Russia Invades

JarrowClaret · Post by **JarrowClaret** » Sun Mar 27, 2022 11:03 pm

Swizzlestick wrote: ↑
Sun Mar 27, 2022 9:54 pm
You were posting info from pro Russia sources without hesitation earlier in this thread so it’s clear where your sensibilities lie and you deserve any criticism coming your direction.

Hiya Swizzle I’m sorry but that is plain wrong this topic is an open one and ALL views and links are welcome no matter the side. Just because Ukraine are the good guys it doesn’t mean everything they say is correct similarly not everything that is pro Russian is wrong, it seems the vast majority that I have seen is but hey there will be some that is right somewhere.

Lowbankclaret · Post by **Lowbankclaret** » Sun Mar 27, 2022 11:23 pm

dermotdermot wrote: ↑
Sun Mar 27, 2022 10:17 pm
Just for the record I am not condoning what Russia has done in any way whatsoever. It is barbaric, medieval and frankly unbelievable. Its just that there’s something about Zelensky that makes me feel uncomfortable. I can’t be alone in feeling this way.

Have you watched the links where Russia intends to move on NATO countries or how they intend to nuke western cities. I know which ones I feel more uncomfortable with.

dermotdermot · Post by **dermotdermot** » Mon Mar 28, 2022 2:53 am

Lowbankclaret wrote: ↑
Sun Mar 27, 2022 11:23 pm
Have you watched the links where Russia intends to move on NATO countries or how they intend to nuke western cities. I know which ones I feel more uncomfortable with.

No, I haven’t seen that at all. Perhaps you can provide a link?

Lancasterclaret · Post by **Lancasterclaret** » Mon Mar 28, 2022 7:34 am

dermotdermot wrote: ↑
Mon Mar 28, 2022 2:53 am
No, I haven’t seen that at all. Perhaps you can provide a link?

Said it before, but worth repeating

Those links are just Russian domestic propaganda for domestic consumption (and for people in the West who don't know the actual strength of the Russian army to worry about)

They can say what they like, but 65% of all of Russia army in now in Ukraine, and stuck there.

They have had to pull troops out of areas they really don't want to (Armenia, South Ossetia) and that is on top of the troops that moved from central asia and the far east before the invasion

Its just propaganda lads, just to remind the domestic audience how strong Russia is (and countering all the stuff that Russians are seeing online from more authentic Western sources)

Hipper · Post by **Hipper** » Mon Mar 28, 2022 8:08 am

It seems Zelensky had a popularity of about 20% before this war but, especially when you consider his circumstances, the weight on his shoulders, his probable lack of sleep, his frustrations, and his Ukraine centred views, it's hard to believe Ukraine could have a better leader at this time.

If he says things against NATO, the west or individual countries, as he has, it's because he's trying to make us do more to help Ukraine - perfectly understandable as he sees his country and people being destroyed all around him.

Furthermore, comparing what he said to the rebel Russian reporters to Putin's outbursts shows only one of them has some sanity.

Zelensky has done brilliantly for Ukraine - comparisons to Churchill are not far wrong.

bfcjg · Post by **bfcjg** » Mon Mar 28, 2022 8:57 am

Pro Russian political chat show apparently having a real dig at Putin.
https://uk.news.yahoo.com/russia-no-los ... 18092.html

Lancasterclaret · Post by **Lancasterclaret** » Mon Mar 28, 2022 9:11 am

bfcjg wrote: ↑
Mon Mar 28, 2022 8:57 am
Pro Russian political chat show apparently having a real dig at Putin.
https://uk.news.yahoo.com/russia-no-los ... 18092.html

And showing that all this is for show, another, very pro-Putin tv show saying Ukraine is part of Russia and can't be anything else

https://twitter.com/JuliaDavisNews/stat ... 2136122381

Its all disinformation lads

Just like that Russian army thing a couple of days back saying they were only concentrating on the Donbass

Since then they have continued to do exactly what they were doing before, ie shelling and destroying Ukraine and not going anywhere fast

You cannot take anything from Russian sources as anything other than total, utter misinformation until its proved by multiple western sources to be correct (or as happens all the time, 100% incorrect)

Boss Hogg · Post by **Boss Hogg** » Mon Mar 28, 2022 9:38 am

Hipper wrote: ↑
Mon Mar 28, 2022 8:08 am
It seems Zelensky had a popularity of about 20% before this war but, especially when you consider his circumstances, the weight on his shoulders, his probable lack of sleep, his frustrations, and his Ukraine centred views, it's hard to believe Ukraine could have a better leader at this time.

If he says things against NATO, the west or individual countries, as he has, it's because he's trying to make us do more to help Ukraine - perfectly understandable as he sees his country and people being destroyed all around him.

Furthermore, comparing what he said to the rebel Russian reporters to Putin's outbursts shows only one of them has some sanity.

Zelensky has done brilliantly for Ukraine - comparisons to Churchill are not far wrong.

Zelensky is doing an admirable job. This ‘war’ has gone on for a month whilst Churchill was in charge from May 1940 through to VE Day in 1945. We stood alone for a large period and most of Europe was occupied/ bombed. I think comparisons are a bit premature.

Quickenthetempo · Post by **Quickenthetempo** » Mon Mar 28, 2022 9:39 am

https://twitter.com/SamMunnery/status/1 ... 3PCnA&s=19
Interesting development for Abramovic.

Retweeted by credible journalist Matt Lawton.

Lots of views in the follow up tweets. Make your own minds up.

Spijed · Post by **Spijed** » Mon Mar 28, 2022 9:42 am

Seems the majority of countries aren't keen on sanctioning Russia:
https://twitter.com/DerekJGrossman/stat ... 8176673792

Lancasterclaret · Post by **Lancasterclaret** » Mon Mar 28, 2022 10:13 am

Quickenthetempo wrote: ↑
Mon Mar 28, 2022 9:39 am
https://twitter.com/SamMunnery/status/1 ... 3PCnA&s=19
Interesting development for Abramovic.

Retweeted by credible journalist Matt Lawton.

Lots of views in the follow up tweets. Make your own minds up.

Zelensky is very good at this isn't he?

Lancasterclaret · Post by **Lancasterclaret** » Mon Mar 28, 2022 10:14 am

Spijed wrote: ↑
Mon Mar 28, 2022 9:42 am
Seems the majority of countries aren't keen on sanctioning Russia:
https://twitter.com/DerekJGrossman/stat ... 8176673792

Spijed, if only economies worked on the basis of one state, one economic effect eh?

bfcjg · Post by **bfcjg** » Mon Mar 28, 2022 10:16 am

I took it that the hardliners are warning Putin he has to win, I just hope the Russian people rise up eventually.

Lancasterclaret · Post by **Lancasterclaret** » Mon Mar 28, 2022 10:27 am

bfcjg wrote: ↑
Mon Mar 28, 2022 10:16 am
I took it that the hardliners are warning Putin he has to win, I just hope the Russian people rise up eventually.

Oh, I'm sure they are

All very April 1945 in Berlin

Lancasterclaret · Post by **Lancasterclaret** » Mon Mar 28, 2022 10:29 am

https://twitter.com/EuromaidanPress/sta ... 8435994630

Interesting that the Russian censors blocked Zelenskys interview with Russian journalists

And sounds like a pretty generous offer from Ukraine

Sottpark1 ! · Post by **Sottpark1 !** » Mon Mar 28, 2022 10:39 am

Sadly Russia will take Mariupol soon, the Russians will get their landbridge linking all their seized areas.The Ukraine needs more weapons and support now before this happens .Then Russia will start real negotiations sadly as many other wars and conflicts show its the what you hold tends to determine how the final or settlements turn out.Putin will be able to sell that as a win unfortunately.

Lancasterclaret · Post by **Lancasterclaret** » Mon Mar 28, 2022 10:47 am

Sottpark1 ! wrote: ↑
Mon Mar 28, 2022 10:39 am
Sadly Russia will take Mariupol soon, the Russians will get their landbridge linking all their seized areas.The Ukraine needs more weapons and support now before this happens .Then Russia will start real negotiations sadly as many other wars and conflicts show its the what you hold tends to determine how the final or settlements turn out.Putin will be able to sell that as a win unfortunately.

Thing is, its not a win for Russia on any level

And its very unlikely the Ukrainians in those areas will accept Russian rule, and the areas are absolutely in ruins

I do agree that he might be able to spin it as win, but there won't be a peace deal based on that front line

Absolutely no way Ukraine accepts that after a month of war in which they have unquestionably fought off an attempt by Russia to take over their entire country

The longer this goes on, the biggest dangers are for Russia (and everyone else unfortunately), not for Ukraine

Sottpark1 ! · Post by **Sottpark1 !** » Mon Mar 28, 2022 11:24 am

I agree it’s not a win for Russia judged through our prism, but land gains, a “ neutral “ Ukraine will be seen that way by Putin and his cronies and his many supporters in Africa and Arab countries, etc .Many Ukrainians have left those areas , having fled or been killed .Any deal which surrenders this land will be seen as a sellout by some and the price it takes to stop this war by others, If it was me I would prefer to see Russia driven back to its lands and the recovery of Crimea and Donetsk and Luhansk sadly that won’t happen .So a compromise will be reached if peace is to be achieved and it won’t be accepted by some maybe many.I agree a prolonged conflict will only drag more people into this.

dushanbe · Post by **dushanbe** » Mon Mar 28, 2022 11:35 am

Spijed wrote: ↑
Mon Mar 28, 2022 9:42 am
Seems the majority of countries aren't keen on sanctioning Russia:
https://twitter.com/DerekJGrossman/stat ... 8176673792

Looking at that map, anywhere with any wealth is joining in.

Lancasterclaret · Post by **Lancasterclaret** » Mon Mar 28, 2022 12:33 pm

Current situation and detailed maps

https://twitter.com/JominiW/status/1508277660954279941

MODERATOR - Can posters please provide links to sources before, “I’ve seen..” The reason we add sources is so that they can be investigated and commented on sensibly. - I heard the world is flat and the clouds are made of cotton wool, is not an argument, and does not make it right, for example.

elwaclaret · Post by **elwaclaret** » Mon Mar 28, 2022 1:40 pm

REUTERS: EU look at creating a ‘golden passport’ schemes and halting the sale of visas to Russians.

https://twitter.com/reuters/status/1508 ... rZJtUhYqUA

elwaclaret · Post by **elwaclaret** » Mon Mar 28, 2022 1:45 pm

CADDICK-ADAMS: EU member countries (Germany, Poland and US predominantly) to provide replacement diesel to Ukraine following the attacks on stores around Lviv.

https://twitter.com/militaryhistori/sta ... Hm7QMvLf-Q

bfcjg · Post by **bfcjg** » Mon Mar 28, 2022 1:46 pm

: lcimg-72e43640-af58-4cab-8758-52857ebe8a5e.jpg (79.3 KiB) Viewed 2585 times

Ukraine version of Banksy, very good painting IMHO.

elwaclaret · Post by **elwaclaret** » Mon Mar 28, 2022 1:48 pm

PHILLIPS OBrien - Kazakhstan deputy ministers makes plain they have no intention of falling behind a new Iron Curtain.

https://twitter.com/phillipspobrien/sta ... ZVpYSBywAQ

NewClaret · Post by **NewClaret** » Mon Mar 28, 2022 1:51 pm

Spijed wrote: ↑
Mon Mar 28, 2022 9:42 am
Seems the majority of countries aren't keen on sanctioning Russia:
https://twitter.com/DerekJGrossman/stat ... 8176673792

Interesting. Lots of places Abramovic can still live!

elwaclaret · Post by **elwaclaret** » Mon Mar 28, 2022 1:51 pm

bfcjg wrote: ↑
Mon Mar 28, 2022 1:46 pm
lcimg-72e43640-af58-4cab-8758-52857ebe8a5e.jpg
Ukraine version of Banksy, very good painting IMHO.

I’d have gone for a Child/mother, or seventeen year old conscript Russian personally, The one person he is totally unwilling to risk is himself; that is the danger. But yes, agree with the sentiment.

elwaclaret · Post by **elwaclaret** » Mon Mar 28, 2022 1:53 pm

NewClaret wrote: ↑
Mon Mar 28, 2022 1:51 pm
Interesting. Lots of places Abramovic can still live!

Lots of places where pound notes still out-way morals.

elwaclaret · Post by **elwaclaret** » Mon Mar 28, 2022 1:57 pm

PHILLIPS OBrien - More on Azerbaijan sanding up to Russia

https://twitter.com/phillipspobrien/sta ... B80bQYjdpQ

…and they have warned Russia to remove all their Georgian forces, currently illegally operating in Azerbaijan

https://twitter.com/phillipspobrien/sta ... ZC_20Br87w

Lancasterclaret · Post by **Lancasterclaret** » Mon Mar 28, 2022 2:02 pm

Five military aircraft covering the air space from the NATO side of the border with Ukraine

All of them specific electronic warfare aircraft

Interesting to see a Swedish one there

https://twitter.com/Conflicts/status/15 ... 8214978566

elwaclaret · Post by **elwaclaret** » Mon Mar 28, 2022 2:03 pm

NEXTA: With a side swipe at Russia increasingly reliance on Syrian support to suggest they have ‘allies’ in their quest.

https://twitter.com/nexta_tv/status/150 ... LMsOCPYH2w

KRBFC · Post by **KRBFC** » Mon Mar 28, 2022 2:03 pm

KRBFC wrote: ↑
Sun Mar 27, 2022 5:41 pm
Videos doing the rounds of Russian POWs being intentionally shot in the legs by Ukrainians.

MODERATOR: As useful no reference, purely speculative fishing, do you never get bored?

What are you talking about Moderator? did you want me to link a video of dead bodies and people getting shot close range?

''Speculative fishing because I'm bored'' here you are, enjoy the video of dead bodies piled up

https://twitter.com/politblogme/status/ ... 0UPn8NM0kQ

MODERATOR - Thank you - no I did not need to see dead bodies, but your comment is not unexpected - what is interesting not one follower of academic note - she is not followed by academics or WORLD News agencies…. It is a VERY POOR SOURCE.

elwaclaret · Post by **elwaclaret** » Mon Mar 28, 2022 2:06 pm

NEXTA: Woman who threw Molotov cocktail at a Russian policemen in Moscow, given two year jail sentence.

https://twitter.com/nexta_tv/status/150 ... SqUfcD1Rrw

elwaclaret · Post by **elwaclaret** » Mon Mar 28, 2022 2:07 pm

BBC WORLD SERVICE- Ukraine will not open humanitarian corridors after information they will lead to ‘Russian provocations’

https://twitter.com/bbcworld/status/150 ... _dJLEDINUg

elwaclaret · Post by **elwaclaret** » Mon Mar 28, 2022 2:08 pm

NEXTA: Germany and G7 rule out Ruble oil payments

https://twitter.com/nexta_tv/status/150 ... ZgGohEzECA

Lancasterclaret · Post by **Lancasterclaret** » Mon Mar 28, 2022 2:10 pm

KRBFC wrote: ↑
Mon Mar 28, 2022 2:03 pm
What are you talking about Moderator? did you want me to link a video of dead bodies and people getting shot close range?

''Speculative fishing because I'm bored'' here you are, enjoy the video of dead bodies piled up

https://twitter.com/politblogme/status/ ... 0UPn8NM0kQ

There is also a report from the Ukrainian government saying they will look into it, and promise to deal severely with anyone who has participated if its genuine

Anyone who took the time to find the video of that you've posted would have also found that in about 0.5 seconds

Both should really be mentioned I feel

Of course, it takes even less time to find lots of evidence of Russian war crimes, but a hell of a lot longer to find Russia willing to investigate them or admit they exist

Sadly, the days of lost Russian soldiers joking with Ukrainians about getting a tow back to Russia are long gone, and in wars, everyone involved has people on their side that do things that you should never do

MODERATOR - Quite frankly, I’d be amazed if such things were not happening. It is a war zone full of angry defenders who have lost family members. The source is questionable at best.

Lancasterclaret · Post by **Lancasterclaret** » Mon Mar 28, 2022 2:17 pm

This being a case in point (Ukrainian troops using dead Russian soldiers phones to call their parents to tell them their sons are dead)

These kind of things will become more common on both sides as this war drags on

https://twitter.com/RALee85/status/1508432318347759617

elwaclaret · Post by **elwaclaret** » Mon Mar 28, 2022 2:26 pm

NEXTA: Reporting Russian media reports that Ramzan Kadyrov is back in Ukraine in Mariupol.

https://twitter.com/nexta_tv/status/150 ... ZuyOC0tP7Q

But also point out that last time Russia made this claim, phone location evidence proved he was not in Ukraine.

elwaclaret · Post by **elwaclaret** » Mon Mar 28, 2022 2:30 pm

CADDICK-ADAMS - is doing a special on the Ukraine conflict at 8.30pm (UK) tonight and will be joined by comedian/historian Al Murray among other guests.

https://twitter.com/militaryhistori/sta ... ELOg2HORqA

elwaclaret · Post by **elwaclaret** » Mon Mar 28, 2022 2:37 pm

HISTORY TODAY - looking at the CIA’s covert history of conflict with Communism ( much of it opposed by Britain when you look at official transcripts of the time) and the reason China and Russia distrust the western messages of today.

https://twitter.com/historytoday/status ... 3RR4X0yKnw

Hipper · Post by **Hipper** » Mon Mar 28, 2022 2:44 pm

Spijed wrote: ↑
Mon Mar 28, 2022 9:42 am
Seems the majority of countries aren't keen on sanctioning Russia:
https://twitter.com/DerekJGrossman/stat ... 8176673792

By comparison:

https://inews.co.uk/news/un-russia-vote ... on-1494907

Five countries that voted against. 38 abstensions. 141 in favour.

Many of these countries aren't in an economic position to either effect sanctions or suffer them.

elwaclaret · Post by **elwaclaret** » Mon Mar 28, 2022 2:49 pm

REUTERS: EU to look to make social media tech giants answerable for their disinformation content expected in April (of course some board members will decide its pro-western censorship rather than ethical cleansing of misinformation)

https://twitter.com/reuters/status/1508 ... UVu5cZr49A

elwaclaret · Post by **elwaclaret** » Mon Mar 28, 2022 2:54 pm

Phillips OBrien - Talk of Russia renewing attacks around Kyiv in light of push-backs around Irpin seems like disinformation designed to keep Ukrainian forces supporting the defence of East.

https://twitter.com/phillipspobrien/sta ... ixCX6VJgsg

elwaclaret · Post by **elwaclaret** » Mon Mar 28, 2022 2:58 pm

Philips OBrien - looks at Russian ‘bot’ twitter accounts spreading false flag pro Russian information (that the unwary accept as ‘factual’ and spread as counter argument)

https://twitter.com/phillipspobrien/sta ... VGx2A9h00w

elwaclaret · Post by **elwaclaret** » Mon Mar 28, 2022 3:02 pm

NEXTA: Irpin now liberated says Ukrainian Mayor

https://twitter.com/nexta_tv/status/150 ... IO3K0n0sxQ

dermotdermot · Post by **dermotdermot** » Mon Mar 28, 2022 3:05 pm

Lancasterclaret wrote: ↑
Mon Mar 28, 2022 2:10 pm
There is also a report from the Ukrainian government saying they will look into it, and promise to deal severely with anyone who has participated if its genuine

Anyone who took the time to find the video of that you've posted would have also found that in about 0.5 seconds

Both should really be mentioned I feel

Of course, it takes even less time to find lots of evidence of Russian war crimes, but a hell of a lot longer to find Russia willing to investigate them or admit they exist

Sadly, the days of lost Russian soldiers joking with Ukrainians about getting a tow back to Russia are long gone, and in wars, everyone involved has people on their side that do things that you should never do

MODERATOR - Quite frankly, I’d be amazed if such things were not happening. It is a war zone full of angry defenders who have lost family members. The source is questionable at best.

They may be angry but I’m not so sure that sort of behaviour, if true, is justified. Far from. And also very telling that Zelensky leaves it to one of his advisors to remind his soldiers to try to adhere to the Geneva Convention and avoid atrocities, rather than addressing them himself.

elwaclaret · Post by **elwaclaret** » Mon Mar 28, 2022 3:05 pm

Peter Caddick-Adams: Danger for Odessa is Russian forces to the north supporting attacks in the East, while Ukrainians defenders remained ‘pinned’.

https://twitter.com/militaryhistori/sta ... V4KQK7ofpg

elwaclaret · Post by **elwaclaret** » Mon Mar 28, 2022 3:08 pm

dermotdermot wrote: ↑
Mon Mar 28, 2022 3:05 pm
They may be angry but I’m not so sure that sort of behaviour, if true, is justified. Far from. And also very telling that Zelensky leaves it to one of his advisors to remind his soldiers to try to adhere to the Geneva Convention and avoid atrocities, rather than addressing them himself.

I would suggest this demonstrates the level of such events, isolated instances of revenge - not right, but quite correctly left for relevant departmental heads to address.

Lancasterclaret · Post by **Lancasterclaret** » Mon Mar 28, 2022 3:13 pm

dermotdermot wrote: ↑
Mon Mar 28, 2022 3:05 pm
They may be angry but I’m not so sure that sort of behaviour, if true, is justified. Far from. And also very telling that Zelensky leaves it to one of his advisors to remind his soldiers to try to adhere to the Geneva Convention and avoid atrocities, rather than addressing them himself.

You really are down on Zelensky aren't you?

This is were I get really boring, and ask you to share your source material that you've based your opinion on

I mean, you are not going to come to that conclusion without anything to back it up are you?

Lowbankclaret · Post by **Lowbankclaret** » Mon Mar 28, 2022 3:24 pm

KRBFC wrote: ↑
Mon Mar 28, 2022 2:03 pm
What are you talking about Moderator? did you want me to link a video of dead bodies and people getting shot close range?

''Speculative fishing because I'm bored'' here you are, enjoy the video of dead bodies piled up

https://twitter.com/politblogme/status/ ... 0UPn8NM0kQ

MODERATOR - Thank you - no I did not need to see dead bodies, but your comment is not unexpected - what is interesting not one follower of academic note - she is not followed by academics or WORLD News agencies…. It is a VERY POOR SOURCE.

This video was discussed but not shown on CNN earlier.

Couple of things to take into account.

Two weeks ago there was a story of I think from memory a Russian soldier talking to his mother. He was telling her, Russian soldiers were searching for Ukrainian ammo so they could shoot themselves in the leg and hence be transferred back home.

CNN, we’re saying this could be a Russian propaganda video. Ukrainian military said it concerning and full investigation would be carried out. Ukrainian soldiers are told to treat Russian captive well.

No one could specifically state if they were Ukrainian soldiers in the video.

Vegas Claret · Post by **Vegas Claret** » Mon Mar 28, 2022 3:47 pm

no wonder Russia are having difficulties
https://twitter.com/GirkinGirkin/status ... Le9NzBbOVA