Keir Starmer the future

[AndrewJB]

Not a big fan of ‘human rights’ lawyers who often don’t help the cause of genuine human rights cases.

Having said that and as a right winger the government need challenging. Starmer comes across as credible, articulate and he only challenges when necessary. He is genuine and comes from a working class background. The Corbyn regime objected to everything but didn’t have a clear path of their own. They were not credible and voters could see this. If I was a Labour voter I would be quite pleased with Starmer so far.

Deary me. Just because you didn’t bother reading any of Labour’s last two manifestos, and merely dismissed them doesn’t mean they didn’t exist as a clear and positive path away from Tory austerity - the chickens of that failed policy now coming home to roost.

[Blackrod]

Deary me. Just because you didn’t bother reading any of Labour’s last two manifestos, and merely dismissed them doesn’t mean they didn’t exist as a clear and positive path away from Tory austerity - the chickens of that failed policy now coming home to roost.

yes spend spend spend and object. This was before an international pandemic crisis. The economy really would be up sh*ts creak for decades to come.

[IanMcL]

The silent house certainly makes for the demon questions and lame answers, to stand out.

[tiger76]

The silent house certainly makes for the demon questions and lame answers, to stand out.

Yes without all the infantile behaviour normally associated with PMQ'S and QT,politicians of all stripes are being put on the spot much more,it's good to see,long may this continue.

[TheFamilyCat]

Interestingly Boris' most vocal supporters have been very quiet about how PMQs are going.

I was expecting at least some "he's been ill/sleepless nights" excuses for his performances.

Maybe they just aren't interested about what actually happens in The House.

[tiger76]

Interestingly Boris' most vocal supporters have been very quiet about how PMQs are going.

I was expecting at least some "he's been ill/sleepless nights" excuses for his performances.

Maybe they just aren't interested about what actually happens in The House.

Boris has never been great at PMQ'S,however the fact he was facing Corbyn,and the general febrile atmosphere of the house during the previous session.masked a lot of his failings,now he can't play to the gallery,and he actually has to answer the questions,his lack of detailed knowledge,and even basic research,is being badly exposed.

[Devils_Advocate]

If you watch PMQs there's also a fair bit of stuff Starmer is getting Boris to say/confirm that isn't an immediate gotcha but is to get Johnson on record on a specific point so when they try and backtrack and spin further down the line Starmer will have all is ammo ready to load

[IanMcL]

Yes without all the infantile behaviour normally associated with PMQ'S and QT,politicians of all stripes are being put on the spot much more,it's good to see,long may this continue.

For health and safety reasons, please do not hold breath!

[IanMcL]

If you watch PMQs there's also a fair bit of stuff Starmer is getting Boris to say/confirm that isn't an immediate gotcha but is to get Johnson on record on a specific point so when they try and backtrack and spin further down the line Starmer will have all is ammo ready to load

That is it, precisely, DA.

Some will say that he is critical and not supportive, however, given the quality of delivery, to date, it is his duty to get on record, as many specifics as possible.

This includes reminders of promises past, which are suspect, for whatever reason.

Equally, the PM uses the questions to state new things, so it is an even forum.

[CombatClaret]

If the leader of the opposition can call out the PM on countless issues it begs the question why large portions of the media are deliberately not, in fact actively supporting or providing any distraction possible.

[IanMcL]

Some are doing their job.

[Billy Balfour]

You know things aren't going well for Bozo when you read a headline like this in the Daily Telegraph.

Keir Starmer took Boris Johnson apart like a Duplo train set

At PMQs, the new Labour leader asked a series of calmly factual questions – and the Prime Minister visibly struggled

He's been found out for what he is; all bluster with no substance.

[evensteadiereddie]

And Starmer's only just got started.

[Billy Balfour]

I don't think Bozo will see out this term. He'll either be pushed out or will go of his own accord. Many of his MPs knew full well about his lack of substance, propensity for gaffes and opening lying when put under pressure, however, they were willing overlook his flaws in order to get Brexit done.

Also, Bozo is finding it all too much hard work and hard work is something he's not been used to. He likes being PM, but not the hard work and responsibility that goes with it.

[evensteadiereddie]

I think you're right, he will go after the Covid stuff is under control either in triumph, shame or with indifference.
All Starmer has to do is wait for the next set of costly - in terms of human life - errors to come to light and pick Johnson off slowly and effectively. There's no rush, he needs to dismantle Johnson and Co. bit by bit. He'll have it worked out.

[Billy Balfour]

Yeah, his MPs will get rid of him when C-19 is under control. They won't want to be associated with his failings. They'll make scapegoats of him and his advisors. "It wasn't us, it was them" will be their new mantra.

[Chuckypad]

Boris has never been great at PMQ'S,however the fact he was facing Corbyn,and the general febrile atmosphere of the house during the previous session.masked a lot of his failings,now he can't play to the gallery,and he actually has to answer the questions,his lack of detailed knowledge,and even basic research,is being badly exposed.

A little bit of sick pops into my mouth every time I here people referring to politicians with their Christian name and it seems to happen often with our current PM

Tiger - Not having a do at you here, I've just noticed this is happening everywhere...TV, newspapers, social media, this messageboard, even my Dad who's as far away from a Tory as Chairman Mao

[Steve-Harpers-perm]

A little bit of sick pops into my mouth every time I here people referring to politicians with their Christian name and it seems to happen often with our current PM

Tiger - Not having a do at you here, I've just noticed this is happening everywhere...TV, newspapers, social media, this messageboard, even my Dad who's as far away from a Tory as Chairman Mao

It’s a new trend this. Same as people who refer to football managers for example by their first name like they are mates.

[joey13]

A little bit of sick pops into my mouth every time I here people referring to politicians with their Christian name and it seems to happen often with our current PM

Tiger - Not having a do at you here, I've just noticed this is happening everywhere...TV, newspapers, social media, this messageboard, even my Dad who's as far away from a Tory as Chairman Mao

It’s called brainwashing ,selling Johnson as a mate or family member ,anybody who uses the Prime minister first name to me , I just ask who are they talking about

[AlargeClaret]

It’s called brainwashing ,selling Johnson as a mate or family member ,anybody who uses the Prime minister first name to me , I just ask who are they talking about

Tbf mate you’d just seem like an ignorant agenda driven bellend ( I’m aiming that generally not personally ) as “ Boris “ is just a name that’s become ( in fact always was )a moniker for Johnson . It’s rare in the UK to have such ,with “ Gazza” being the only one coming to mind in “ recent “ times . It’s a godsend to Johnson as builds the sort of pseudo/cult figure that no matter of money could buy .

[AlargeClaret]

When people refer to “ Boris” it’s not a friendly matey term it’s just what he’s known as and arises zero emotion .Though if I was a Tory hater it woujd drive me bloody mad

[Greenmile]

I see Starmer has the Tories running scared enough that a couple of ministers have resorted to sharing doctored videos of him on Twitter in a desperate attempt to smear him.

[mkmel]

I think it was Dorries and 1 other Tory

[ksrclaret]

It’s so reassuring to know that the Health Minister is busying herself tweeting lies about the opposition leader in this unprecedented global health crisis.

So glad she’s staying alert.

[tiger76]

I see Starmer has the Tories running scared enough that a couple of ministers have resorted to sharing doctored videos of him on Twitter in a desperate attempt to smear him.

I don't use Twitter,but if that's true it's sad,it's bad enough when MP'S and party members do it,but ministers should have better things to do with their time,after all we are in the middle of a global pandemic.

[Greenmile]

I think it was Dorries and 1 other Tory

2 others (that I’m aware of) - Maria Caulfield and Lucy Allan. Last I saw, Dorries had deleted the Tweet, Caulfield appears to have deleted her entire account, and Allan has done nothing. No apologies from any of them yet.

I hope he sues.

[SammyBoy]

2 others (that I’m aware of) - Maria Caulfield and Lucy Allan. Last I saw, Dorries had deleted the Tweet, Caulfield appears to have deleted her entire account, and Allan has done nothing. No apologies from any of them yet.

I hope he sues.

Par for the course as Labour leader. How is Starmer's father anyway? I wonder if they'll be able to "Ralph Miliband" him.

[aggi]

I don't use Twitter,but if that's true it's sad,it's bad enough when MP'S and party members do it,but ministers should have better things to do with their time,after all we are in the middle of a global pandemic.

https://news.sky.com/story/nadine-dorri ... r-11988228

I don't think many would expect much better from someone like Nadine Dorries. She's one of those MPs that it's absolutely bemusing how she's still in a job.

[tiger76]

I don't think Bozo will see out this term. He'll either be pushed out or will go of his own accord. Many of his MPs knew full well about his lack of substance, propensity for gaffes and opening lying when put under pressure, however, they were willing overlook his flaws in order to get Brexit done.

Also, Bozo is finding it all too much hard work and hard work is something he's not been used to. He likes being PM, but not the hard work and responsibility that goes with it.

Funnily enough I've had the same opinion for a while now,he'll argue he's got brexit done(that's another discussion entirely)and now the Labour party finally have a credible leader,he'll soon realise the gig's got a whole lot tougher.

As to who replaces Johnson.my money would be on Sunak,he's one of the few in the cabinet to emerge from this farce with his credibility intact.

[Billy Balfour]

As to who replaces Johnson.my money would be on Sunak,he's one of the few in the cabinet to emerge from this farce with his credibility intact.

Commonsense would say Sunak, thing is though, it's the Blue Rinse Brigade who get the final say and they'll probably end up going for someone like Rees-Mogg. After all, they went for IDS when everyone else could see he would be out of his depth and massively so.

[Firthy]

If you watch PMQs there's also a fair bit of stuff Starmer is getting Boris to say/confirm that isn't an immediate gotcha but is to get Johnson on record on a specific point so when they try and backtrack and spin further down the line Starmer will have all is ammo ready to load

It's so nice to see the opposition supporting the government during these difficult times rather than trying to score points by making the opposition look bad

[Devils_Advocate]

It's so nice to see the opposition supporting the government during these difficult times rather than trying to score points by making the opposition look bad

Better off keeping quiet if you dont understand whats being discussed than chirping up and sounding like a f*ckin idiot like you have just done

[jrgbfc]

I agree with those that think Boris won't be there for the long haul. Too much hard work now, and he doesn't look like his hearts really in it to me. Plus his health scare gives him a convenient excuse to stand down.

[CombatClaret]

As to who replaces Johnson.my money would be on Sunak,he's one of the few in the cabinet to emerge from this farce with his credibility intact.

We've really seen nothing of Sunak, people seem to be basing opinions on the fact that he doesn't give speeches in a buffoonish manner like Johnson but in a calm almost politician like manner and secondly he's handing out money to people who need money.
His leading quality compared the rivals in his party is 'Hasn't completely f**ked it up yet'.

[Devils_Advocate]

If Sunak's performance during this crisis is anything to go by then he won't be Johnson's successor. Sunak seems to be far to open and transparent (albeit in a short window) and looks like someone who would hold to much to his principles

There is still far too much uncertainty around the final outcome of Brexit and the end game to Covid for the Billionaire backers to allow someone like that into power.

Unfortunately Gove must still be the people who counts choice however if this glimpse of Sunak is a true reflection of his competence and character then he could well be the leader once Brexit is done to try and guide the country back to economic prosperity

Of course I hope we'll boot the Tory's out well before then but you wont catch me betting on it so thats my view of how things might go for the Torys if they stay in power

[SalouClaret]

Sunak doesn't have a name that sounds English enough for a few of the new found Tory voters.

[Paul Waine]

A little bit of sick pops into my mouth every time I here people referring to politicians with their Christian name and it seems to happen often with our current PM

Tiger - Not having a do at you here, I've just noticed this is happening everywhere...TV, newspapers, social media, this messageboard, even my Dad who's as far away from a Tory as Chairman Mao

Hi Chuckypad, don't you mean "given name?"

Interesting how we know "Boris Johnson" as "Boris." Is it to distinguish him from Stanley J and Jo J? He was mayor of London for 2 4 year terms, 8 years in total. We have our "boris cards" (from travel for over 60s) and our "boris bikes" (the first of the central London on street bike hires). Is it because BJ did his appearances on "HIGNFY" with the Hislop and Merton calling him "Boris" (possibly more Hislop than Merton...)?

Did it start with "call me Tone" Blair? Or with "Maggie" Thatcher? "Maggie, Maggie, Maggie, Out, Out, Out" was a common acclaim in the late 1980s.

Should we try it with Kier Starmer? or would that get him too closely linked with the "Kier" he was named after, but probably doesn't give him the political positioning the Labour party now desires?

[aggi]

If Sunak's performance during this crisis is anything to go by then he won't be Johnson's successor. Sunak seems to be far to open and transparent (albeit in a short window) and looks like someone who would hold to much to his principles

Personally, I'd reserve judgement on that. Bear in mind that Sunak ended up with the job because Javid refused to be a puppet for Number 10.

[joey13]

Tbf mate you’d just seem like an ignorant agenda driven bellend ( I’m aiming that generally not personally ) as “ Boris “ is just a name that’s become ( in fact always was )a moniker for Johnson . It’s rare in the UK to have such ,with “ Gazza” being the only one coming to mind in “ recent “ times . It’s a godsend to Johnson as builds the sort of pseudo/cult figure that no matter of money could buy .

Bellend , really

[joey13]

Hi Chuckypad, don't you mean "given name?"

Interesting how we know "Boris Johnson" as "Boris." Is it to distinguish him from Stanley J and Jo J? He was mayor of London for 2 4 year terms, 8 years in total. We have our "boris cards" (from travel for over 60s) and our "boris bikes" (the first of the central London on street bike hires). Is it because BJ did his appearances on "HIGNFY" with the Hislop and Merton calling him "Boris" (possibly more Hislop than Merton...)?

Did it start with "call me Tone" Blair? Or with "Maggie" Thatcher? "Maggie, Maggie, Maggie, Out, Out, Out" was a common acclaim in the late 1980s.

Should we try it with Kier Starmer? or would that get him too closely linked with the "Kier" he was named after, but probably doesn't give him the political positioning the Labour party now desires?

It was call me “Dave” as in Cameron

[Billy Balfour]

I remember when Call Me Dave suddenly found a love for football. Think he said he supported Villa Aston.

[tiger76]

Personally, I'd reserve judgement on that. Bear in mind that Sunak ended up with the job because Javid refused to be a puppet for Number 10.

Was that Sunak's fault?and let's be honest who's going to turn the Chancellor's job down.

[tiger76]

We've really seen nothing of Sunak, people seem to be basing opinions on the fact that he doesn't give speeches in a buffoonish manner like Johnson but in a calm almost politician like manner and secondly he's handing out money to people who need money.
His leading quality compared the rivals in his party is 'Hasn't completely f**ked it up yet'.

A genuine CC is there anybody in the Conservative party that you do like.

[aggi]

Was that Sunak's fault?and let's be honest who's going to turn the Chancellor's job down.

Agreed with that but given they'd just had someone quit under somewhat embarrassing cicrumstances you'd think that they'd take care in making sure his replacement was somewhat more biddable.

It may be that they underestimated him (or I'm entirely wrong) and I don't deny that the economic response has been done well but I'd say it's a little early to make a judgement.

[Devils_Advocate]

Agreed with that but given they'd just had someone quit under somewhat embarrassing cicrumstances you'd think that they'd take care in making sure his replacement was somewhat more biddable.

It may be that they underestimated him (or I'm entirely wrong) and I don't deny that the economic response has been done well but I'd say it's a little early to make a judgement.

I did caveat it was only based on a short window but I can only judge on what I've seen so far.

[tiger76]

Agreed with that but given they'd just had someone quit under somewhat embarrassing cicrumstances you'd think that they'd take care in making sure his replacement was somewhat more biddable.

It may be that they underestimated him (or I'm entirely wrong) and I don't deny that the economic response has been done well but I'd say it's a little early to make a judgement.

Yes Cummings may have underestimated Sunak,is he a yes man IDK,and we'll only find out in due course,so i agree it's too early to come to a conclusive call.It's telling that he's being given a lot of the frontline briefings now though,and if memory serves he was next in line for the interim PM role in the event of Raab being unavailable while Johnson was in hospital.

[AndrewJB]

yes spend spend spend and object. This was before an international pandemic crisis. The economy really would be up sh*ts creak for decades to come.

What do you think Sunak has just done?

You sound like you subscribe to the belief that "Labour spent all the money" the last time they were in office. The Tories spending completely dwarfs this. Their debt accumulation, even before the crisis, was far in excess of Labour, and now they're sending it into the stratosphere. It's crazy, and not even necessary. They're only doing it because they need the fiction that the system can't be changed. That the only working economic model is that of neo liberalism.

By the same yardstick with which some people claim Labour spent all the money, I can measure the Tory management of the economy right now. Dire.

[Paul Waine]

It was call me “Dave” as in Cameron

Oh, I'd forgotten him.

[Paul Waine]

Personally, I'd reserve judgement on that. Bear in mind that Sunak ended up with the job because Javid refused to be a puppet for Number 10.

Agree, we'd not seen much of "Rishi" before Javid "stood down" - though I think he was involved in some of the Dec-19 campaigns and "showed up well."

Whatever we think of his short history, I don't think anyone expected him to do well as Chancellor in responding to covid-19.

Of course, very easy for a Chancellor to spend money. The proof will be if he retains "credibility" when the issues become much more about the economy "bouncing back" and the ability to fund the "levelling up" programmes over multiple years.

See my earlier post re "given names" - Rishi Sunak is Prime Minister material somewhere in our futures.

[Billy Balfour]

I hope I'm wrong here, but I don't think the bounce back will bounce high enough when you take into the account the figures for Jan/Feb. The economy looked to be already flatlining.