Contactless Payments

Giftonsnoidea · Post by **Giftonsnoidea** » Tue Mar 12, 2019 11:18 am

Last time I went on all the catering shutters in the long side closed themselves and couldn’t be opened at all during half time with the serving girls trapped behind them.

Even my local pub has about 3-4 contactless machines

TVC15 · Post by **TVC15** » Tue Mar 12, 2019 11:27 am

dsr wrote:Ever heard of building societies? They haven't yet followed the bank trends of trying to drive away customers by closing branches and reducing cash desks.

Well they have actually but let’s not let the facts get in the way of some good old fashioned views eh.
The number of building society branches in the Uk has reduced massively - just look round Burnley town centre.

Building Society branches closed at a much faster rate than bank branches in last 10 years...and now half of what is left is one society - Nationwide - who from a product offering point of view are no different to a bank.

claret59 · Post by **claret59** » Tue Mar 12, 2019 11:27 am

All those seeking a cashless society are hastening in the end of the world. It has all been prophesied that this is one of the 'signs' that will happen and then the end is nigh. Stop and turn back to cash alone while there is still time or we are all doomed.

dsr · Post by **dsr** » Tue Mar 12, 2019 11:35 am

TVC15 wrote:Well they have actually but let’s not let the facts get in the way of some good old fashioned views eh.
The number of building society branches in the Uk has reduced massively - just look round Burnley town centre.

Building Society branches closed at a much faster rate than bank branches in last 10 years...and now half of what is left is one society - Nationwide - who from a product offering point of view are no different to a bank.

Only some of them. Marsden, for example, is still operating like a building society, for the benefit of its members.

Is it the "old-fashioned" bit that grates? I have no objection to contactless cards; but I don't want one myself, and I would like that to be my only way of spending money. That's all.

TVC15 · Post by **TVC15** » Tue Mar 12, 2019 11:51 am

dsr wrote:Only some of them. Marsden, for example, is still operating like a building society, for the benefit of its members.

Is it the "old-fashioned" bit that grates? I have no objection to contactless cards; but I don't want one myself, and I would like that to be my only way of spending money. That's all.

“Only some of them” ??!!!
Only some banks have closed aswell but a much bigger percentage of building societies are closing than banks.

And of course you are 100% entitled to do that and I am not an advocate of a cashless society at all.
But no point quoting things that are not factual just to justify your own preference.
And no point arguing to deny others who prefer the choice - and whilst it may grate you it is “old fashioned” - not in a disrespectful way but simply in that there are a lot more recent methods of payment that lots of people prefer.

aggi · Post by **aggi** » Tue Mar 12, 2019 12:08 pm

If you want an example of how robust contactless card systems are then London transport is the obvious one. Something like 3,000,000 contactless transactions per day and I don't remember it having gone down at all.

There are a fair few pubs now (plus a lot of small shops, bars and food places) which only take card. They've looked at the costs of dealing with cash and it wasn't worth it compared to how many transactions were actually done via cash.

However, it is something that needs to be considered in detail. Not just the implications of the system going down (although the only time I've seen that has been when there's been a powercut and they've also refused to take cash as the tills have been down) but the implications for those who don't have cards, bank accounts, etc.

There's also the privacy implications of every transaction being tracked.

dougcollins · Post by **dougcollins** » Tue Mar 12, 2019 12:11 pm

It's great for the crooks, fraud is rife.

GodIsADeeJay81 · Post by **GodIsADeeJay81** » Tue Mar 12, 2019 12:27 pm

I was at Old Trafford for Carrick's testimonial and only one food point was taking card payments in our section of the stand.
It isn't just Burnley that are a bit behind with the times it would seem.

LeadBelly · Post by **LeadBelly** » Tue Mar 12, 2019 12:27 pm

More and more big events I go to have become predominantly card only. I've had contactless cards a longtime but by inclination I like to pay by cash- so found this unwelcome. Last time I was at Twickenham, there was one bar doing cash with a big queue, the many other bars (smaller queues) were contactless- so I felt basically coerced into using contactless.
I assume it's better for the sellers though: saving queue time (thus enhancing turnover) by not having to give change/no danger of hands dipping into tills/no cash to balance or bank etc.
It seems odd that TM doesnt see any advantage in encouraging contactless when it seems other venues are eager to go that way.

JTClaret · Post by **JTClaret** » Tue Mar 12, 2019 12:42 pm

Hold on! Are people actually defending the club not having card payments at the till - I'm not even bothered for contactless - because people can scam the card that they still have in their pocket?

Pain in the backside needing to swing by a cashpoint on the way to make sure I've got money in case I want something... though it does stop me buying to be honest... though isn't that the reason it'd be a good idea?

Foshiznik · Post by **Foshiznik** » Tue Mar 12, 2019 12:51 pm

It seems some would prefer the club to go back to Sovereigns, Shillings, Crowns and Halfpennies than go contactless... strange.

AlargeClaret · Post by **AlargeClaret** » Tue Mar 12, 2019 1:30 pm

Bizzare that they chose to do a contactless trial in the both the smallest part of the ground and bearing in mind that most in that end are still wrestling with the concept of bank accounts full stop

ClaretTony · Post by **ClaretTony** » Tue Mar 12, 2019 1:44 pm

Eyres_11 wrote:Thats another weird thing, why do we have the bars separate from the food? If I want a coffee for my Dad and a beer for me then half time is over by the time I have been to both.

Is that the case, do you have to queue up twice?

Rileybobs · Post by **Rileybobs** » Tue Mar 12, 2019 1:44 pm

claretonthecoast1882 wrote:The little kiosk as you went in at Fulham was card only and a very small queue the main bars took cash and had longer queues, clearly there isn't that much demand. Can't believe anyone goes out without some money on them, even weirder when they are going somewhere and think they might buy something and know in advance there isn't card payment.

There isn't much demand to be able to pay for items on your card? Really?

I hardly ever have money on me. The only time I do it's because I have withdrawn some knowing that I won't be able to use my card for something and then I have the change left on me, which I find annoying. I honestly can't remember the last time that I used cash to pay for something - maybe for car parking but even the vast majority of those accept payment by text or telephone now.

I know that I can't use my card at the bars in BFC so I don't bother with a half time drink. If I could I imagine I would get a drink maybe 50% of the time. On matchdays I park at Burnley Wood and I'm usually in a rush, I only pass one off license with a cash point so it rarely crosses my mind to take cash out. If the club don't accept card payments you would have thought a strategically placed ATM, like on the side of the BLS for example, would be quite convenient.

Rileybobs · Post by **Rileybobs** » Tue Mar 12, 2019 1:45 pm

ClaretTony wrote:Is that the case, do you have to queue up twice?

Yes, don't think you could get a pie and a pint in the JMU without queuing twice.

wilks_bfc · Post by **wilks_bfc** » Tue Mar 12, 2019 1:47 pm

ClaretTony wrote:Is that the case, do you have to queue up twice?

Pretty sure the bars in the concourse don’t sell pies/coffee etc

timshorts · Post by **timshorts** » Tue Mar 12, 2019 1:50 pm

Just as a point of comparison, they have a contactless terminal at the ticket counter at Billericay Town in the Conference South. I only know that because it took money out of my Euro account without my having got the card out of my wallet. Bit of a bumber as that meant I had to pay to get it converted back into Sterling.

claretonthecoast1882 · Post by **claretonthecoast1882** » Tue Mar 12, 2019 1:53 pm

Rileybobs wrote:There isn't much demand to be able to pay for items on your card? Really?

I hardly ever have money on me. The only time I do it's because I have withdrawn some knowing that I won't be able to use my card for something and then I have the change left on me, which I find annoying. I honestly can't remember the last time that I used cash to pay for something - maybe for car parking but even the vast majority of those accept payment by text or telephone now.

I know that I can't use my card at the bars in BFC so I don't bother with a half time drink. If I could I imagine I would get a drink maybe 50% of the time. On matchdays I park at Burnley Wood and I'm usually in a rush, I only pass one off license with a cash point so it rarely crosses my mind to take cash out. If the club don't accept card payments you would have thought a strategically placed ATM, like on the side of the BLS for example, would be quite convenient.

So when you are going out and know you can't use your card you withdraw money out, but when you go to the football and know you can't use your card you forget ? Then forget when walking past the cash machine close to where you park ? Clearly the club at fault here.

Bosscat · Post by **Bosscat** » Tue Mar 12, 2019 1:55 pm

timshorts wrote:Just as a point of comparison, they have a contactless terminal at the ticket counter at Billericay Town in the Conference South. I only know that because it took money out of my Euro account without my having got the card out of my wallet. Bit of a bumber as that meant I had to pay to get it converted back into Sterling.

Get yourself an rfid skimguard or wallet m8 I did before that sort of thing happened to me....

TVC15 · Post by **TVC15** » Tue Mar 12, 2019 1:57 pm

claretonthecoast1882 wrote:So when you are going out and know you can't use your card you withdraw money out, but when you go to the football and know you can't use your card you forget ? Then forget when walking past the cash machine close to where you park ? Clearly the club at fault here.

Clearly he is not saying that.
It’s obvious that what he and most others are saying is that the club is operating differently to the vast majority of other places so it is easy to forget or in a lot of cases just not bother buying things from the club.

But yes the club are at fault.

Bosscat · Post by **Bosscat** » Tue Mar 12, 2019 1:58 pm

Rileybobs wrote:Yes, don't think you could get a pie and a pint in the JMU without queuing twice.

I am sure the bar in the JMU block 2 area serves a pie and a pint..... saving the need to queue twice.

Rileybobs · Post by **Rileybobs** » Tue Mar 12, 2019 2:02 pm

claretonthecoast1882 wrote:So when you are going out and know you can't use your card you withdraw money out, but when you go to the football and know you can't use your card you forget ? Then forget when walking past the cash machine close to where you park ? Clearly the club at fault here.

On the very rare occasion I need cash, like I used to when I got my hair cut, before my barbers joined the 21st century and began to accept card payments, I will stop at a cash point on the way. Now I can't think of a single semi-regular occurrence in my life where I need to withdraw cash.

When I go to watch Burnley I don't need cash as I've got a season ticket. I also don't actually pass the cash point on my way to the ground, I pass near it, nor is there one anywhere near the ground. So on the occasion that it gets to half time and I could be tempted into a beer I invariably don't have cash on me so I don't have a beer. It's not a biggy, I clearly don't care too much about having a beer, the point being if there was a facility to pay on card I guess I'd have a beer 9 or 10 times per season, I'm guessing my brother would join me.

Who has said the club is at fault? I'm not blaming anyone. It's pretty obvious that the club should introduce a facility to pay by card at the bars and kiosks though, unless you're disagreeing with that?

claretonthecoast1882 · Post by **claretonthecoast1882** » Tue Mar 12, 2019 2:07 pm

Rileybobs wrote:On the very rare occasion I need cash, like I used to when I got my hair cut, before my barbers joined the 21st century and began to accept card payments, I will stop at a cash point on the way. Now I can't think of a single semi-regular occurrence in my life where I need to withdraw cash.

When I go to watch Burnley I don't need cash as I've got a season ticket. I also don't actually pass the cash point on my way to the ground, I pass near it, nor is there one anywhere near the ground. So on the occasion that it gets to half time and I could be tempted into a beer I invariably don't have cash on me so I don't have a beer. It's not a biggy, I clearly don't care too much about having a beer, the point being if there was a facility to pay on card I guess I'd have a beer 9 or 10 times per season, I'm guessing my brother would join me.

Who has said the club is at fault? I'm not blaming anyone. It's pretty obvious that the club should introduce a facility to pay by card at the bars and kiosks though, unless you're disagreeing with that?

I have never really thought about paying by card at the match, as said earlier Fulham had a card only payment serving area, bear in mind this is a mixed end so plenty of Fulham there too (rules out the but we aren't used to it excuse) and the queue was small, all other areas that took cash had long queues. When I get the train to the match, I use cash, in the pubs before and after I use cash, if I get a cab from the station I use cash, maybe it is just what I am used to. If i set off with say £100 I know the day is covered. I can't either think of an away game recently where I have seen fans paying by card or asking if they could. Maybe I am just around with a lot of people who only use cash and not the modern day people who don't carry cash.

ŽižkovClaret · Post by **ŽižkovClaret** » Tue Mar 12, 2019 2:09 pm

claret59 wrote:All those seeking a cashless society are hastening in the end of the world. It has all been prophesied that this is one of the 'signs' that will happen and then the end is nigh. Stop and turn back to cash alone while there is still time or we are all doomed.

PStotto? Is that you?

Rileybobs · Post by **Rileybobs** » Tue Mar 12, 2019 2:17 pm

claretonthecoast1882 wrote:I have never really thought about paying by card at the match, as said earlier Fulham had a card only payment serving area, bear in mind this is a mixed end so plenty of Fulham there too (rules out the but we aren't used to it excuse) and the queue was small, all other areas that took cash had long queues. When I get the train to the match, I use cash, in the pubs before and after I use cash, if I get a cab from the station I use cash, maybe it is just what I am used to. If i set off with say £100 I know the day is covered. I can't either think of an away game recently where I have seen fans paying by card or asking if they could. Maybe I am just around with a lot of people who only use cash and not the modern day people who don't carry cash.

In pretty much every industry I can think of, including those you've mentioned such as taxi and train travel, card (or app) payments are far more popular than cash payments. To claim that there isn't a demand for this amongst football fans is plain wrong. If it was widely known that card payments were accepted in the concourses it would only be a matter of time before this method of payment was more widely used than cash.

Bosscat · Post by **Bosscat** » Tue Mar 12, 2019 2:20 pm

Why do you need to swing by a cashpoint on your way to the ground ... why not get a bit of cash the day before....

Like all cub scouts know... "Be prepared"

Instead of whining get on with it... take cash with you ffs....

claretonthecoast1882 · Post by **claretonthecoast1882** » Tue Mar 12, 2019 2:21 pm

Well just as a warning we are at home on the 16th and 30th this month hopefully this gives you ample time to get some cash out for your £2 spend at half time.

Rileybobs · Post by **Rileybobs** » Tue Mar 12, 2019 2:29 pm

Bosscat wrote:Why do you need to swing by a cashpoint on your way to the ground ... why not get a bit of cash the day before....

Like all cub scouts know... "Be prepared"

Instead of whining get on with it... take cash with you ffs....

Who's whining? I don't get cash out the day before because I don't want to get cash out on the off chance that I may want to use it the day after. I'm more than happy to go without a beer at half time. I've explained it pretty robustly, if you don't understand the point I've made then I think I may have overestimated the target audience.

Rileybobs · Post by **Rileybobs** » Tue Mar 12, 2019 2:32 pm

claretonthecoast1882 wrote:Well just as a warning we are at home on the 16th and 30th this month hopefully this gives you ample time to get some cash out for your £2 spend at half time.

As above. You're seemingly too dim to understand the perfectly logical point I've made. And stating £2 as the cost of a beer probably shows how out of touch you are with the times, as evidenced in your other posts.

aggi · Post by **aggi** » Tue Mar 12, 2019 2:37 pm

Bosscat wrote:I was in Halfords a couple of years ago. The woman infront of me was buying about 12 quids worth of goods.
She put her bag on the counter to take her purse out.

At that point the till opened and the card machine printed out a receipt. Her contactless card was still in her handbag inside a purse....

Everyone looked shocked.

That was when I got 4 skimguards cards (Wife now has one in her purse my Brother now has one in his wallet) and I also have an rfid protection wallet.

I have also about read about the people on trains and other public places being scammed by people with card machines that use rfid technology. Placing the machine near peoples wallets / bags etc.

Contactless takes up to £30 ... so multiply that by 30 people and you have £900 ... which easy to do in a busy public area, and its not until you get your statement or look online you will notice....

Apparently Natwest are trialing a fingerprint recognition card that will work as a contactless ... but you need to use your fingerprint on the card before swiping it... then will work on the machine (I am unsure of the details but it was in our paper on Sunday).

Found a link to the Grauniad article

https://www.google.co.uk/url?sa=t&sourc ... Gz&ampcf=1" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

There are lots of tales about this but so far no documented instances of fraud actually happening like this.

On the card side you've got to get very close to people and hope that they only have one contactless card, no keys, phone, etc in that pocket.

On the reader side, you can't just buy a card reader and get the cash. You need to go through the various KYC procedures (ID, etc) to set the account up, the money is often held for a few days before it is released so when people report the fraud the money is still there, etc.

claretonthecoast1882 · Post by **claretonthecoast1882** » Tue Mar 12, 2019 2:39 pm

Rileybobs wrote:As above. You're seemingly too dim to understand the perfectly logical point I've made. And stating £2 as the cost of a beer probably shows how out of touch you are with the times, as evidenced in your other posts.

Ahh I may be dim, but if i want something at halftime I can remember well enough in advance what I need to buy it.

Would you like me to put a reminder up nearer match day so your intelligent mind doesn't forget you need cash to buy ? Always amusing when someone doesn't get there own way and through their own numbness can't get something they want but someone else is dim.

Carry on whining love

PS I said £2 as you claimed to drive to games, had no idea you went for drink driving, and I am the dim one

Eyres_11 · Post by **Eyres_11** » Tue Mar 12, 2019 2:46 pm

ClaretTony wrote:Is that the case, do you have to queue up twice?

Yes, pie and a pint you can get but not a coffee or anything else with a pint.

aggi · Post by **aggi** » Tue Mar 12, 2019 2:52 pm

claretonthecoast1882 wrote:I have never really thought about paying by card at the match, as said earlier Fulham had a card only payment serving area, bear in mind this is a mixed end so plenty of Fulham there too (rules out the but we aren't used to it excuse) and the queue was small, all other areas that took cash had long queues. When I get the train to the match, I use cash, in the pubs before and after I use cash, if I get a cab from the station I use cash, maybe it is just what I am used to. If i set off with say £100 I know the day is covered. I can't either think of an away game recently where I have seen fans paying by card or asking if they could. Maybe I am just around with a lot of people who only use cash and not the modern day people who don't carry cash.

I can't think of many away grounds where I've paid cash this season and there's been a few (West Ham and Brighton the other week for instance) where at least one of the bars was only cards.

Rileybobs · Post by **Rileybobs** » Tue Mar 12, 2019 2:52 pm

claretonthecoast1882 wrote:Ahh I may be dim, but if i want something at halftime I can remember well enough in advance what I need to buy it.

Would you like me to put a reminder up nearer match day so your intelligent mind doesn't forget you need cash to buy ? Always amusing when someone doesn't get there own way and through their own numbness can't get something they want but someone else is dim.

Carry on whining love

PS I said £2 as you claimed to drive to games, had no idea you went for drink driving, and I am the dim one

Keep posting, you're getting dimmer every time.

claretonthecoast1882 · Post by **claretonthecoast1882** » Tue Mar 12, 2019 2:53 pm

But not as poor as you

TVC15 · Post by **TVC15** » Tue Mar 12, 2019 3:10 pm

Typical of this board that you get people arguing that black is white and then turn into accusing someone of drink driving !
Why is this even a debate when the club is not offering a choice that 99% of other places are ?
Nobody is proposing to take your piggy banks away - you carry on using them...the rest of us would prefer a choice though.

Blackrod · Post by **Blackrod** » Tue Mar 12, 2019 3:45 pm

If going to a pub, an event or football I’d always think to take and pay by cash personally.

wilks_bfc · Post by **wilks_bfc** » Tue Mar 12, 2019 3:49 pm

Blackrod wrote:If going to a pub, an event or football I’d always think to take and pay by cash personally.

I’m glad contactless wasn’t about when I was going out on a Saturday in my younger years.

The cash in my pocket was my limit - and that included the taxi fare home

Using contactless would have made things a whole lot messier than they were

Winstonswhite · Post by **Winstonswhite** » Tue Mar 12, 2019 3:59 pm

Going to the football is the only time I ever need cash and inevitably I always forget to go the cash point on the way as in a rush etc etc. So it was so convenient when I sat in the CFS last season and I got at least two pints every game via contactless.

Now I’ve retired to the Bob Lord, who don’t have the facility, I’ve visited the bar twice all season.

I just can’t understand why a Premier League club with turnover of 150million doesn’t allow contactless. It’s ridiculous.

HieronymousBoschHobs · Post by **HieronymousBoschHobs** » Tue Mar 12, 2019 4:10 pm

They should offer the option of card payments. They should also do them up a bit, the tuck shops that is. I like the old school vibe at the Turf on the whole, I really don't like retail park, plastic-type grounds because it feels like football getting away from its roots. However, there's no need to be Spartan - lick of paint and some mod cons wouldn't go amiss.

AlargeClaret · Post by **AlargeClaret** » Tue Mar 12, 2019 8:38 pm

There was ( an unconfirmed ) rumour they trialed the contactless machines in the Bob Lord ,but even before the match kicked off they were jammed with threpney bits and sixpences and as queues increased tempers frayed and at one point a colostomy bag was thrown

tim_noone · Post by **tim_noone** » Tue Mar 12, 2019 10:12 pm

AlargeClaret wrote:There was ( an unconfirmed ) rumour they trialed the contactless machines in the Bob Lord ,but even before the match kicked off they were jammed with threpney bits and sixpences and as queues increased tempers frayed and at one point a colostomy bag was thrown

Foshiznik · Post by **Foshiznik** » Wed Mar 13, 2019 12:30 pm

claretonthecoast1882 wrote:I have never really thought about paying by card at the match, as said earlier Fulham had a card only payment serving area, bear in mind this is a mixed end so plenty of Fulham there too (rules out the but we aren't used to it excuse) and the queue was small, all other areas that took cash had long queues. When I get the train to the match, I use cash, in the pubs before and after I use cash, if I get a cab from the station I use cash, maybe it is just what I am used to. If i set off with say £100 I know the day is covered. I can't either think of an away game recently where I have seen fans paying by card or asking if they could. Maybe I am just around with a lot of people who only use cash and not the modern day people who don't carry cash.

The queue was probably small on the contactless kiosk because the punters didn't have to rummage around their pockets looking for the correct change and/or put their change away as they were able to tap the machine once with their phone or card and go. Imagine how many punters could be served with such a quick transaction. If you still want to pay cash, that would also be fine.

JTClaret · Post by **JTClaret** » Wed Mar 13, 2019 1:03 pm

This thread really does sum up this board

A thread about card payments, which I've long since thought we should get, ends up with people claiming others should carry more money with them, tales of contactless cards being used for fraud, claims it isn't wanted and would never be used - despite arguing that fact to those that can't understand how we don't have it already - end of the world claims, and painful replies to people trying to lighten the mood with a bit of sarcasm. Ladies and gentlemen, uptheclarets

TVC15 · Post by **TVC15** » Wed Mar 13, 2019 1:06 pm

Eh don't forget the accusation of drink driving !!

aggi · Post by **aggi** » Mon Mar 25, 2019 2:32 pm

I see the new Spurs stadium is all cashless.

jrgbfc · Post by **jrgbfc** » Mon Mar 25, 2019 2:36 pm

aggi wrote:I see the new Spurs stadium is all cashless.

Yeah I noticed that today as well. Suppose they're a lot more up to date and tech savvy down in the Big Smoke

aggi · Post by **aggi** » Mon Mar 25, 2019 2:44 pm

They should probably have checked the viability of that with some of the posters on this thread first though.

The Quattro · Post by **The Quattro** » Mon Mar 25, 2019 3:05 pm

dsr · Post by **dsr** » Mon Mar 25, 2019 3:40 pm

To be fair, when they talk about abolishing cash (as some people, including bankers, do) they are talking about replacing it with something far less flexible.