Russia Invades

[LeadBelly]

I wonder if it was just luck that there was a fuel train "parked" on the rail track when the road bridge was blown? Certainly messed up half of the road and the whole of the rail track anyway.

Quite a lot of sources deducing it was a truck that blew but also seems quite possible the road bridge was detonated from below by Special Forces (presumably any incoming missile wouldve been witnessed (from a distance) at night time?)

Kiev Independent reports that "Vladimir Konstantinov, the head of Crimea's Russian-installed illegal "parliament", claimed that the damage was "insignificant", and the bridge would be repaired soon."

[Boss Hogg]

The ‘insignificant’ and’repaired soon’ comments just don’t tie up with the pictures and look a bit stupid. Even the most brain washed would have to question this.

[NewClaret]

To be fair, looks like there’s a route through that bridge still. If the objective was to take it out fully, the Ukrainians might be a bit disappointed they didn’t quite take it all out.

[Elbarad]

Woke up to the nice news about the bridge. After this is over the stories that will be told will be fascinating. Probably only temporary as they can’t reach it regularly but a severe moral hit to those in Crimea for sure.

[LeadBelly]

From what weve seen of the bridge incident so far, I like this explanation (courtesy of Chuck Pfarrer's twitter) https://twitter.com/ChuckPfarrer/status ... 44/photo/1

[Vegas Claret]

The actual explosion, holy cow.

https://twitter.com/nolanwpeterson/stat ... Ve7GxETtYA

wow

[jtv]

No updates today? This is one of the threads that I really enjoy reading!

[Nori1958]

No updates today? This is one of the threads that I really enjoy reading!

Enjoy?

[bfcjg]

https://reut.rs/3MhhTqF?slideId=1610901779
Good selection of pictures re Russian tanks.

[Loyalclaret]

https://reut.rs/3MhhTqF?slideId=1610901779
Good selection of pictures re Russian tanks.

Picture no. 25

[Lancasterclaret]

Missile attacks on central Kyi'v

All Russia can do is lob missiles onto undefended cities and there isn't any justification for it

https://twitter.com/MattiMaasikas/statu ... 4120577025

Completely counter productive, will just p**s off the Ukrainians even more and speed up the delivery of anti-missile systems

[Lancasterclaret]

Not just Kyi'v either

Dnipro, Zaporizhzhia all reporting missile strikes

Lovely people the Russians

[bfcjg]

Evil depraved cowardly leader and military. Ukraine take out legitimate infrastructure target,Russia bomb children's hospitals,parks and blocks of flats. Ukraine have to win, evil should never triumph .

[Colburn_Claret]

We need to deliver everything Ukraine needs and without delay.
The psyche of the Russians is inhuman, You can hear the rhetoric on their nightly shows, they are depraved, and quite open about it. They have no concept of humanity, just an overriding desire to be seen as something they are not.

Diplomacy doesn't work with people like that.

[bfcjg]

Earlier in this thread I posted what the mostvevil man to walk the planet thought of Russians, yet again the leaders like Putin are living up to the description as they say it takes one to know one.
"Adolf Hitler on Russia and Bolshevism, an extract from his autobiography Mein Kampf, published in 1924:

“Never forget that the rulers of present-day Russia are common blood-stained criminals; that they are the **** of humanity which, favoured by circumstances, overran a great state in a tragic hour, slaughtered out thousands of her leading intelligentsia in wild bloodlust, and now for almost ten years have been carrying on the most cruel and tyrannical regime of all time.

Furthermore, do not forget that these rulers belong to a race which combines, in a rare mixture, bestial cruelty and an inconceivable gift for lying, and which today more than ever is conscious of a mission to impose its bloody oppression on the whole world. "
The decent Russian people and if there are any decent military generals who are shamed by being associated with Putin must take him out.

[Hipper]

Missile attacks on central Kyi'v

All Russia can do is lob missiles onto undefended cities and there isn't any justification for it

https://twitter.com/MattiMaasikas/statu ... 4120577025

Completely counter productive, will just p**s off the Ukrainians even more and speed up the delivery of anti-missile systems

What this reaction might tell us is that they can't hit strategically useful sites for some reason - lack of intelligence (and that can be read in different ways!), or lack of ability - inaccurate weapons (the idea of bombing a country into submission has been tried and failed throughout the history of aerial attack, except of course with nuclear weapons).

If this is true that is a good thing. The Ukrainians in contrast have attacked worthwhile targets supporting their military objectives. The bridge attack was both militarily useful (albeit this aspect may have failed), and politically too.

[Lancasterclaret]

What this reaction might tell us is that they can't hit strategically useful sites for some reason - lack of intelligence (and that can be read in different ways!), or lack of ability - inaccurate weapons (the idea of bombing a country into submission has been tried and failed throughout the history of aerial attack, except of course with nuclear weapons).

If this is true that is a good thing. The Ukrainians in contrast have attacked worthwhile targets supporting their military objectives. The bridge attack was both militarily useful (albeit this aspect may have failed), and politically too.

Yup, the only conclusion you can draw is that Putin is demanding his military just lob missiles at anything in Ukraine, and aiming at a city gives a fairly good chance of hitting something

Its not a military decision, and I think is yet another sign that whoever is planning and orchestrated the Russian war effort has not yet realised that he can't win

[Vegas Claret]

Given Putin just claiming land with sham referendums maybe it's time for NATO to grow some balls and do the same and expedite Ukraine's membership

[Lancasterclaret]

Given Putin just claiming land with sham referendums maybe it's time for NATO to grow some balls and do the same and expedite Ukraine's membership

There is a balance to have between guaranteeing nuclear war and making sure Ukraine doesn't lose

I don't think anything like that will help Ukraine or stop Russia

As NATO has been doing, keeping up with military hardware to Ukraine so that Russia essentially destroys its own military trying to defeat Ukraine is the only way forward

If you are questioning the effect of NATO backing, the Russian military position from March to now is a very clear reminder of how effective it is

Ukraine do need more anti-missile systems though, especially as Russia clearly don't care what or where they hit

[Vegas Claret]

There is a balance to have between guaranteeing nuclear war and making sure Ukraine doesn't lose

I don't think anything like that will help Ukraine or stop Russia

As NATO has been doing, keeping up with military hardware to Ukraine so that Russia essentially destroys its own military trying to defeat Ukraine is the only way forward

If you are questioning the effect of NATO backing, the Russian military position from March to now is a very clear reminder of how effective it is

Ukraine do need more anti-missile systems though, especially as Russia clearly don't care what or where they hit

I'm saying NATO could do a lot more

[Lancasterclaret]

I'm saying NATO could do a lot more

I think that would be a mistake

Russia is essentially completely defenceless v NATO

We have limited international support, which is based on aiding a country that is under attack by another one

I think NATO are playing this just right, and the next stage will be more defensive SAM missiles systems and radars

[Dark Cloud]

It seems to encapsulate what's been happening all the way through tbh. Ukraine has a different mind set and access to far greater intelligence and state of the art weaponry. They use that to ensure (as best they can) that all targets are of military significance. Russia has the mindset straight out of the 1940s when it was believed that if you bombed the civilian population long enough and hard enough the will of the nation to resist would eventually crumble and the hopelessly outdated weapons the Russians have at their disposal, including extremely poor intelligence gathering, mean it would be difficult for them to play it any other way. Ukraine hurt the Russians with precision strikes which lead to propaganda coups and military gains and Russia simply lashes out like an ageing heavyweight boxer being out boxed by a younger, leaner, fitter opponent. Those haymakers can look good up in the gallery and are still dangerous, but they are a sign of desperation and that your tactics are one dimensional and obsolete.

[SammyBoy]

What’s everyone’s opinion on this new general Putin has put in charge and the rumours of troop activity in Belorus?

[Colburn_Claret]

The guy in Belarus is only in place because of Putin, he owes him.
That said he isn't popular and mobilising the army would be even less popular than in Moscow.
In a perfect world the army look left, look right, and say sod you, if we have to fight let's fight Russia. They couldn't have a better time to break free.

[jos]

ROB LEE :-
Ukrainian officials say that 43 of the 84 missiles and 13 of the 24 UAVs launched by Russia were shot down (including 9 of 12 Geran-2). This includes Kh-101 and Kh-555 cruise missiles launched by 11 Tu-95 and Tu-160 bombers, Kalibr, Iskander-M, S-300, and Tornado-S.

https://twitter.com/ralee85/status/1579 ... scRRi9TVgw

A Ukrainian soldier reportedly shot down one of the cruise missiles launched today with an Igla MANPADS.

https://twitter.com/ralee85/status/1579 ... scRRi9TVgw

[Lancasterclaret]

What’s everyone’s opinion on this new general Putin has put in charge and the rumours of troop activity in Belorus?

The new general is the one who basically razed Aleppo to the ground, so maybe Putin thinks destroying more civilian buildings is the way to win

(Course, Syria is still in the midst of war, after eight? nine? years so I suspect he's there more for reliability than talent)

The Belarus one is a strange one, they basically need all their units for internal security, and I wouldn't be too sure they will even obey orders to invade

And the Russian units that they are being linked to, all got absolutely battered outside Kyiv in the spring

It does suggest that its symbolic more than anything else, but Lukashenko must know that if Putin fails, he's toast

[bfcjg]

He is evil, like Putin, I think special services will have satellite intelligence on him at all times and it's only a matter of time before he is killed.....fingers crossed.

[Hipper]

The Belarus one is a strange one, they basically need all their units for internal security, and I wouldn't be too sure they will even obey orders to invade

And the Russian units that they are being linked to, all got absolutely battered outside Kyiv in the spring

It does suggest that its symbolic more than anything else, but Lukashenko must know that if Putin fails, he's toast

Russian and Belarusian forces remain unlikely to attack Ukraine from the north despite Belarusian President Alexander Lukashenko's October 10 announcement that Belarus and Russia agreed to deploy the Union State’s Regional Grouping of Forces (RGV) —a strategic formation of Russian and Belarusian units tasked with defending the Union State.


https://www.understandingwar.org/backgr ... october-10

Sixth paragraph down.

[Dark Cloud]

I suspect two things here. 1. The even more indiscriminate response of the past couple of days to the hit on the Kerch bridge is likely attributable to the new hardliner who's just been put in charge and his desire to make his mark. 2. The up tick in activity in Belarus is likely designed by the Russians to be a distraction for the Ukrainian forces causing them to keep men and a wary eye on that area of the border so they can't concentrate totally on the "front".

[bfcjg]

https://uk.yahoo.com/news/sergei-surovi ... 34866.html
I think this guy has to be taken out, he is just a gangster,I'm sure any psychopath could order missile launches into cities,no tactics no brains they are desperate.

[Lancasterclaret]

Worth mentioning

Russia fired over 100 missiles and drones, of which just over half got through

They would have cost millions of dollars

They killed 18 people and convinced anyone who was left that they are nothing more than a terrorist state, and affected the Ukrainian war effort by about 0%

No military value, limited domestic propaganda value (pic of dead kids in a clearly civilian building don't play well with anyone, especially compared to a burning bridge that costs billions to build) and will have far reaching implications to Russia's standing in the world

Another massive own goal, in a war that is full of Russian own goals

[NewClaret]

ITV news said last night that the missiles used were expensive and potentially cost half a billion £. I know the value of the £ is under pressure but that seems a lot!

As you say though Lancaster, a lot of wasted cash either way, on an attack with limited value which will almost certainly see Ukraine get defence systems that prevent similar in future. Whilst obviously further uniting their people.

Haven’t really been able to follow the war closely since Lyman was taken. How are they doing on the ground? Are they advancing or taking any more territory? Or consolidating for now?

[Lancasterclaret]

Still pushing in the east I think, with the aim of Svatove

Not sure in the south

Essentially all offensives run out of steam at some stage, though suspect this is more due to exhaustion rather than Russian military effectiveness

Plus all the extra men that Russia can put in the line will help them defend

They will be a bloody liability in a fluid situation mind, so no Russian offensives for a while, and another collapse like Lyman could be really bad for them

[AlargeClaret]

Smacks a bit of the V1’s and 2 ‘s late in WWII . Oh they were superb tech having that range but that was ultimately nothing more than Hitler acting like an outclassed ,outpointed battered boxer throwing a few wild swings in round 12. I wouldn’t quite say Russia were in “ round 12” but at this minute they’re stinking of desperation.

[Lowbankclaret]

I read yesterday that the missiles were $13 million dollars each.

I also saw that the tank factory is just about making 10 T90 tanks a month.

On New Clarets question.
They Russia have gained ground around Bakhmut, but it’s very slow and they are losing a lot of equipment.

In the North, Ukraine is still taking ground and as Lancs said , they are heading for Svatove. A major link for road and rail. I think.

In the South, Ukraine is still taking ground, but it appears to have slowed down , which seems normal to me as the alleged 25 thousand troops get condensed into less and less ground on that side of the river.

[Lowbankclaret]

Whatever the Ukrainians are using it’s pretty devastating on the Russians equipment.

https://twitter.com/ralee85/status/1579 ... JKdg-dag6A

[Lancasterclaret]

https://twitter.com/berlin_bridge/statu ... 6828130306

Good old German supreme court

Overturns an earlier ruling so that now a destroyed Russian tank can be displayed outside the Russian embassy in Berlin

[elwaclaret]

Kyiv Independent: Energoatom: Russia kidnaps Zaporizhzhia nuclear plant's deputy head.

Russian troops have kidnapped Valerii Martyniuk, deputy head of the Zaporizhzhia Nuclear Power Plant, holding him in an unknown place and allegedly torturing him, according to state company Energoatom.

Russian forces are trying to get information about the plant staff from Martyniuk "to force (the plant's) personnel to work for (Russia's nuclear corporation) Rosatom as soon as possible," Energoatom stated.


https://twitter.com/kyivindependent/sta ... PL6mYcvSXA

[Vegas Claret]

Whatever the Ukrainians are using it’s pretty devastating on the Russians equipment.

https://twitter.com/ralee85/status/1579 ... JKdg-dag6A

the accuracy is impressive

[Lancasterclaret]

the accuracy is impressive

HMARS

[Hipper]

Smacks a bit of the V1’s and 2 ‘s late in WWII . Oh they were superb tech having that range but that was ultimately nothing more than Hitler acting like an outclassed ,outpointed battered boxer throwing a few wild swings in round 12. I wouldn’t quite say Russia were in “ round 12” but at this minute they’re stinking of desperation.

Not for nothing were they called Vergeltungswaffen - revenge weapons.

In those days of no social media, instant TV, the British were able to fool the Germans of the whereabouts of the V 1 and V2 strikes by leaking false information to the Germans via double agents.

[Hipper]

I don't remember seeing this:

https://www.coffeeordie.com/ukraine-kam ... rone-boats

[GodIsADeeJay81]

I don't remember seeing this:

https://www.coffeeordie.com/ukraine-kam ... rone-boats

I've never thought about using RC boats as weapons like that tbh.
It might even be for just recon purposes

Great idea though

[Lowbankclaret]

I have a bait boat for my carp fishing.

I can set gps coordinates and it will just drive itself to those coordinates, you could easily put that tech in a bigger boat.

[Taffy on the wing]

Whatever the Ukrainians are using it’s pretty devastating on the Russians equipment.

https://twitter.com/ralee85/status/1579 ... JKdg-dag6A

That reminds me of Monty Python's "the art of not being seen".......WOW.

[Lowbankclaret]

I mentioned night vision equipment the other day and the advantages.The video shows soldiers walking across a field to engage Russian troops who are in a tree line. They use a drone to guide them in and engage the Russians. All the Ukrainians walk away after.
I watched a video of a new conscript who was captured, he said he was the only one left of 26 new conscripts. A team of Ukrainians with NVG attacked them, they had just AK47s and a small amount of ammo. In just two minutes he said 25 of his fellow conscripts were killed and him captured. He said it was 12 days from call up to capture.
Russia is not learning and its poor conscripts are just going to be eliminated in the cold dark winter in Ukraine.


https://twitter.com/blue_sauron/status/ ... JKdg-dag6A

[Lowbankclaret]

Video of a gps guided munition being programmed and fired.

https://twitter.com/tendar/status/15798 ... 0XPnqSQ9MQ

[Longsider]

I mentioned night vision equipment the other day and the advantages.The video shows soldiers walking across a field to engage Russian troops who are in a tree line. They use a drone to guide them in and engage the Russians. All the Ukrainians walk away after.
I watched a video of a new conscript who was captured, he said he was the only one left of 26 new conscripts. A team of Ukrainians with NVG attacked them, they had just AK47s and a small amount of ammo. In just two minutes he said 25 of his fellow conscripts were killed and him captured. He said it was 12 days from call up to capture.
Russia is not learning and its poor conscripts are just going to be eliminated in the cold dark winter in Ukraine.


https://twitter.com/blue_sauron/status/ ... JKdg-dag6A

That's really tragic. Young Russians being used as cannon fodder. The sooner Putin is removed, the better.

[Lowbankclaret]

This is really why Russia cannot be allowed to win. You can change the word Ukrainians for ny other none Russian country if they took Ukraine. Be it , English Welsh Scot’s, fins, Swedish, Poles, Germans etc.

https://twitter.com/juliadavisnews/stat ... 0XPnqSQ9MQ

[bfcjg]

This is really why Russia cannot be allowed to win. You can change the word Ukrainians for ny other none Russian country if they took Ukraine. Be it , English Welsh Scot’s, fins, Swedish, Poles, Germans etc.

https://twitter.com/juliadavisnews/stat ... 0XPnqSQ9MQ

I'd actually copied that link ready to post but you obviously beat me to it. Kill Putin and someone as mad as him will takeover, the only solution is to get a moderate popular leader via an uprising which I'm sure the Western nations are working on .