UK Economy suffers Triple Blow

RingoMcCartney · Post by **RingoMcCartney** » Wed Jul 26, 2017 9:06 am

Lancasterclaret wrote:All HS2 will do is move the commuters to London into the areas where they currently are not.

That not a problem in itself, but it does seem a ridiculously expensive way doing it.

Agree with you there lancs.

Also the cooling from the government on a northern power house" is bad.

They've now announced a multi billion pound Cross rail 2. To get from one side of London to the other.

Yet when it comes to getting from one side of ENGLAND to the other. We're skint.

Lancasterclaret · Post by **Lancasterclaret** » Wed Jul 26, 2017 9:10 am

We are finally getting somewhere here Ringo.

Now extrapolate that thinking to the EU funding that Burnley get. We've been here before I know but this is exactly what I'm on about!

When that goes, where are the Conservative govt going to put that money?

That is what I fear I'm afraid.

RingoMcCartney · Post by **RingoMcCartney** » Wed Jul 26, 2017 9:16 am

I'll keep away from Brexit but analysis shows-

Other projects in the capital including tube improvements mean that £5,426 will have been spent on each resident of London compared to £223 on those in the north-east region. That’s over 24 times as much.

Scandalous.

quoonbeatz · Post by **quoonbeatz** » Wed Jul 26, 2017 9:17 am

RocketLawnChair wrote:
Yet every time we get a 'negative' news item it's taken as gospel by some on here.

lets have the full sentence eh, so it keeps the context.

those three announcements can also be taken as gospel, they are factual and are happening.

the thing with the 'negative' news is that there's a hell of a lot more of it so less than a couple of thousand jobs being created in the south east isn't really going to counterbalance it.

quoonbeatz · Post by **quoonbeatz** » Wed Jul 26, 2017 9:19 am

RingoMcCartney wrote:Agree with you there lancs.

Also the cooling from the government on a northern power house" is bad.

They've now announced a multi billion pound Cross rail 2. To get from one side of London to the other.

Yet when it comes to getting from one side of ENGLAND to the other. We're skint.

yep, the crossrail thing was what i was alluding to rather than HS2.

binning the electrification of the transpennine line but giving a second, needless cross-london vanity project the go ahead shows exactly where things are headed.

RocketLawnChair · Post by **RocketLawnChair** » Wed Jul 26, 2017 9:46 am

quoonbeatz wrote:lets have the full sentence eh, so it keeps the context.

those three announcements can also be taken as gospel, they are factual and are happening.

the thing with the 'negative' news is that there's a hell of a lot more of it so less than a couple of thousand jobs being created in the south east isn't really going to counterbalance it.

Ok then what about the positive news that the expansion of Burnley Bridge could create up to 1000 new jobs (meaningless) 5 jobs to go at Moorhouse's brewery (big news)

People love a feeding frenzy on negative news.

quoonbeatz · Post by **quoonbeatz** » Wed Jul 26, 2017 11:10 am

RocketLawnChair wrote:Ok then what about the positive news that the expansion of Burnley Bridge could create up to 1000 new jobs (meaningless) 5 jobs to go at Moorhouse's brewery (big news)

People love a feeding frenzy on negative news.

i haven't heard either news item tbh but who said the first was meaningless and the second was big news?

JohnMcGreal · Post by **JohnMcGreal** » Fri Oct 06, 2017 9:41 am

So much for Donald Trump's America helping us out after Brexit:

https://www.ft.com/content/92bb5636-a95 ... 7?mhq5j=e7" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

http://www.politico.eu/article/us-round ... es-deepen/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Oh and here's The Federation of German Industries (you know, those people who we were told would be pressuring Merkel to cut us a good deal?) telling German firms to make provisions for a 'very hard Brexit':

http://uk.reuters.com/article/uk-britai ... KKBN1CA0KV" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Spijed · Post by **Spijed** » Fri Oct 06, 2017 9:44 am

The FT link has got a paywall

JohnMcGreal · Post by **JohnMcGreal** » Fri Oct 06, 2017 9:44 am

Apologies, it does. Same story here:

http://www.politico.eu/article/us-round ... es-deepen/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Imploding Turtle · Post by **Imploding Turtle** » Fri Oct 06, 2017 9:47 am

It's a little bit funny though. Watching them all scrambling to re-rationalise their decision. Eventually some of the are going to give it up and just admit it - they don't like foreigners coming here.

dsr · Post by **dsr** » Fri Oct 06, 2017 10:02 am

What's the issue here? We won't be able to import all the food we need because countries are going to refuse to sell it to us?

Imploding Turtle · Post by **Imploding Turtle** » Fri Oct 06, 2017 10:07 am

dsr wrote:What's the issue here? We won't be able to import all the food we need because countries are going to refuse to sell it to us?

Don't worry your little self. Trading with the world post-brexit will be easy peasy. Right? Front of the queue etc yadda yadda.

dsr · Post by **dsr** » Fri Oct 06, 2017 10:10 am

Imploding Turtle wrote:Don't worry your little self. Trading with the world post-brexit will be easy peasy. Right? Front of the queue etc yadda yadda.

I'm not bothered about quotas anyway. I'm a free trader, not a protectionist.

But I still don't get what the issue is. Buying stuff from the rest of the world will not be difficult - we aren't going to be sitting there with pots of cash to buy someone else's stuff while that someone else refuses to sell it to us.

Imploding Turtle · Post by **Imploding Turtle** » Fri Oct 06, 2017 10:18 am

dsr wrote:I'm not bothered about quotas anyway. I'm a free trader, not a protectionist.

But I still don't get what the issue is. Buying stuff from the rest of the world will not be difficult - we aren't going to be sitting there with pots of cash to buy someone else's stuff while that someone else refuses to sell it to us.

Whose pot of cash? Our governments? You really want our government to be taxing us and then using it to pay for foreign services and stuff instead of feeding it back into our own economy?

"Pots of cash"

At least it won't be coming from a magic tree because that would be too perfect.

dsr · Post by **dsr** » Fri Oct 06, 2017 10:27 am

Imploding Turtle wrote:Whose pot of cash? Our governments? You really want our government to be taxing us and then using it to pay for foreign services and stuff instead of feeding it back into our own economy?

"Pots of cash" At least it won't be coming from a magic tree because that would be too perfect.

Well, maybe there's something about the import of food that I don't get, or perhaps it's you that doesn't get it. But to my mind, food is imported by private enterprises, not the government, so it's the private enterprises that pay for it. Anyway, I reckon it would be a good idea to grow more of our own food and put some of this abandoned farmland back into use, so if there are export restrictions that's what we'll have to do.

Imploding Turtle · Post by **Imploding Turtle** » Fri Oct 06, 2017 10:32 am

dsr wrote:Well, maybe there's something about the import of food that I don't get, or perhaps it's you that doesn't get it. But to my mind, food is imported by private enterprises, not the government, so it's the private enterprises that pay for it. Anyway, I reckon it would be a good idea to grow more of our own food and put some of this abandoned farmland back into use, so if there are export restrictions that's what we'll have to do.

You said "we" so I assumed you were talking about "our" money and not that of private enterprises. Because it would be kind of odd of you to advocate the appropriation of other peoples money like that.

dsr · Post by **dsr** » Fri Oct 06, 2017 10:52 am

Imploding Turtle wrote:You said "we" so I assumed you were talking about "our" money and not that of private enterprises. Because it would be kind of odd of you to advocate the appropriation of other peoples money like that.

I should really make allowances for your desperate desire to misunderstand. Basically I was talking about "UK plc".

RocketLawnChair · Post by **RocketLawnChair** » Fri Oct 06, 2017 11:09 am

JohnMcGreal wrote:So much for Donald Trump's America helping us out after Brexit:

https://www.ft.com/content/92bb5636-a95 ... 7?mhq5j=e7" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

http://www.politico.eu/article/us-round ... es-deepen/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Oh and here's The Federation of German Industries (you know, those people who we were told would be pressuring Merkel to cut us a good deal?) telling German firms to make provisions for a 'very hard Brexit':

http://uk.reuters.com/article/uk-britai ... KKBN1CA0KV" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

I still stick by my original thoughts when I read articles like these, Their are good and bad parts to leaving the EU just has there would have been had we remained.

We will continue to have the extreme propaganda of the Remain camp compared to the more pragmatic beliefs of the Leave camp. The truth will be about the middle as it always generally is.

I mean just read that lamb article for example. If ever figures were manufactured to suit an argument that's it. One country imports 30000 tons of lamb to be consumed (if we eat all that we'd be baaing) whilst the other 27 combined import 70000 tons to be consumed between them approx 2500 tons each and several of the 27 countries with far greater populations than ours.

No need to argue back or tell me I am wrong because my stance remains the same, I am going too wait and see.

quoonbeatz · Post by **quoonbeatz** » Fri Oct 06, 2017 11:11 am

RocketLawnChair wrote:We will continue to have the extreme propaganda of the Remain camp compared to the more pragmatic beliefs of the Leave camp.

Imploding Turtle · Post by **Imploding Turtle** » Fri Oct 06, 2017 11:16 am

RocketLawnChair wrote: We will continue to have the extreme propaganda of the Remain camp compared to the more pragmatic beliefs of the Leave camp.

RocketLawnChair · Post by **RocketLawnChair** » Fri Oct 06, 2017 11:17 am

I don't even know why I replied Quoon, I don't even actually care one way or tuther !!

RocketLawnChair · Post by **RocketLawnChair** » Fri Oct 06, 2017 11:24 am

Imploding Turtle wrote:

Que sera sera. I am just a bit bored today tbh IT...

Imploding Turtle · Post by **Imploding Turtle** » Fri Oct 06, 2017 11:25 am

RocketLawnChair wrote:Que sera sera. I am just a bit bored today tbh IT...

It's Friday. Today we drink.

dsr · Post by **dsr** » Fri Oct 06, 2017 11:27 am

RocketLawnChair wrote:One country imports 30000 tons of lamb to be consumed (if we eat all that we'd be baaing) whilst the other 27 combined import 70000 tons to be consumed between them approx 2500 tons each and several of the 27 countries with far greater populations than ours.

It's only a pound of lamb per person per year. On average we eat 10 pounds of lamb per year, so apparently about 10% is imported.

RocketLawnChair · Post by **RocketLawnChair** » Fri Oct 06, 2017 11:29 am

dsr wrote:It's only a pound of lamb per person per year. On average we eat 10 pounds of lamb per year, so apparently about 10% is imported.

I don't care, really I don't.

Imploding Turtle · Post by **Imploding Turtle** » Fri Oct 06, 2017 11:30 am

It couldn't matter less but we also feed some lamb to animals. Or at least we call it lamb incase Snuggles can read the label. **** knows what it really is.

CrosspoolClarets · Post by **CrosspoolClarets** » Fri Oct 06, 2017 11:34 am

I read a line last night in Varoufakis’s book after the EU. I’ll quote it. I doubt he would mind.

“Logic hardly mattered. Mutual economic advantage was irrelevant. The creditors did not want their money back. What mattered to them was their authority, and that was being challenged by a leftist government whose success at negotiating a new deal for its country was the creditor’s greatest nightmare, as it might give ideas to other Europeans labouring under the same crisis and the same irrational policies”.

That sums it up. History is repeating itself with us. The German industries are correct. There is a risk of a hard Brexit, but who is it that is not playing ball? If we leave in this manner, will these companies allow others to do the same, or will they recognise there is a problem with the EU and make efforts to reform it into what it should have been originally - a free trading partnership of nation states, rather than some being completely dominated by others?

That’s why we have to leave, and if the EU forces it to be chaotic, so be it. Blackmail doesn’t tend to work on Brits, not those of us with backbone anyway.

Imploding Turtle · Post by **Imploding Turtle** » Fri Oct 06, 2017 11:44 am

You don't have a backbone. You want to crumple at the slightest signal of adversity. When someone blew themselves up in Manchester it was you lot who were getting really angry that the terrorism wasn't working. You people were getting really angry that some of us refused to let it change us.

Likewise with Brexit. As soon as it becomes difficult you want to crumple and blame the meanies in the EU for not being nice to you. And if you had a backbone you'd have stood up to the people who were lying to you to secure your Leave vote, instead of getting on your knees for them and begging them to keep telling you what you like to hear.

Tall Paul · Post by **Tall Paul** » Fri Oct 06, 2017 11:49 am

dsr wrote:It's only a pound of lamb per person per year. On average we eat 10 pounds of lamb per year, so apparently about 10% is imported.

They were just made up figures by way of an example.

RocketLawnChair · Post by **RocketLawnChair** » Fri Oct 06, 2017 11:57 am

IT had a little lamb
He tied it to a pylon
10000 volts went up its arse
And turned it's wool to Nylon

God I'm bored !

RingoMcCartney · Post by **RingoMcCartney** » Fri Oct 06, 2017 1:09 pm

More good news!

Toyota announce they'll produce new model in the UK!

What was it that the former chancellor, and lying Remoaner, said about,

"a vote for brexit would see confidence in the UK economy , evaporate over nigh!?"

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/20 ... uk-economy" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Just one of many many lies told by operation fear.

Great news on the jobs front though. Despite what the self loathing, economically masochistic Remoaners believe.

UpTheBeehole · Post by **UpTheBeehole** » Fri Oct 06, 2017 1:12 pm

RingoMcCartney wrote:More good news!

Toyota announce they'll produce new model in the UK!

What was it that the former chancellor, and lying Remoaner, said about,

"a vote for brexit would see confidence in the UK economy , evaporate over nigh!?"

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/20 ... uk-economy" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Just one of many many lies told by operation fear.

Great news on the jobs front though. Despite what the self loathing, economically masochistic Remoaners believe.

LONDON (Reuters) - Japanese carmaker Toyota intends to build its next generation Auris car at its British car plant on the assumption that the government will secure a transitional Brexit deal, two sources familiar with the matter told Reuters.

https://uk.reuters.com/article/uk-brita ... KKBN1CB14Y

RingoMcCartney · Post by **RingoMcCartney** » Fri Oct 06, 2017 1:14 pm

Your point is......

quoonbeatz · Post by **quoonbeatz** » Fri Oct 06, 2017 1:17 pm

RingoMcCartney wrote: Toyota announce they'll produce new model in the UK!

... assuming we get a trade deal that gives us the same access as now.

nil_desperandum · Post by **nil_desperandum** » Fri Oct 06, 2017 1:19 pm

RingoMcCartney wrote:More good news!

Toyota announce they'll produce new model in the UK!

It is potentially good news, but you missed out the key point of the story.
"LONDON (Reuters) - Japanese carmaker Toyota intends to build its next generation Auris car at its British car plant on the assumption that the government will secure a transitional Brexit deal, two sources familiar with the matter told Reuters.
Current evidence suggests that this government isn't capable of securing a transitional deal, and there are still many - who in case - think we should just walk away.
Edit: You two beat me to it, but worth repeating anyway.

Imploding Turtle · Post by **Imploding Turtle** » Fri Oct 06, 2017 1:20 pm

RingoMcCartney wrote:More good news!

Toyota announce they'll produce new model in the UK!

What was it that the former chancellor, and lying Remoaner, said about,

"a vote for brexit would see confidence in the UK economy , evaporate over nigh!?"

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/20 ... uk-economy" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Just one of many many lies told by operation fear.

Great news on the jobs front though. Despite what the self loathing, economically masochistic Remoaners believe.

The stock markets and currency crashed overnight the night of the referendum you ******* idiot.

RingoMcCartney · Post by **RingoMcCartney** » Fri Oct 06, 2017 1:20 pm

quoonbeatz wrote:... assuming we get a trade deal that gives us the same access as now.

Lots of ifs lots of buts. Lots of let's look for the doom n gloom.

No celebration that 1000s of good quality private sector manufacturing jobs will be secured.

No. Just misery.

And zero exodus that lying Remoaners assured us, would happen.

Keep smiling.

RingoMcCartney · Post by **RingoMcCartney** » Fri Oct 06, 2017 1:22 pm

nil_desperandum wrote:It is potentially good news, but you missed out the key point of the story.
"LONDON (Reuters) - Japanese carmaker Toyota intends to build its next generation Auris car at its British car plant on the assumption that the government will secure a transitional Brexit deal, two sources familiar with the matter told Reuters.
Current evidence suggests that this government isn't capable of securing a transitional deal, and there are still many - who in case - think we should just walk away.
Edit: You two beat me to it, but worth repeating anyway.

Yep! More economic masochism and whining.

See my post # 38.

nil_desperandum · Post by **nil_desperandum** » Fri Oct 06, 2017 1:23 pm

RingoMcCartney wrote:Lots of ifs lots of buts. Lots of let's look for the doom n gloom.

No celebration that 1000s of good quality private sector manufacturing jobs will be secured.
.

But as things are looking - they won't. And if Mrs May is pushed out and we get a "Hard-Brexiteer" as PM then it won't happen.

RingoMcCartney · Post by **RingoMcCartney** » Fri Oct 06, 2017 1:24 pm

Imploding Turtle wrote:The stock markets and currency crashed overnight the night of the referendum you ******* idiot.

I do not engage with idiots, as they lower you down to their level, and beat you with experience.

RingoMcCartney · Post by **RingoMcCartney** » Fri Oct 06, 2017 1:25 pm

nil_desperandum wrote:But as things are looking - they won't. And if Mrs May is pushed out and we get a "Hard-Brexiteer" as PM then it won't happen.

Again #38

quoonbeatz · Post by **quoonbeatz** » Fri Oct 06, 2017 1:27 pm

RingoMcCartney wrote:Lots of ifs lots of buts. Lots of let's look for the doom n gloom.

No celebration that 1000s of good quality private sector manufacturing jobs will be secured.

No. Just misery.

And zero exodus that lying Remoaners assured us, would happen.

Keep smiling.

i'm always smiling, thanks, i've got plenty of things to celebrate.

although this toyota announcement isn't one of them seeing as toyota haven't announced anything.

RingoMcCartney · Post by **RingoMcCartney** » Fri Oct 06, 2017 1:29 pm

Another whopper from a combined Cameron, Farron and Harmann!

"Leave vote would be economic bomb for the uk economy!"

UKhttps://www.theguardian.com/politics/2016/jun/0 ... uk-economy" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

In reality investment from Siemens , Nissan and now Toyota.

Have a miserable, self loathing afternoon ladies.

Imploding Turtle · Post by **Imploding Turtle** » Fri Oct 06, 2017 1:29 pm

RingoMcCartney wrote:I do not engage with idiots, as they lower you down to their level, and beat you with experience.

We can tell when you learned those new words

dsr · Post by **dsr** » Fri Oct 06, 2017 1:32 pm

Imploding Turtle wrote:The stock markets and currency crashed overnight the night of the referendum you ******* idiot.

The FTSE is up 20.5% since the referendum.

nil_desperandum · Post by **nil_desperandum** » Fri Oct 06, 2017 1:34 pm

RingoMcCartney wrote:
In reality investment from Siemens , Nissan and now Toyota.

Have a miserable, self loathing afternoon ladies.

Oh. Everything will be absolutely fine then, (he says smiling effusively, through gritted teeth).

RingoMcCartney · Post by **RingoMcCartney** » Fri Oct 06, 2017 1:35 pm

Imploding Turtle wrote:We can tell when you learned those new words

An idiot.

An obsessed idiot

Imploding Turtle · Post by **Imploding Turtle** » Fri Oct 06, 2017 1:38 pm

dsr wrote:The FTSE is up 20.5% since the referendum.

That often happens when you devalue a currency, the share prices go up because each share is worth less than it was before in the global market. One thing you can be sure about is that the value of those shares didn't go up anything close to 20% since the referendum.

But Ringo was specifically criticising Darling's prediction that the economy would collapse overnight, and it did collapse overnight. So Ringo's talking ****, as he always is.

UpTheBeehole · Post by **UpTheBeehole** » Fri Oct 06, 2017 1:47 pm

dsr wrote:The FTSE is up 20.5% since the referendum.

The same FTSE 100 companies whose bosses refused to sign the Govt's letter backing Brexit?

Several FTSE 100 executives expressed incredulity at the approach from Downing Street, with one saying: "There is no way we could sign this given the current state of chaos surrounding the (Brexit) talks."

http://news.sky.com/story/ftse-100-chie ... t-11023229