Worried About the Price Cap?

[DCWat]

It’s just not a really good enough is it? Why on earth do they need so many hustings? Cause of some stupid rulings from 1922 or something. The country is on the precipice of a national emergency. We all know it’s going to be Thatcher 2.0 anyway.

For the sake of a few more weeks, it’s the right thing to do. Whoever it is that wins out, their length of their tenure will probably be decided on the support offered.

Don’t do enough and they’ll be handing over the keys to Labour at the next election. Provide sufficient support (which is going to add massively to our already huge national debt, which we pay **** tonnes of interest on) and they’ll dine off it long enough to see them past the post in a year or two.

[GodIsADeeJay81]

Yes they can

Johnson has been on holiday or in the Ukraine more than he's been here

He's still the PM

Yes he is, but a long term vision/plan won't be his and can be replaced by the next one in a few weeks and there will be a cabinet reshuffle etc.

It's not ideal, but we have to wait for his permanent successor to be named

[Zlatan]

I think that is a far too cynical

There are lots of good politicians, in ALL parties, its just that because of the situations over the past few years, a lot of really bad ones have risen to the top

reminds me of the saying "the cream always rises to the top" but that idiom doesn't really apply to politics, however in a similar way I think in the current climate it should be noted that in the cesspit of government the worst type of crap floats because its full of hot air...

[tiger76]

Was he ever the PM, really? Or just an empty suit?

Either way, the current political situation is unsustainable and there will probably have to be a general election sooner rather than later.

Johnson is currently a lame duck PM, and as for any general election there's no way the Tories will want to go to the country anytime soon, as they'd be thumped at the ballot box judging by the polls over the past couple of months.

Whoever emerges as the new PM. and safe to assume it'll be Truss, they'll have to come up with some viable short-term solutions to avert the worst of this looming energy crisis.

Yes there 'does need to be a long term approach, and in all honesty that should have been put in place decades ago, as the French did, which is why their citizens aren't facing the enormous price hikes we in the UK are.

My biggest fear isn't for our household, but I do worry him many businesses will emerge out the other side.

Not to mention essential places like care homes, who are not covered by the price cap, and will somehow have to fund eye-watering increases, and sadly some have already closed, which in turn means the NHS could be be even busier this coming winter,

[Lancasterclaret]

Johnson is currently a lame duck PM, and as for any general election there's no way the Tories will want to go to the country anytime soon, as they'd be thumped at the ballot box judging by the polls over the past couple of months.

Whoever emerges as the new PM. and safe to assume it'll be Truss, they'll have to come up with some viable short-term solutions to avert the worst of this looming energy crisis.

Yes there 'does need to be a long term approach, and in all honesty that should have been put in place decades ago, as the French did, which is why their citizens aren't facing the enormous price hikes we in the UK are.

My biggest fear isn't for our household, but I do worry him many businesses will emerge out the other side.

Not to mention essential places like care homes, who are not covered by the price cap, and will somehow have to fund eye-watering increases, and sadly some have already closed, which in turn means the NHS could be be even busier this coming winter,

I just want politicians to acknowledge this, rather than bang on about culture wars, the EU, the French, the Germans, the Irish and whatever else enables them to blame the looming crisis on

[NottsClaret]

It's going to hit the fan at some point this winter. Probably as the latest 'deaths from cold' figures are announced on the same day Shell or BP declare their latest multi billion pound profit for the quarter.

The only thing is, you rarely see a riot in winter, it's very much a warm weather sport.

[JohnMcGreal]

Johnson is currently a lame duck PM, and as for any general election there's no way the Tories will want to go to the country anytime soon, as they'd be thumped at the ballot box judging by the polls over the past couple of months.

Whoever emerges as the new PM. and safe to assume it'll be Truss, they'll have to come up with some viable short-term solutions to avert the worst of this looming energy crisis.

Yes there 'does need to be a long term approach, and in all honesty that should have been put in place decades ago, as the French did, which is why their citizens aren't facing the enormous price hikes we in the UK are.

My biggest fear isn't for our household, but I do worry him many businesses will emerge out the other side.

Not to mention essential places like care homes, who are not covered by the price cap, and will somehow have to fund eye-watering increases, and sadly some have already closed, which in turn means the NHS could be be even busier this coming winter,

They won't want to, but it's easy to see how this crisis (and others) could engulf them.

Truss will be a weak PM with a legitimacy and authority problem from day one. Not only will she have no mandate from the electorate, she won't even have the support of the majority of her own MPs, who favoured Sunak in far greater numbers.

Throw in the ongoing tug of war with her hard-line backers and the EU over Northern Ireland, the inevitable recession that's heading our way, the further devaluation of £ sterling, and it could quite rapidly collapse around her.

I don't think we'll be waiting 2 years for an election.

[Jakubclaret]

Bit if a difference though eh, this is going to impact of far wider range of people than just the less well off people of the 80s.

Guaranteed it won’t stop the new IPhone 14 & latest Samsung flagships flying off the shelf’s or people feeding the coke habit at £40 a pop what we’ve been hearing about on the other threads, I do think a lot of people with political agendas are using this issue to have a go at the government & making things appear a lot worse off than really are.

[Swizzlestick]

Guaranteed it won’t stop the new IPhone 14 & latest Samsung flagships flying off the shelf’s or people feeding the coke habit at £40 a pop what we’ve been hearing about on the other threads, I do think a lot of people with political agendas are using this issue to have a go at the government & making things appear a lot worse off than really are.

You’re repugnant.

[dsr]

Just out of interest, people whose jobs carried on during the pandemic had 100% of salary but much less to spend it on - no holidays, no eating or drinking out for much of the time, no shows or entertainment. Where's the money gone? Did they spend it on other things like home improvements, or have they splurged it since, or have they (deliberately or subconsciously) adjusted their lifestyle to spend more on other things?

Please don't look at this as a criticism, I genuinely want to know. Because I can easily cover the increased heating costs out of my savings during the pandemic, not that I want to but I can, and I would like to know why most people can't. (Obviously the people on 80% wages don't have the option.)

[Nori1958]

You’re repugnant.

Take away the username... Which parts are wrong with the post?

[claret2018]

Just out of interest, people whose jobs carried on during the pandemic had 100% of salary but much less to spend it on - no holidays, no eating or drinking out for much of the time, no shows or entertainment. Where's the money gone? Did they spend it on other things like home improvements, or have they splurged it since, or have they (deliberately or subconsciously) adjusted their lifestyle to spend more on other things?

Please don't look at this as a criticism, I genuinely want to know. Because I can easily cover the increased heating costs out of my savings during the pandemic, not that I want to but I can, and I would like to know why most people can't. (Obviously the people on 80% wages don't have the option.)

How long were restaurants and holidays actually closed off for? A few months tops- obviously reduced capacity etc for a while, but there wasn’t a huge amount of time where everything was shut.

The increase in price of food etc has surely negated any savings made during this time.

[claret2018]

Take away the username... Which parts are wrong with the post?

It’s exactly the sort of nonsense spouted by the right wing press that gullible people lap up.

[Swizzlestick]

Take away the username... Which parts are wrong with the post?

The snobbish insinuation that people are struggling because they’re buying fancy phones and using cocaine(!)

And the insinuation that this is a political angle thing and that it isn’t actually happening. It is actually happening and nothing is being done to resolve it by the current government. Is this even arguable?

So essentially, the entire post.

[Nori1958]

Just out of interest, people whose jobs carried on during the pandemic had 100% of salary but much less to spend it on - no holidays, no eating or drinking out for much of the time, no shows or entertainment. Where's the money gone? Did they spend it on other things like home improvements, or have they splurged it since, or have they (deliberately or subconsciously) adjusted their lifestyle to spend more on other things?

Please don't look at this as a criticism, I genuinely want to know. Because I can easily cover the increased heating costs out of my savings during the pandemic, not that I want to but I can, and I would like to know why most people can't. (Obviously the people on 80% wages don't have the option.)

We don't work, but were certainly better off during covid. I've built up around £800 credit with my energy company as a result which will help over winter, but haven't really changed lifestyle as we are happy as it is

[Nori1958]

The snobbish insinuation that people are struggling because they’re buying fancy phones and using cocaine(!)

And the insinuation that this is a political angle thing and that it isn’t actually happening. It is actually happening and nothing is being done to resolve it by the current government. Is this even arguable?

So essentially, the entire post.

So people won't still buy phones and drugs?
Maybe it's the people I mix with, but they are not struggling, and all come from different backgrounds, different pay levels etc etc

[Lancasterclaret]

Take away the username... Which parts are wrong with the post?

Because its not remotely connected to reality?

[BigGaz]

the most heinous thing about all of this is that this country is absolutely awash with money. Our economy, even in it’s depressed state, is an absolute behemoth.

There is enough money to make this country one of the most technologically and ecologically advanced countries in the world in terms of infrastructure, 5 times over, and still have change. Yet we lag behind many in this respect and it is all by design.

It’d cost c3 billion to privatise our energy, but under Sunak and Starmers plans they’d rather pay energy suppliers up to 27 billion to put together emergency support plans for the people (aka bailing them out)

We could have our own energy storage systems but the tories flogged that off, so the lions share of what we generate is shipped to the continent rather than being in held in reserve to subsidise the British people.

We could have a low cost, high speed, highly connected rail system, but our service providers are owned by foreign governments and the colossal profits that we generate go towards subsidising and improving their own countries infrastructure.

We could have raw **** and **** NOT being pumped into our rivers but Brexit means we’re unable to get hold of the chemicals required to hold and treat the waste. We could have infrastructure that can store and dispose of human waste safely, we could have more reservoirs, but the profits that would enable these things line shareholder pockets.

All of these profits, plus more, could go to supporting YOU this winter. Everyone could benefit from cheaper and more efficient utility, transport and infrastructure costs. But they won’t. Due to ineffective leadership, rampant cronyism, profiteering and weak regulation

Capitalism I don’t have a problem with in theory, but left unchecked and without supervision it is predatory and without scruples, leading to several huge economic failures we’ve all seen in our lifetimes. If we are not going to fully privatise (we should), then there should be a shared ownership model OR a cap on the profits that can be extracted from public services - say 75% must be reinvested back into it for example.

[BigGaz]

So people won't still buy phones and drugs?
Maybe it's the people I mix with, but they are not struggling, and all come from different backgrounds, different pay levels etc etc

They may not be struggling, absolutely correct. Yet.

They may well be still going out and still spending their expendable income, maybe because they’re utterly unaware of what’s around the corner, maybe because the wool is being pulled over their eyes as to how much of a problem we’re facing.

People are going to need supporting when that realisation dawns, not condemning.

[Swizzlestick]

Give it BigGaz until the end of the season.

[GodIsADeeJay81]

I think BigGaz is a little off with that rant of his...

[Devils_Advocate]

Spot on Gaz and very well articulated. Absolutely wasted on the likes of Grumps but hopefully other people might read it and get them thinking a bit deeper about the situation we are in

[BigGaz]

I think BigGaz is a little off with that rant of his...

Indulge me.

[BurnleyFC]

Guaranteed it won’t stop the new IPhone 14 & latest Samsung flagships flying off the shelf’s or people feeding the coke habit at £40 a pop what we’ve been hearing about on the other threads, I do think a lot of people with political agendas are using this issue to have a go at the government & making things appear a lot worse off than really are.

I don’t know of many pensioners with iPhones or 40 quid a day coke habits, but I do know of many that were struggling to heat their homes last winter, let alone this.

[ClaretAndJew]

Burn your furniture to keep warm.

Wooden bed frame? Sleep on a mattress on the floor you poor ******* ****.



EAT THE RICH.

[Billyblah]

I'm seriously dis -chuffed with that Marin Lewis financial adviser character.

Some months ago he was telling the nation to "do nothing" in terms of fixed rate energy contracts . I think the government gave out the same message at some point.

Rather naively, I listened, hence still on Standard tariff with bills about to shoot up. Anyone currently contemplating a fixed rate energy contract or is this very much a case of 'locking the stable door after the horse has bolted '?

[Steve-Harpers-perm]

Don’t worry the chancellor has just said we all should review our energy consumption this winter. Groundbreaking idea from a man who claimed the heating of stables on expenses.

[Lowbankclaret]

the most heinous thing about all of this is that this country is absolutely awash with money. Our economy, even in it’s depressed state, is an absolute behemoth.



We could have raw **** and **** NOT being pumped into our rivers but Brexit means we’re unable to get hold of the chemicals required to hold and treat the waste. We could have infrastructure that can store and dispose of human waste safely, we could have more reservoirs, but the profits that would enable these things line shareholder pockets.

I agree with a lot of what you said, but I have to pick up on this about raw sewage.
It’s no worse now than it’s ever been. I have fished the rivers and the coast of the UK for 30 years.
Rivers in the main have improved in most places.
However the issue of raw sewage has been similar for years. Brexit has not made it worse. There simply are not enough or big enough Sewage farms to deal with the waste.

Most people were ignorant of it but not people who went fishing.
What has changed is the information being put out there by main stream media.

The environment agency has lost its way and it’s teeth. I have recently reported two fish kills and even provided evidence of the culprit and they refused to do anything. 15 years ago they would have prosecuted.

[dsr]

I'm seriously dis -chuffed with that Marin Lewis financial adviser character.

Some months ago he was telling the nation to "do nothing" in terms of fixed rate energy contracts . I think the government gave out the same message at some point.

Rather naively, I listened, hence still on Standard tariff with bills about to shoot up. Anyone currently contemplating a fixed rate energy contract or is this very much a case of 'locking the stable door after the horse has bolted '?

If that was before the Ukraine war, it's hardly his fault. If it was after the war started, then Oops!

[Lowbankclaret]

I'm seriously dis -chuffed with that Marin Lewis financial adviser character.

Some months ago he was telling the nation to "do nothing" in terms of fixed rate energy contracts . I think the government gave out the same message at some point.

Rather naively, I listened, hence still on Standard tariff with bills about to shoot up. Anyone currently contemplating a fixed rate energy contract or is this very much a case of 'locking the stable door after the horse has bolted '?

Fixed contracts are way higher than the CAP rate. Octopus is 71 pence per KWH. But a zero cost option to pull out anytime. Most companies have large charges to get out.

The cap rate is going to be around 50 pence , as I posted last night.

[BigGaz]

I'm seriously dis -chuffed with that Marin Lewis financial adviser character.

Some months ago he was telling the nation to "do nothing" in terms of fixed rate energy contracts . I think the government gave out the same message at some point.

Rather naively, I listened, hence still on Standard tariff with bills about to shoot up. Anyone currently contemplating a fixed rate energy contract or is this very much a case of 'locking the stable door after the horse has bolted '?

I believe that man’s intentions are pure and honest, but how he hasn’t been hauled over the coals for offering financial advice (in some cases totally incorrect) on multiple occasions
I have no idea.

I can’t help you with your query unfortunately but I would encourage anyone to not just take ML’s word as gospel, and have a look and listen around to build up a bigger picture before committing to your decisions.

[Nori1958]

I don’t know of many pensioners with iPhones or 40 quid a day coke habits, but I do know of many that were struggling to heat their homes last winter, let alone this.

My mum is 88..lives on her own, only income is a state pension, which to be honest she struggles to spend. She has an iPhone, sky TV but that's it. If she can do it, why can't others.

[BigGaz]

All fair comments and I probably should have clarified which bits refer to brexit and which don’t. Apologies for that.

I read somewhere yesterday that we haven’t had a new reservoir built in something like 20-30 years and various systems around the country are hugely out of date.

That’s a failure of successive governments and the regulator to bring these types of failures to heel/account.

[GodIsADeeJay81]

Indulge me.

The government didn't flog off energy storage, they just decided to stop subsidising it.

We've been a net importer of gas since 2004, but successive governments from both sides have kept kicking the can down the road in regards to our energy services and infrastructure.

It would cost more than £3 billion to privatise the energy companies.

[Lancasterclaret]

I never going to tell people not to listen to experts, and tell them in the same post to do their own research!

[GodIsADeeJay81]

All fair comments and I probably should have clarified which bits refer to brexit and which don’t. Apologies for that.

I read somewhere yesterday that we haven’t had a new reservoir built in something like 20-30 years and various systems around the country are hugely out of date.

That’s a failure of successive governments and the regulator to bring these types of failures to heel/account.

They're trying to get permission for a new reservoir near to me in South Oxfordshire, but the local council keep rejecting it and Layla Moran keeps banging on about it not being needed etc yet they're building thousands of homes around here...

[BigGaz]

I’m not telling anyone to not listen to experts. I’m saying go away and find multiple sources of knowledge to build a complete picture.

Listen and learn from the MSE, but also cross reference what he’s saying from other sources.

[pompeyclaret]

It’d cost c3 billion to privatise our energy, but under Sunak and Starmers plans they’d rather pay energy suppliers up to 27 billion to put together emergency support plans for the people (aka bailing them out)

sorry, do you really think they could privatise all the energy companies for 3billion, but instead the gov is supporting them with 27billion? They're spending billions on the ex-bulb customers since that went bust, as the cap is generally less than the wholesale cost.

There isn't a magic wand answer

[BigGaz]

Here are some sources relating to the 3 billion i mentioned:

https://www.tuc.org.uk/research-analysi ... nd-climate
https://www.resilience.org/stories/2022 ... -to-do-it/
https://weownit.org.uk/public-ownership/energy
https://www.theweek.co.uk/business/econ ... -companies
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfr ... b-collapse

[NottsClaret]

I'm seriously dis -chuffed with that Marin Lewis financial adviser character.

Some months ago he was telling the nation to "do nothing" in terms of fixed rate energy contracts . I think the government gave out the same message at some point.

Rather naively, I listened, hence still on Standard tariff with bills about to shoot up. Anyone currently contemplating a fixed rate energy contract or is this very much a case of 'locking the stable door after the horse has bolted '?

We fixed relatively cheaply until the end of Dec 2023 a while ago, ignoring the advice at the time. We'll be banking any subsidies / payments for when that eventually runs out. Very worried about the elderly this winter though, going to be horrendous if it's a bad one.

[Jakubclaret]

My mum is 88..lives on her own, only income is a state pension, which to be honest she struggles to spend. She has an iPhone, sky TV but that's it. If she can do it, why can't others.

Things is I wasn't even referring to pensioners it's the pensioners I'm not worried about it's the old people who've got their heads screwed on & they know how to save & are very cautious with spending because of their tough upbringings, it's the younger generation that will struggle before them & are far less experienced with the pitfalls of life.

[dsr]

Here are some sources relating to the 3 billion i mentioned:

https://www.tuc.org.uk/research-analysi ... nd-climate
https://www.resilience.org/stories/2022 ... -to-do-it/
https://weownit.org.uk/public-ownership/energy
https://www.theweek.co.uk/business/econ ... -companies
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfr ... b-collapse

United Utilities has market capitalisation of £7.5 billion. The other five, presumably of a similar order. If they are going to be nationalised for £3bn, there will be stock market repercussions big style at the undervalue. Who's going to want to trade on the London Stock Market if the shares can be taken from you at 10% of their value?

[GodIsADeeJay81]

Here are some sources relating to the 3 billion i mentioned:

https://www.tuc.org.uk/research-analysi ... nd-climate
https://www.resilience.org/stories/2022 ... -to-do-it/
https://weownit.org.uk/public-ownership/energy
https://www.theweek.co.uk/business/econ ... -companies
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfr ... b-collapse

I was wrong with my previous statement, you're not a little off, you're well off the mark.

[claretonthecoast1882]

It is good that the moronic Zahawi has advised to use less this winter

Anyone facing a tough time this winter will feel content now

[BigGaz]

I’m quite happy to take my information from a myriad of well learned, well researched sources than a few blokes on the internet cheers.

[Steve-Harpers-perm]

My mum is 88..lives on her own, only income is a state pension, which to be honest she struggles to spend. She has an iPhone, sky TV but that's it. If she can do it, why can't others.

Maybe not everyone gets the same pension, maybe they are paying carers or care home fees for a loved one. Just a few guesses why not everyone can.

[Lowbankclaret]

All fair comments and I probably should have clarified which bits refer to brexit and which don’t. Apologies for that.

I read somewhere yesterday that we haven’t had a new reservoir built in something like 20-30 years and various systems around the country are hugely out of date.

That’s a failure of successive governments and the regulator to bring these types of failures to heel/account.

They have been closing reservoirs at a fast rate too. There is a large res at the top of Cowpe in Rossendale and just over the hill where Waughs well is, is another res, that’s not used anymore. I was over there a few years ago and there was a diesel pump running at the top of hill pumping water from the res at waughs well to the Cowpe res at it was very low. How this type of stuff has been allowed to happen is a disgrace.

[Zlatan]

United Utilities has market capitalisation of £7.5 billion. The other five, presumably of a similar order. If they are going to be nationalised for £3bn, there will be stock market repercussions big style at the undervalue. Who's going to want to trade on the London Stock Market if the shares can be taken from you at 10% of their value?

to be fair, it was the right wing press attack on Starmer that invented that £3Bn figure when criticising the Labour plan, and others ran with that value. Result was that it made Starmer look bad so the desired result right...

[Jakubclaret]

Maybe not everyone gets the same pension, maybe they are paying carers or care home fees for a loved one. Just a few guesses why not everyone can.

Food for thought when you get older you struggle to spend money because you don't want for anything everything you already have or don't need, for most people the health is the wealth & everything else is secondary most are only too happen to treat the grandkids & do stuff with them safe in the knowledge happy memories are left behind, this price cap crisis will be a walk in the park to lots of battle hardened pensioners with years of experience in far tougher corners.

[Steve-Harpers-perm]

Food for thought when you get older you struggle to spend money because you don't want for anything everything you already have or don't need, for most people the health is the wealth & everything else is secondary most are only too happen to treat the grandkids & do stuff with them safe in the knowledge happy memories are left behind, this price cap crisis will be a walk in the park to lots of battle hardened pensioners with years of experience in far tougher corners.

‘Battle hardened pensioners’!!!!