Northern Rail....Terrible

ElectroClaret · Post by **ElectroClaret** » Mon Jun 04, 2018 2:14 pm

Cancellations and long delays still going on, sort it out.
Anyone being affected by this?

UpTheBeehole · Post by **UpTheBeehole** » Mon Jun 04, 2018 2:22 pm

It's been a joke. People just don't know when they're going to get into work, or get home.

cricketfieldclarets · Post by **cricketfieldclarets** » Mon Jun 04, 2018 2:30 pm

Northern rail as a whole are a joke. Customer service is abysmal.

ebby · Post by **ebby** » Mon Jun 04, 2018 3:17 pm

Still not sorted eh. Had issues last July when back in UK and it looks like I may have same problems in a couple of weeks. Should have got the bus up from London, heaps cheaper and i know i would arrive roughly on time.

karatekid · Post by **karatekid** » Mon Jun 04, 2018 3:40 pm

A few weeks ago I was waiting at Burnley Central for the train to Preston to catch my connection to Birmingham New Street. The train didn't show so I rang the helpline to be told it had been cancelled. I explained I had a connection train to brum which left 7 mins after my arrival at Preston. " No, you won't catch that, sorry, good bye" was the response from Northern rail. I had to catch a cab.

claretonthecoast1882 · Post by **claretonthecoast1882** » Mon Jun 04, 2018 3:58 pm

Laughable they still have the contract

LAM · Post by **LAM** » Mon Jun 04, 2018 4:27 pm

karatekid wrote:A few weeks ago I was waiting at Burnley Central for the train to Preston to catch my connection to Birmingham New Street. The train didn't show so I rang the helpline to be told it had been cancelled. I explained I had a connection train to brum which left 7 mins after my arrival at Preston. " No, you won't catch that, sorry, good bye" was the response from Northern rail. I had to catch a cab.

I had exactly the same experience yesterday at Accrington. Only found out by calling them. Had to pay for a taxi to Manchester and only just made my train back to London. Appalling service and put me off using trains for the foreseeable.

Better Call Saul · Post by **Better Call Saul** » Mon Jun 04, 2018 5:37 pm

We were recently on a short break in Glasgow which we had booked before they rearranged the Chelsea home match for a Thursday night. As it turned out we were due to travel back that very day on the train to Preston but arriving at 8:30pm which was too late to make the match. Not wanting to miss the match, we paid again for another pair of tickets that got us into Preston with plenty of time to change platforms to catch the Northern Rail train from Preston to Burnley Master Road. I said plenty of time because that is exactly what we ended up with. When we got on the train at Preston, the train remained stationery at the due departure time. Word slowly filter to everyone on board that there was no engine driver available as the previous driver had finished his shift. We then all had to leave the train, change platform and get on another train which eventually left Preston 70 minutes later than it should have done. We did get some of the money back due after filling in a form online. The good news is that we made the K.O. The bad news is we lost 2-1.

ElectroClaret · Post by **ElectroClaret** » Mon Jun 04, 2018 6:05 pm

Labour call on transport minister Chris Grayling to resign.
(BBC)

69 trains already today either cancelled or at least 30 minutes late.

tim_noone · Post by **tim_noone** » Mon Jun 04, 2018 7:29 pm

Don't Worry We Are The Northern Power house Regards All Things Transport ....Remember?

Sproggy · Post by **Sproggy** » Mon Jun 04, 2018 8:19 pm

I'm the lucky holder of a Northern Rail annual season ticket for a daily commute to Manc from Burnley. Last week I ended up getting the bus more often than the train.

Steve-Harpers-perm · Post by **Steve-Harpers-perm** » Mon Jun 04, 2018 8:44 pm

Unfortunately it’s happening outside of London and the South East so not much interest media wise.

Imploding Turtle · Post by **Imploding Turtle** » Mon Jun 04, 2018 8:57 pm

ElectroClaret wrote:Cancellations and long delays still going on, sort it out.
Anyone being affected by this?

Yep. Given up on the *****. I'd rather pay for a bus that takes over an hour but is reliable than get their 20 minute trains that may or may not arrive half an hour late (if it arrives at all).

But apparently this is better than when the government ran things, or so says the neo-liberal bullshitters

tiger76 · Post by **tiger76** » Mon Jun 04, 2018 9:39 pm

Travelling Down from Glasgow to visit family in three weeks,looks like it will be fun

tybfc · Post by **tybfc** » Mon Jun 04, 2018 9:50 pm

It's great of Northern Fail to change their times and schedules.

They aren't actually Northern Rail any more but part of Arriva and still as bad.

Prior to the changes the East Lancs line had trains running hourly during the day from Colne to Blackpool South and York to Blackpool North.

Not any more.

They now run from Colne to Preston and Dirty Leeds to Preston.

Except most are either cancelled or run that late that the next one is due to set off before the last one did.

The CEO/ Chairman of Northern Rail who seemed close to tears answering press questions today is up in front of a Commons committee tomorrow.

Watch tonight's 10pm news. It's cringeworthy.

thatdberight · Post by **thatdberight** » Mon Jun 04, 2018 10:20 pm

Imploding Turtle wrote:But apparently this is better than when the government ran things, or so says the neo-liberal bullshitters

Except... guess which bit of the rail industry has 'fessed up today to being the cause of the problem.... the only bit that's still in quasi-public control, the same bit that every comparison against European networks shows is the cause of the cost differential in this country. Network Rail. But apparently it's always better when the government run everything.

Loyalclaret · Post by **Loyalclaret** » Mon Jun 04, 2018 10:22 pm

Hoping to catch the 9am from Burnley Manchester Rd Wednesday to Preston- should I make alternative plans?

tybfc · Post by **tybfc** » Mon Jun 04, 2018 11:53 pm

Loyalclaret wrote:Hoping to catch the 9am from Burnley Manchester Rd Wednesday to Preston- should I make alternative plans?

A) Yes
B) Yes

If you step on that train at 9am or before I will donate £10 to the youth foundation.

And you need to be honest.

bfc1984 · Post by **bfc1984** » Tue Jun 05, 2018 12:29 am

A driver who works for northern rail lives on our street.He can’t wait to get out of there apparently a joke to work for,says there so short of drivers that sometimes the trains are not going.It may get worse northern rails experienced drivers are all trying to get on with virgin which in his words is ‘mega money’.

cricketfieldclarets · Post by **cricketfieldclarets** » Tue Jun 05, 2018 12:50 am

During the week when we had the beast from the east, I had 15 minutes to print my tickets for a journey to London that morning. But the machines outside were playing up. I hsd a suitcase and two bags. And the weather was horrific and it was still pitch black.

The **** in the office point blank refused to print my tickets saying it was my own responsibility to print them off.

Thats a very very short version of events which culminated in me leaving the station before throttling him. Driving to Leeds for my next train. Getting stuck on the backroads for four hours when the blizzard hit before finally ending up at Tod (where they kindly printed them) near frostbitten, **** wet through and completely drained of any energy.

They replied to my complaint this week. 3 months later. Offered me two free tickets for northern rail routes

Commy · Post by **Commy** » Tue Jun 05, 2018 4:05 am

Mentioned on the radio that people will be compensated. Watch this space though, they might cancel the payments!

mikeS · Post by **mikeS** » Tue Jun 05, 2018 8:26 am

Interesting to see Grayling being kicked up the arse from both sides of the Commons yesterday. Long may it continue until the whole railway mess is sorted out.

Imploding Turtle · Post by **Imploding Turtle** » Tue Jun 05, 2018 8:31 am

tybfc wrote:A) Yes
B) Yes

If you step on that train at 9am or before I will donate £10 to the youth foundation.

And you need to be honest.

So far it's on time. Though it's timetabled at 9:03

tybfc · Post by **tybfc** » Tue Jun 05, 2018 8:53 am

Imploding Turtle wrote:So far it's on time. Though it's timetabled at 9:03

I had already spotted that

tybfc · Post by **tybfc** » Tue Jun 05, 2018 9:06 am

Well the deadline has passed and it is due in 7 minutes late at 09:10.

The 10:03 service has been cancelled for anybody remotely interested.

ClaretDiver · Post by **ClaretDiver** » Tue Jun 05, 2018 11:01 am

Just a complete joke of a service.....

Dark Cloud · Post by **Dark Cloud** » Tue Jun 05, 2018 12:23 pm

It's an utter disgrace tbh. My son who is only 16 uses Northern Rail to get to and from college and up until recently it hadn't been TOO bad (except in extreme weather), but of late it seems to be absolute chaos with trains randomly cancelled at the last minute or running (very) late. He's been stranded at Victoria numerous times in the last few weeks. As has been said in the media, it wouldn't happen in London!

tiger76 · Post by **tiger76** » Wed Jun 06, 2018 1:11 am

Commy wrote:Mentioned on the radio that people will be compensated. Watch this space though, they might cancel the payments!

It's not just about financial loss,how about people who have been inconvenienced,i wouldn't hold your breath for any cheques arriving soon,we claimed compo from Virgin for a delayed journey 4 months ago and are still waiting.

their contractual obligations can't be being met surely,they remove hundreds of trains and yet still can't run a p**s up in a brewery.

HiroshimaClaret · Post by **HiroshimaClaret** » Wed Jun 06, 2018 5:05 am

If this sort of `passenger neglect` happened here in Japan, the CEO would have his samurai sword out after bowing in a apology a 1000 times. Japan has its dark underbelly like any other country but on the whole, a simply magnificent public transport system (Hiroshima itself has trains, streetcars - one of them still in daily use which was actually running on the day of the A-Bomb!!!), an overhead monorail system and buses of course. Super convenient, more than reasonably-priced and on the whole spot-on time wise. Then there are the bullet trains!!!!!!!!

ClaretDiver · Post by **ClaretDiver** » Wed Jun 06, 2018 5:15 am

HiroshimaClaret wrote:If this sort of `passenger neglect` happened here in Japan, the CEO would have his samurai sword out after bowing in a apology a 1000 times. Japan has its dark underbelly like any other country but on the whole, a simply magnificent public transport system (Hiroshima itself has trains, streetcars - one of them still in daily use which was actually running on the day of the A-Bomb!!!), an overhead monorail system and buses of course. Super convenient, more than reasonably-priced and on the whole spot-on time wise. Then there are the bullet trains!!!!!!!!

Wasn't it in Japan recently that passengers complained because the train was a couple of minutes EARLY!!!

HiroshimaClaret · Post by **HiroshimaClaret** » Wed Jun 06, 2018 5:37 am

ClaretDiver wrote:Wasn't it in Japan recently that passengers complained because the train was a couple of minutes EARLY!!!

More likely seconds!!! Around 10 years ago a train was running approximately 2 minutes late and the driver, feeling under pressure to be on time, `put his foot down` which resulted in the train derailing, ploughing into a building and there were more than 100 deaths. Just one extreme example of the Japanese and good timekeeping.

mikeS · Post by **mikeS** » Wed Jun 06, 2018 7:15 am

If you want to sign the petition that wants change in the railways here it is...
https://www.change.org/p/prime-minister ... W7t8sgGw.4" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Loyalclaret · Post by **Loyalclaret** » Wed Jun 06, 2018 9:07 am

The train was early and left on time!

Technically after 9am but I gave myself 3 minutes wiggle room to arrive late on the scheduled time!

Sausage · Post by **Sausage** » Wed Jun 06, 2018 1:37 pm

Dark Cloud wrote:It's an utter disgrace tbh. My son who is only 16 uses Northern Rail to get to and from college and up until recently it hadn't been TOO bad (except in extreme weather), but of late it seems to be absolute chaos with trains randomly cancelled at the last minute or running (very) late. He's been stranded at Victoria numerous times in the last few weeks. As has been said in the media, it wouldn't happen in London!

Bullshit! It's happening in London every day. My Thameslink service is in complete meltdown, with services cancelled at the drop of a hat, the latest for me being last night. We exiles stand in unity with our friends using Northern Rail.

As for media bias and a perceived lack of coverage of the chaos up north, I must've imagined the ITV national news reports from Preston Station last week.

Dark Cloud · Post by **Dark Cloud** » Wed Jun 06, 2018 2:06 pm

Sausage wrote:Bullshit! It's happening in London every day. My Thameslink service is in complete meltdown, with services cancelled at the drop of a hat, the latest for me being last night. We exiles stand in unity with our friends using Northern Rail.

As for media bias and a perceived lack of coverage of the chaos up north, I must've imagined the ITV national news reports from Preston Station last week.

In fairness I didn't say the media weren't interested, I was saying that the media coverage was frequently making the point that if it was happening in the south there would be a much greater outcry. I also saw that the national news were reporting from Preston and then also more recently from Manchester Victoria. You have my sympathy too if you're wrestling with the same frustrating issues down there.
The bottom line is they are supposedly trying to encourage people to use public transport more and leave their cars at home, especially if travelling into cities, but then the companies balls up and leave folk stranded and unsurprisingly customers clear off and don't come back.

Sausage · Post by **Sausage** » Wed Jun 06, 2018 2:39 pm

Dark Cloud, it seems we're on the same page. My comment about media coverage was in response to post 12, as the news down here is still being dominated by the massive f**k up with the new timetables but Northern Rail seems to be getting the headlines nationally. Not that I have a problem with that; even Corbyn referred to Northern Rail at PMQs this morning. It seems to me that Northern Rail is hamstrung by a chronic lack of investment whereas Thameslink is adequately funded but by run by chimpanzees. We got new state-of-the-art trains last year which were supposed to eliminate delays caused by train faults. Guess who Thameslink sold the old, crappy, rolling stock to. Yep, Northern Rail. And did it eliminate delays caused by train faults? No.

tybfc · Post by **tybfc** » Wed Jun 06, 2018 3:11 pm

Northern Rail have enough crappy trains but just no drivers.

South West Claret. · Post by **South West Claret.** » Wed Jun 06, 2018 3:15 pm

Good old privatisation suppose to be better then nationalisation so they said

ebby · Post by **ebby** » Wed Jun 06, 2018 3:17 pm

Bring back British Rail. Nationalise them all. They were never the ilk of LMS, LNER etc.

thatdberight · Post by **thatdberight** » Wed Jun 06, 2018 3:49 pm

ebby wrote:Bring back British Rail. Nationalise them all. They were never the ilk of LMS, LNER etc.

So which is it? Do you want BR or LNER etc?

If you want BR I can only assume you're too young to have experienced it first-hand before.

South West Claret. · Post by **South West Claret.** » Wed Jun 06, 2018 4:11 pm

thatdberight wrote:So which is it? Do you want BR or LNER etc?

If you want BR I can only assume you're too young to have experienced it first-hand before.

Well I remember both forms of ownership but honestly don’t remember things this bad.

Croydon Claret · Post by **Croydon Claret** » Wed Jun 06, 2018 4:26 pm

Doesn't help that the National Rail website and app are a work of fiction.

I always check that the trains are on time before leaving work but find upon arrival at the station a few minutes later that the train is 25 or 30 minutes late, or cancelled

DasCudband · Post by **DasCudband** » Wed Jun 06, 2018 4:55 pm

You really can take your pick about who is to blame for the rail problems. Northern are getting the headlines right now but you don’t have to try too hard to find issues elsewhere particularly in the South East & Bristol/South West.

Looking at Northern specifically in descending order of blame

#3 Northern Rail – Shafted by Department for Transport & Network Rail & arguably by ASLEF train drivers union. They have plenty of new drivers but hardly anybody to train them and sign them off as competent. Even when they are trained then they are poached by other operators who can throw money around as described earlier in the thread.

Northern & ASLEF have failed to agree to renew the rest day working/overtime agreement and are blaming each other. This is the real reason some trains don’t have drivers they simply aren’t enough available trained drivers & the ones that are trained will not/are not allowed to work extra hours which Northern were reliant upon to keep the show on the road.

#2 Network Rail – Responsible for completing maintenance of infrastructure & planning timetable Network Rail have managed neither. Electrification of Manchester/Bolton/Preston has missed 3 deadlines already with miss number 4 approaching soon. My bet is May 2019 which would be over 2 years late. Electrification of Preston- Blackpool overran meaning Northern couldn’t train drivers on this route.

The Diesel trains needed for timetable expansion are still being used on the Manchester/Bolton/Preston route whist the electric trains that should be running are gathering dust somewhere.

New expanded May 2018 timetable handed over so late that Northern had very little time to plan how to get trains/drivers in right place at right time. Same happened in London hence all the problems they had.

No surprise head of Network Rail now moving on.

#1 Department for Transport/Chris Grayling

Where do you start here?

Trans-Pennine routes were supposed to be electrified Norther Powerhouse anybody? But no DFT have decided that the bit over the top from Stalybridge towards Huddersfield upwards is “too difficult” so that bit will be diesel. Once again the diesel trains promised elsewhere can’t be released. Oh apart from some required for London to Oxford/Banbury routes which DFT allowed to go south, even though the North had nothing to replace them with.

New plan was to take old electric trains From (1980’s) that London don’t want anymore strap a couple of engines underneath and happy days – use electric where there are wires and diesel where there aren’t. Only problem is these bi mode trains are now 13 months overdue, and not 1 of them has yet moved under their own power. Rail industry insider’s money is on they will never see the light of day.

At this rate we are more likely to see trains fuelled by magic dust…

DFT policy was entirely based on more electrification of more lines. Because they have now changed their minds then there are dozens of electric trains sat in sidings around the country doing nothing. There is a bunch of new trains arriving every couple of weeks from Siemens factories in Germany and nobody wants them. They are brand new…!

Meanwhile Northern punters are dragged around in Pacer & Sprinter trains built in mid 1980’s with a design life of 10 years. Some of Sprinters are being refurbished. This is the very definition of polishing a turd.

I have not even mentioned franchising here but I think that is enough.

Government/Grayling/DFT are the real villains of this story.