come a cropper.

You've become one-dimensional, ABC. You've fixated on a particular, theoretical style which we've tried once (at Leicester) when it ended badly, and which doesn't have too much on paper to commend another crack.

At Leicester Defour was the midfielder in the hole which he is totally unsuited for, would like to see Hendrick tried behind Gray.

KefkaClaret · Post by **KefkaClaret** » Fri Apr 21, 2017 4:44 pm

We either get a partner for Gray or get a striker who can play up front on his own. Gray can't be a sole striker as his hold up play and his back to goal is dreadful, he's a good poacher but offers nothing else in the build up. We need a tall striker who can play up front on his own or with Gray.