Their Penalties

[FCBurnley]

I don’t care. We won despite the Wirral refs best efforts

[elwaclaret]

Everton were ‘clever’ first one the kid makes sure there is contact- he does the Wolves trick of moving his trailing leg into Westwoods path. Second there was contact but not enough for the ‘dive’ made sure the VAR would see ‘contact’. Probably a penalty but I’d have refused to give it for the exaggerated dive.

[KRBFC]

Everton were ‘clever’ first one the kid makes sure there is contact- he does the Wolves trick of moving his trailing leg into Westwoods path. Second there was contact but not enough for the ‘dive’ made sure the VAR would see ‘contact’. Probably a penalty but I’d have refused to give it for the exaggerated dive.

Lennon steam rolled into his leg and we all know if he didn’t go down he wouldn’t have got the decision

[elwaclaret]

Lennon steam rolled into his leg and we all know if he didn’t go down he wouldn’t have got the decision

Steam rolled his leg, I’d say he tapped his calf adjusting his leg position. For him to go down like that he’s have had to have a wooden leg, therefore it was a dive.

[NewClaret]

Both penalties for me. I’d be livid had we not got either.

First is soft but you’re allowed to stop and draw a foul. We do it all the time, just never in the opposition box since we rarely have have the ball on the deck/in possession there.

Second is a stone wall pen. And foul anywhere else on the pitch. Albeit at the time I was screaming for a yellow as it looked a dive, but replays confirm.

Would love to see the handball shout and Cornet’s dive again though.

[KRBFC]

Steam rolled his leg, I’d say he tapped his calf adjusting his leg position. For him to go down like that he’s have had to have a wooden leg, therefore it was a dive.

he definitely didn't tap his leg, he swung for the ball, missed and kicked his leg, when has that not been a foul anywhere in football?

[elwaclaret]

he definitely didn't tap his leg, he swung for the ball, missed and kicked his leg, when has that not been a foul anywhere in football?

I’m really not sure you read properly. You constantly try to create arguments where none exist. Did I not say it was probably a penalty; but I’d have been tempted, due to the level of exaggeration in the dive to treat it as such. If you spent more time reading what people were saying and less time trying to be superior, you’d see quite often why people lose their rag with you.

[Hipper]

Just seen the highlights.

Putting aside the legitimacy of the penalties, Richarlison actually stops - at least to my eyes he does - during the half hour he spent taking the first one.

That is not allowed, is it?

'The player taking the penalty kick.... offends' when:

'feinting to kick the ball once the kicker has completed the run-up (feinting in the run-up is permitted); the referee cautions the kicker'.


https://www.thefa.com/football-rules-go ... nalty-kick

[Cirrus_Minor]

We can take the claret and blue specs off now, they were both penalties. We would have been more than annoyed if we had these disallowed.

And we won.

[Steve-Harpers-perm]

We can take the claret and blue specs off now, they were both penalties. We would have been more than annoyed if we had these disallowed.

And we won.

Maybe with the specs on but I’m not sure we would have got either of them if it had been the other way round last night.

[beddie]

Not having it that people say both were nailed on pens.

Pen 1: The caveat here is that it was Anthony Gordon who is one of the biggest Vardy type diving cheats you will ever see. Stupid and clumsy from Westwood, but Gordon knew what he was doing. Clever play? Maybe. Would we have got it at Old Trafford or Anfield? Doubtful

Pen: 2: Soft, a bi-product of the modern age and VAR where any slight contact equals a foul

1: Spot on. Gordon dived and at the same time threw his leg back. It’s called cheating.

2: Soft but Lennon was at fault.

[burnmark]

PSV just had an almost carbon copy of the second penalty last night turned down at Leicester. No VAR until the final though.

[ecc]

'The player taking the penalty kick.... offends' when:

'feinting to kick the ball once the kicker has completed the run-up (feinting in the run-up is permitted); the referee cautions the kicker'.


https://www.thefa.com/football-rules-go ... nalty-kick

Hi Hipper,

Yes, I read the rule again today. I think the feinting business is crap for a starter but those are the rules.

What is the definition of "feint" here?

[nil_desperandum]

I don’t care. We won despite the Wirral refs best efforts

The Wirral ref (a Tranmere supporter, so unlikely to be an Evertonian [if that's your insinuation]), didn't give either of them initially, so you can hardly accuse him of being over enthusiastic about penalising us.
Yes, he could have ignored VAR, but I don't think I've seen an instance where an on-field ref has gone against VAR.

[timshorts]

1: Spot on. Gordon dived and at the same time threw his leg back. It’s called cheating.

2: Soft but Lennon was at fault.

Agree 100%.

With number one, "threw his leg back" to make leg contact with Westwood = he deliberately kicked Westwood not the other way round.
Further up somebody said Gordon went down having his shirt pulled, but if your shirt is pulled back, it does not catapult you in the opposite direction.

If Lampard concentrated on coaching Everton to defend properly rather than dive properly then they might have a better chance of staying up. I really can't remember them being such divers last season or earlier this. Perhaps it is just Gordon coming into the team.
If he is that keen on diving, perhaps he should just go back to driving thunderbird 4.

[CharlieinNewMexico]

he definitely didn't tap his leg, he swung for the ball, missed and kicked his leg, when has that not been a foul anywhere in football?

Addressed by IFAB in the summer. Contact has to be enough to make a fully grown hyper-fit player fall over (I’m paraphrasing, wheres Ashington when you need him) not just “contact”.

Point is, Lennon dusts his toenail and he throws both his feet in the air, as you well know.

[dandeclaret]

he definitely didn't tap his leg, he swung for the ball, missed and kicked his leg, when has that not been a foul anywhere in football?

In the West Ham game last night? Identical incident, reviewed by VAR, no penalty, no recommendation to go to the screen.... nada.

[KRBFC]

Addressed by IFAB in the summer. Contact has to be enough to make a fully grown hyper-fit player fall over (I’m paraphrasing, wheres Ashington when you need him) not just “contact”.

Point is, Lennon dusts his toenail and he throws both his feet in the air, as you well know.

He doesn't dust his toenail at all, watch it again, there's a reason Lennon doesn't complain.

[ŽižkovClaret]

Both penalties.

First one was clumsy from Westwood and whilst it was a blatant dive for their second one Lennon did catch his foot and gave him the opportunity to throw himself over. I don't like it but it's a penalty these days.

Aye both pens and frankly daft naiive errors from the players involved. Less of that please lads eh?

[SurreyClaret]

I can see why there are conflicting views on the first - in my opinion Gordon deliberately extends his leg backwards clearly conning the ref, no way was that natural, so no penalty. The second one Lennon definitely catches his standing leg, it isn’t enough to merit him throwing himself like he did, but it’s a foul anywhere else on the pitch, so has to be a penalty albeit a very soft one.

One reason I think we suffered on these penalties is the way we reacted after they were given. I really believe player reaction has an impact on both the decisions on and off the field, whether officials like it or not. You watch the way that many other teams get incensed when a penalty is or isn’t given, versus how we react (or certainly reacted last night). As long as you don’t overstep the mark, why not do what most Prem teams do, and act like we have been hard done by in that period between the incident up to VAR deciding.

I love the fact we are an honest team but I do think officials use reactions of players involved as a guide, consciously or sub-consciously and we often don’t get the rub of the green as a result. If Westwood in particularly had reacted differently, and acted in a visible manner that clearly showed he felt it wasn’t a pen, it may well have swayed VAR to look at it more closely, or swayed the initial decision ever so slightly, and that might be enough on certain occasions, last night being one of them.

[what_no_pies]

I can see why there are conflicting views on the first - in my opinion Gordon deliberately extends his leg backwards clearly conning the ref, no way was that natural, so no penalty. The second one Lennon definitely catches his standing leg, it isn’t enough to merit him throwing himself like he did, but it’s a foul anywhere else on the pitch, so has to be a penalty albeit a very soft one.

One reason I think we suffered on these penalties is the way we reacted after they were given. I really believe player reaction has an impact on both the decisions on and off the field, whether officials like it or not. You watch the way that many other teams get incensed when a penalty is or isn’t given, versus how we react (or certainly reacted last night). As long as you don’t overstep the mark, why not do what most Prem teams do, and act like we have been hard done by in that period between the incident up to VAR deciding.

I love the fact we are an honest team but I do think officials use reactions of players involved as a guide, consciously or sub-consciously and we often don’t get the rub of the green as a result. If Westwood in particularly had reacted differently, and acted in a visible manner that clearly showed he felt it wasn’t a pen, it may well have swayed VAR to look at it more closely, or swayed the initial decision ever so slightly, and that might be enough on certain occasions, last night being one of them.

Good Post but on the subject of reactions I don't want to see Burnley players pleading for or against decisions if they're not honest claims. It really irks me when any player appeals for a decision (even a throw in) when they know fine well it shouldn't be their ball. It's cheating and I'm really proud Burnley aren't often guilty of it. Refs really ought to start respecting us as a result but that doesn't seem to gain us any favour. It's a tricky one because there's a definite argument for us 'playing the game' when the massive majority of other teams do.