Taken from the guidelines - please read

ClaretTony · Post by **ClaretTony** » Wed Jun 07, 2017 4:00 pm

Please read the guidelines and in particular the para below. Some have ignored it and the board has now become more and more cluttered with thread after thread fitting into the category below.

Some threads have been locked today for no other reason than to try and keep some sensible level of threads. If it continues then further action will need to be taken because I am receiving more and more complaints from people who do not want to see this kind of board. After all it is a football message board.

Please remember this is a football board of a club that is currently going through one of its best times in years and yet the board is currently getting filled with subjects that clearly cannot be debated properly. I've allowed quite a lot to go this week which I thought was sensible given what has happened in Manchester and then of course with the upcoming election, but if such threads continue to dominate the board then something will have to be done because many posters are far from happy.

claretdom · Post by **claretdom** » Wed Jun 07, 2017 4:01 pm

Could there not be a non football area ? That way nobody is offended by what they see.

taio · Post by **taio** » Wed Jun 07, 2017 4:05 pm

The board doesn't need a separate area. I think people just need to be mindful not to duplicate threads. For example, there could just have been one General Election thread. For those who aren't particularly interested in politics the board must have been a bit of a turn-off of late.

ClaretTony · Post by **ClaretTony** » Wed Jun 07, 2017 4:06 pm

taio wrote:For example, there could just have been one General Election thread.

There will be tomorrow

SammyBoy · Post by **SammyBoy** » Wed Jun 07, 2017 4:07 pm

I started a thread about Diane Abbott stepping down which was subsequently merged with the one about the poor TV interview she did. I have no issue with that if it was the mods opinion that it was too similar to an existing topic, which is surely the point of having moderators isn't it? At the moment I think there's only so much we can debate the bookies odds on Dyche going to Palace, I'm sure the political threads will die down a lot after tomorrow.

NottsClaret · Post by **NottsClaret** » Wed Jun 07, 2017 4:25 pm

Most boards have separate football and general stuff forums, seems to work but don't know how hard it is to do.

Sidney1st · Post by **Sidney1st** » Wed Jun 07, 2017 4:49 pm

NottsClaret wrote:Most boards have separate football and general stuff forums, seems to work but don't know how hard it is to do.

I think every other forum outside of Footy mad has 2 sections minimum that I've seen.

Football and non football.

ClaretTony · Post by **ClaretTony** » Wed Jun 07, 2017 4:50 pm

Sidney1st wrote:I think every other forum outside of Footy mad has 2 sections minimum that I've seen.

Football and non football.

And this one doesn't which is how people prefer it, but what's happened recently isn't acceptable to a lot of posters.

brexit · Post by **brexit** » Wed Jun 07, 2017 4:54 pm

I think that is a little harsh CT.
It is the post season and most of us won't leave the house again until the season kicks off. Most of us don't have any friends and our families don't contact us any more. We have sad jobs in local government with just a cheese plant for company.This is the only place anybody takes any notice of our facile musings.
Please be more tolerant.

Blackrod · Post by **Blackrod** » Wed Jun 07, 2017 4:54 pm

I'd prefer a football and non football section. Some quite good non football subjects raised on here. ( when not hijacked by imploding turtle).

Sidney1st · Post by **Sidney1st** » Wed Jun 07, 2017 4:55 pm

ClaretTony wrote:And this one doesn't which is how people prefer it, but what's happened recently isn't acceptable to a lot of posters.

Rock and a hard place then isn't it?

You'll always get people making their own thread to get their point across, it happens for football related topics all through out the season.
Out of interest do you get the same number of complaints then, or is it just the political stuff people don't like seeing multiple threads for?

For example ABC has been making multiple threads to get the same point across all season, but it's never been seen as an issue as much as political threads seem to be now.

We either need to accept the forum how it is and the issues that arise or make a seperate non football section and keep everyone happy.
You won't be able to stop multiple threads unless you have mods to pre-approve the creation of threads and that would harm the forum.

FactualFrank · Post by **FactualFrank** » Wed Jun 07, 2017 4:58 pm

A simple quick-fire way to reduce the amount of crap and silly squabbles .... ban politics.

ClaretTony · Post by **ClaretTony** » Wed Jun 07, 2017 4:59 pm

FactualFrank wrote:A simple quick-fire way to reduce the amount of crap and silly squabbles .... ban politics.

It is one of the potential solutions

Wile E Coyote · Post by **Wile E Coyote** » Wed Jun 07, 2017 5:00 pm

i was just about to post something about magnetism through the ages !! drat, I shall have to save it for another time.

taio · Post by **taio** » Wed Jun 07, 2017 5:04 pm

FactualFrank wrote:A simple quick-fire way to reduce the amount of crap and silly squabbles .... ban politics.

Would be detrimental to this board and there are better ways to manage than a straight embargo

South West Claret. · Post by **South West Claret.** » Wed Jun 07, 2017 5:21 pm

ClaretTony wrote:Please read the guidelines and in particular the para below. Some have ignored it and the board has now become more and more cluttered with thread after thread fitting into the category below.

Some threads have been locked today for no other reason than to try and keep some sensible level of threads. If it continues then further action will need to be taken because I am receiving more and more complaints from people who do not want to see this kind of board. After all it is a football message board.

Please remember this is a football board of a club that is currently going through one of its best times in years and yet the board is currently getting filled with subjects that clearly cannot be debated properly. I've allowed quite a lot to go this week which I thought was sensible given what has happened in Manchester and then of course with the upcoming election, but if such threads continue to dominate the board then something will have to be done because many posters are far from happy.

Thanks you make a good point about duplicate threads about the same subject.

But at the same time:

A) I don't see why that the "many posters that are far from happy" simply can't move down the list of threads and ignore the ones they don't like just like I suspect the vast majority of us do.

B) No matter what a message boards theme is (Football in this case) in the spirit of healthy debate and broadening peoples outlook on life surely off topics are a healthy addition?

C) Also to help with revenue for the site the advertisers usually want more people to see their adds and with a broader subject base this may well attract more viewers.

D) I never understand why separate boards are needed given the above in (A)... also lets not forget that "variety is the spice of life" I'm sure I'm not the only one who enjoys some of the O/T especially out of season.

gc14 · Post by **gc14** » Wed Jun 07, 2017 5:22 pm

I quite like the board having a few topics away from football.. i used to love the music threads where people posted tunes,
informative news for example the passing of Peter Sallis, even the police incident threads are useful for quite a few people
A lot has gone on in the past few weeks news wise and with the upcoming election i realise it does get tiresome having so many 'experts' telling you how to vote but it will be over shortly .. It's coincided with a month of little football news to report so hopefully in a couple of weeks we can get back to a bit of normality and questions if you can pay on the day at Kidderminster ..

SammyBoy · Post by **SammyBoy** » Wed Jun 07, 2017 5:31 pm

FactualFrank wrote:A simple quick-fire way to reduce the amount of crap and silly squabbles .... ban politics.

I don't think this is a good idea, I really like some of the political debate on this forum and as mentioned it's easy to spot which threads are along these lines if it's not your bag. Granted there's been more than usual lately but I'd probably visit here a lot less if it was purely football.

DCWat · Post by **DCWat** » Wed Jun 07, 2017 5:33 pm

I don't see an issue with new threads being started, if the subject matter warrants it. New threads have on the whole started following an event or something newsworthy. Posting in an existing thread can result in something being lost in and amongst.

Admittedly most threads lately have been of a political nature and these do tend to descend into the same posters taking exactly the same stance as on the other threads. The debates are generally interesting and I enjoy reading various views, until it descends into insults and tiresome toing and froing.

The board needs a variety of topics and for me, as long as the line isn't crossed, nothing should be out of bounds.

Tall Paul · Post by **Tall Paul** » Wed Jun 07, 2017 5:40 pm

Perhaps the "guidelines" need to be more clearly defined.

evensteadiereddie · Post by **evensteadiereddie** » Wed Jun 07, 2017 5:53 pm

I'd like the division to be made between football and non-football threads.
Nothing wrong with political discussion at all nor even the merits or otherwise of Ariana Grande's singing voice but we are tending to get the same polarised posters offering their same, repetitive polarised opinion and, failing that, the plain silly, pointless wind-up merchants who will say anything to grab attention.
It's been a bad couple of weeks on this board and it's a shame you're going to have to act, Tony, but some posters do really need to know when to shut up and resist making their crass comments regarding the terrifying issues being discussed.
A case in point was the One Love Manchester concert thread. Was it really necessary for one poster to **** on the parade and post a snarky comment re the young lass who put the whole thing together. I must admit I nearly lost it, my daughter is a trainee teacher in Manchester and knows a couple of kids who were there, not hurt but near enough to be almost scared to death and who are still not quite right although they did get to Old Trafford so this is a little bit close to home as it were.
For all our sparring over the season, I would quite happily have severely battered him (which is quite ironic, really), as old as I am and as young and/or retarded he is.
Luckily, all is well now and the berk's idiocy has been put in perspective but, no, don't ban politics and other general subjects, just make it so that you have to actually choose to read them if you wish, maybe by placing them on a different part of the site.

SammyBoy · Post by **SammyBoy** » Wed Jun 07, 2017 5:57 pm

evensteadiereddie wrote:I'd like the division to be made between football and non-football threads.
Nothing wrong with political discussion at all nor even the merits or otherwise of Ariana Grande's singing voice but we are tending to get the same polarised posters offering their same, repetitive polarised opinion and, failing that, the plain silly, pointless wind-up merchants who will say anything to grab attention.
It's been a bad couple of weeks on this board and it's a shame you're going to have to act, Tony, but some posters do really need to know when to shut up and resist making their crass comments regarding the terrifying issues being discussed.
A case in point was the One Love Manchester concert thread. Was it really necessary for one poster to **** on the parade and post a snarky comment re the young lass who put the whole thing together. I must admit I nearly lost it, my daughter is a trainee teacher in Manchester and knows a couple of kids who were there, not hurt but near enough to be almost scared to death and who are still not quite right although they did get to Old Trafford so this is a little bit close to home as it were.
For all our sparring over the season, I would quite happily have severely battered him (which is quite ironic, really), as old as I am and as young and/or retarded he is.
Luckily, all is well now and the berk's idiocy has been put in perspective but, no, don't ban politics and other general subjects, just make it so that you have to actually choose to read them if you wish, maybe by placing them on a different part of the site.

No prizes for guessing who that's a reference to. I have a feeling I know who he is outside of UTC and he seems like a prat in reality as well.

nil_desperandum · Post by **nil_desperandum** » Wed Jun 07, 2017 5:59 pm

FactualFrank wrote:A simple quick-fire way to reduce the amount of crap and silly squabbles .... ban politics.

So, go on, how would you define what was political and what wasn't?. Some would be obvious but there would be some huge grey areas. How much time would mods have to spend determining whether a post could potentially become political.?
Let's take the Andre Gray thread (e.g.) earlier in the season concerning his tweets.

evensteadiereddie · Post by **evensteadiereddie** » Wed Jun 07, 2017 6:01 pm

Fair enough, thanks for that, sammy.
All is well now but I think it shows the need for separate thread pages.

evensteadiereddie · Post by **evensteadiereddie** » Wed Jun 07, 2017 6:03 pm

Easy, nil. If we're talking about the effect of his ban on him or the club, it'sfootball.
If we're discussing whether it was fair, justified and so on, politics.

nil_desperandum · Post by **nil_desperandum** » Wed Jun 07, 2017 6:09 pm

evensteadiereddie wrote:Easy, nil. If we're talking about the effect of his ban on him or the club, it'sfootball.
If we're discussing whether it was fair, justified and so on, politics.

Yes, but how do the mods know which direction a thread will go once it has started.In any case, surely debating whether it is fair or justified would be a reasonable thing to do in the context of Andre's case?
Also, a perfectly sensible thread could be hijacked by someone introducing a political element, and then it would have to be pulled.

ClaretTony · Post by **ClaretTony** » Wed Jun 07, 2017 6:12 pm

nil_desperandum wrote:Yes, but how do the mods know which direction a thread will go once it has started.In any case, surely debating whether it is fair or justified would be a reasonable thing to do in the context of Andre's case?
Also, a perfectly sensible thread could be hijacked by someone introducing a political element, and then it would have to be pulled.

And yet we still can't do right for doing wrong with some posters. This week we've been accused of being politically biased, of being over zealous, of not being zealous enough and I've had a seriously abusive and threatening email from a poster who had posts removed because they were seriously abusive.

There have been some very sensible comments on this thread and there are always two sides to every discussion and argument. My role here is to satisfy both sides and that I'm finding very difficult.

Rick_Muller · Post by **Rick_Muller** » Wed Jun 07, 2017 6:21 pm

I like the board the way it is. Yes, agreed, of late there have been some threads where there has been some animosity but also good discussion amongst all. It would be a detriment to the forum if moderation became more critical and severe, and I feel we would lose what a great medium we have for sharing ideas and thoughts. It is a football forum, but we all know that other issues are raised, discussed and advised upon and generally all is well, including the banter.

On another thread I mentioned censorship, because that's how it felt at the time. I merely asked for an explanantion as to why some threads appeared to be locked without reason. This is now clearer for me, thanks.

gandhisflipflop · Post by **gandhisflipflop** » Wed Jun 07, 2017 6:22 pm

I enjoy politics but even I have been overwhelmed by the sheer about of political threads on this board recently. It's not just confined to UTC, FB is just as bad too. Yesterday I counted no fewer then eleven separate threads just on the same page that is politically related. It's a football board.

dpinsussex · Post by **dpinsussex** » Wed Jun 07, 2017 6:22 pm

To be honest. Doesnt bother me one way or the other, bit of footy and non footy is good for the soul.
Duplicates can be a bit of a pain but mods are usually pretty good at merging them.
No complaints from me, keep up the good work Tony et al

cloughyclaret · Post by **cloughyclaret** » Wed Jun 07, 2017 6:22 pm

With respect Tony, we are all (well I thought we were) grown ups and it is not all down to you to make people behave themselves. I actually thinkyou have handled this very well.
Some of the posters on the 'political' threads have played a tit for tat abusive game that has become tiresome beyond belief. (You know who you are). Thread upon thread became a direct personal abuse system. Two in particular have made me give up reading them.

If you cant post (debate) with respect just as you would in a RL situation then you get banned for a time,its as simple as that for me.

claretblue · Post by **claretblue** » Wed Jun 07, 2017 6:24 pm

'...Could there not be a non football area ?....'

Ewood?

dpinsussex · Post by **dpinsussex** » Wed Jun 07, 2017 6:24 pm

cloughyclaret wrote:With respect Tony, we are all (well I thought we were) grown ups and it is not all down to you to make people behave themselves. I actually thinkyou have handled this very well.
Some of the posters on the 'political' threads have played a tit for tat abusive game that has become tiresome beyond belief. (You know who you are). Thread upon thread became a direct personal abuse system. Two in particular have made me give up reading them.

If you cant post (debate) with respect just as you would in a RL situation then you get banned for a time,its as simple as that for me.

Those individuals probably dont even debate in RL with respect

DCWat · Post by **DCWat** » Wed Jun 07, 2017 6:28 pm

I don't really get the need for separate pages for topic types. It's not like we are Man United and have vast numbers of posters.

Is it so difficult to determine from a thread title whether it's something that is of interest or not?

BleedingClaret · Post by **BleedingClaret** » Wed Jun 07, 2017 6:33 pm

I don't like cricket threads, when the football season is still in session.

COBBLE · Post by **COBBLE** » Wed Jun 07, 2017 6:34 pm

Tony, its a pity you have been placed in this situation and I agree that you have to reign in some of the obsessive, political and personal rants that have at times dominated the board. I have spoken to many people who won't post because of it. Most of us see this board as the best form of social media amongst people with an attachment to Burnley and its football club. Its a place to keep up with what is happening at the Club and in the locality. Some of the well-being advice has been stimulating and heroic. If this unbalanced, dogmatic behaviour is eliminated I suspect you will see many more contributors than you lose and a larger more valuable board.

Braindead · Post by **Braindead** » Wed Jun 07, 2017 6:37 pm

I am assuming the comment about banning politics being a potential solution is a joke?
I occasionally comment on them myself and yes, the usual spunkbubbles tend to ruin them with their personal vendettas, but a ban? Come on.
Ban the individuals, not the subject matter.

Dom · Post by **Dom** » Wed Jun 07, 2017 6:40 pm

I find a lot of threads descend into petty tit for tat name calling. It's boring at it derails a lot of threads.

If I see something that is clearly trolling I'll ignore it most of the time, some people respond all the time, often multiple times.

Banning politics would be a Ham fisted way of managing it, most chats are pretty good until they are derailed.

But there are a group of about 8 posters who regularly abuse each other. People need to grow up a bit.

BleedingClaret · Post by **BleedingClaret** » Wed Jun 07, 2017 6:40 pm

On a serious note, I don't do any social media, Facebook twitter etc, other than Up the clarets.
I'm an individual who hasn't read a book since I was 11 and I'm 50, but today as a result of a debate on here I read the Human Rights Act from start to finish.
IMO It is not the diverse nature of the topics but the personal abuse, especially when the it's a one on one handbag fight.

boiledclaret · Post by **boiledclaret** » Wed Jun 07, 2017 7:02 pm

I've been copying and pasting some of the polarizations that we've been subjected to of late. Here's a handful or more that we've had.

Stuff your liberal thinking up your arse. Send them all back. The thought police haven't got me. They're frightened of being accused of racism. Political Correctness gone mad. Snowflakes. Liberal Apologists.Terrorist sympathizers. Community cohesion. Libtards. White handkerchief waving sandal wearers. Radicalized Islamic appeasement chimps. Liberal bed wetters, human rights agenda”

Oh and finally, "Don't bother talking to me if you're a member of the bleeding hearts brigade." Fine, I won't bother then.

I don't know whats more frightening these days. The state of the nation or the state of the buzzspeak English language.

I think the level of non football threads has been understandable and banning politics is very bad form. Just needs more common sense, posters adding to existing forums and mods pulling threads if they're too samey.

Hipper · Post by **Hipper** » Wed Jun 07, 2017 7:06 pm

Dom wrote:But there are a group of about 8 posters who regularly abuse each other. People need to grow up a bit.

Yet some of those posters do offer interesting viewpoints and information at times. It is therefore those posters that need to learn how to behave and warned about their conduct. Why should they spoil it for the rest of us?

IndigoLake · Post by **IndigoLake** » Wed Jun 07, 2017 7:20 pm

The number of political threads was getting ridiculous. There was a point yesterday where the first 6 or 7 threads were all political. Mind you, I don't blame people - there's hardly a lot of football news to talk about right now.

Vegas Claret · Post by **Vegas Claret** » Wed Jun 07, 2017 7:22 pm

I'd also call for a non-football area, whilst sometimes the debates get out of hand there are many posters that offer great opinions and information about various topics. Pretty much every single football board has non-football related section.

If certain people keep causing trouble and get abusive then ban them

1968claret · Post by **1968claret** » Wed Jun 07, 2017 7:25 pm

ClaretTony wrote:And yet we still can't do right for doing wrong with some posters. This week we've been accused of being politically biased, of being over zealous, of not being zealous enough and I've had a seriously abusive and threatening email from a poster who had posts removed because they were seriously abusive.

There have been some very sensible comments on this thread and there are always two sides to every discussion and argument. My role here is to satisfy both sides and that I'm finding very difficult.

You will never please everyone. I for one am happy with the way the board is run. Yes there a small number of posters who do cause problems, but I just ignore them.
Do what you think is right. Those that don't like it can always find another board.

Bin Ont Turf · Post by **Bin Ont Turf** » Wed Jun 07, 2017 8:36 pm

boiledclaret wrote:White handkerchief waving sandal wearers

You're in breach of copyright and you'll be hearing from my legal team in due course.

titsoutforthelads · Post by **titsoutforthelads** » Wed Jun 07, 2017 8:39 pm

Its somewhat ironic that the main poster that normally hijacks the political threads has kept well away from here.
Guess he is too busy posting elsewhere.

RocketLawnChair · Post by **RocketLawnChair** » Wed Jun 07, 2017 8:41 pm

Perhaps we could Vote on it !

Bin Ont Turf · Post by **Bin Ont Turf** » Wed Jun 07, 2017 8:42 pm

RocketLawnChair wrote:Perhaps we could Vote on it !

Have you ever read a Player Ratings thread on here?

CrosspoolClarets · Post by **CrosspoolClarets** » Wed Jun 07, 2017 8:46 pm

On a personal level I find both the football and politics threads interesting, the former due to being a football fan and the latter because it is interesting to get a sense from someone whose beliefs you know a bit about rather than an anonymous person on a BBC or other national forum.

You are never going to avoid some people posting once or twice a day (like me) and others hundreds of times a day. But you can avoid too many threads. What makes the messageboard hard for me to scan through quickly on a tea break is when there are 200 threads a day. On threads of all topics, there has been too much duplication or pointlessness in recent months and I personally find it harder to scan through than a single thread of a few hundred posts.

If the numbers of threads were reduced it would make it easier for everyone to simply ignore the ones they are not interested in.

The other thing I find irritating is abuse and wind ups, but that is another issue. 95% of people have debated even difficult topics like politics very respectfully.

RocketLawnChair · Post by **RocketLawnChair** » Wed Jun 07, 2017 8:47 pm

Bin Ont Turf wrote:Have you ever read a Player Ratings thread on here?

No! they just get dominated by the same 7 or 8 morons...