The Turf

[Spijed]

I would like to see capacity increased, but 28,000 is probably the max.
Considering where most money comes from, I would make some use of the extra seats by encouraging kids into the ground. U10s free with a paying adult. Cheaper rates for lone U16s. Blocks of seats given to local schools pro rata.
We've made great strides, as every club has since the 70's, but giving kids the bug early, is the key to continuing on that upward curve.

Like Rovers, 28,000 will make the ground look very empty when we are stuck in the Championship in the next decade or so.

[JTClaret]

I don't think we will ever get more than a 20-25k average.
I'd say if we can improve the ground, any changes in capacity would be created out of design rather than necessity.

[Matt_Whalley]

It's encouraging to see quick wins over the past few years like the two new accessible stands, LED screens, Fan Zone, hospitality renovation, general maintenance / tidying up of the ground etc.

Are the BL and CFS going to be standing in their current form in 50 years time? Clearly not. We can argue about when, but they obviously need replacing. The owners need to have a vision and plan for this. What they have done so far suggests that this will be on their radar, at the very least.

My belief is that we'd sell more tickets if every seat was a good seat (like at Man City, for example).

[NewClaret]

Like Rovers, 28,000 will make the ground look very empty when we are stuck in the Championship in the next decade or so.

You’re very down on our prospects Spijed?!?

I agree that 28k is too high, but I do think there’s a solution to it looking empty, which in my opinion should be closure of certain upper tiers for low attended games/reconfig of the stadium to keep people packed in and the atmosphere decent.

Clubs don’t seem to do that much, for some reason.

[colner]

The Bob Lord has the most expensive seats but probably the worst views if you are sat behind a pillar. Personally,i would like it to be extended to at least Brunshaw Rd and given a new roof with no obstructions to the view of the pitch

[houseboy]

I definitely agree you have a more static core base of fans, then a flexible (possibly larger) group of more casual fans. As you say, nobodies fault, but the strategy for the club must be around encouraging those to attend more regularly.

Another point nobody has really mentioned is that there is general trend toward population growth. It may me small and over a long period but just generally you’d expect our catchment to be bigger in 10 years than today. In that sense I can see it being feasible to increase TM but only in small amounts and over time.

I would redevelop the CFS, potentially adding another 1000 seats if possible (all rail seating), half and half to Home/Away, then possibly joining the Longside and JM assuming it’s possible to create improved accessible facilities elsewhere, before considering and additions to the BL. That’s where a big leap of faith would be required.

What TM need is a vision though. Doesn't have to be done all in one go and could be a mix of really tactical stuff and then bigger redevelopment further down the line.

I do think that some how ‘filling in the corners’ as at the JM end would add what little extra we might need but most of all it would add to the atmosphere with the noise bouncing around a bit more. But wholesale changes would take years to recoup the cost for little benefit I think.

[bfcwest]

We definitely need an increase in capacity, and a better ratio of good seats to crap seats.

We would sell more tickets if the Bob Lord was double the size. At the moment we might not sell out every week, but we definitely sell out of any pairs of decent seats. We need more seats in prime positions. If our capacity was higher we could appeal to walk on fans and make coming to Turf Moor more appealing. Fans don't want to drive 50 miles to get ****** on and have no decent view.

I'd take out the front 5 rows from Bee Hole and Longside, and move the pitch across towards them. Then build a new single tier stand that wraps all the way round and replaces the Bob Lord AND eventually the Cricket Field. Away fans tucked away in the corner in a section that could be increased for bigger away followings. The new single tier could be closer to the new pitch which would allow for space behind the Cricket Field so fans can walk all the way round Turf Moor. The atmosphere would be greatly improved as more fans would be closer to the action, and the ground would be better balanced with decent sized stands all the way round rather than having the Bob Lord bus shelter on one side. It could be built gradually so we don't lose too many seats for that long, so when the Bob Lord section is finished the Cricket Field could be pulled down. Take the capacity to about 26000, maybe 28000 and we aim for the sky. There are a few million people living within 50 miles of Turf Moor and population is growing all the time.

[fatboy47]

I would like to see capacity increased, but 28,000 is probably the max.
Considering where most money comes from, I would make some use of the extra seats by encouraging kids into the ground. U10s free with a paying adult. Cheaper rates for lone U16s. Blocks of seats given to local schools pro rata.
We've made great strides, as every club has since the 70's, but giving kids the bug early, is the key to continuing on that upward curve.

Not too sure about kinda stuff.

Rovers weaned a generation of "fans" on Prem football for next to nowt.
What was left of their support were squealing like stuck pigs when prices had to be raised to something more sustainable.
Easy to give the product away, but costly and with no guarantee of success.

[NewClaret]

Does anyone know if we replace the CF with rail seats whether it rises the capacity, or reduce it?

I’m not certain but I think generally they take up the same space as standard seats.

[NewClaret]

Not too sure about kinda stuff.

Rovers weaned a generation of "fans" on Prem football for next to nowt.
What was left of their support were squealing like stuck pigs when prices had to be raised to something more sustainable.
Easy to give the product away, but costly and with no guarantee of success.

Understand your sentiment and agree it’s a careful balance.

Things I’d do is make every child’s first ST as free, then keep them low (as we do already), and give spare seats to deprived kids in the community that couldn’t otherwise afford to go - via BFCitC.

For me, every empty seat is a lost opportunity to invest in our fans of the future.

[Spijed]

You’re very down on our prospects Spijed?!?

I agree that 28k is too high, but I do think there’s a solution to it looking empty, which in my opinion should be closure of certain upper tiers for low attended games/reconfig of the stadium to keep people packed in and the atmosphere decent.

Clubs don’t seem to do that much, for some reason.

It's the reality of what happens to ALL clubs bar those at the top. This season there will in all likelihood be another club relegated which has been in the Prem for quite a few years.

It happens to EVERY club eventually bar a select few and yet some really think that it's possible to become established without enormous wealth.

As has been said elsewhere, all it takes is one bad season and you are gone. And there have been quite a few, like Leeds and Forest where it took years to return with plenty of teams suffering double relegation.

We never will be big enough to swim against the tide without being relegated every few years and there will come a point where we'll go down but not return.

The problem for a number of similar clubs is they thought they could ride the storm and ended in series financial difficulties.

All we can ever hope for, for a club our size is to get promoted, hang in there for a few seasons, and then hope for a swift return. Without investment we can never achieve more.

That's why clubs like Bradford found themselves in a serious mess. They decided to build a bigger ground amongst other things and it all came crashing down.

I'd rather be a yo-yo club realising what the limits of our ambition is rather than thinking we should take a few risks without any safety net should it all go wrong.

[ArmchairDetective]

Think it's a case of improving quality not quantity. Never going to be 30k regularly attending the turf. Maybe on the odd games. Increased variation in the hospitality options available and replacing the CFS is realistically what we will see and IMO the appropriate approach. Could also do with improving protection from the elements in the lower tiers to encourage more walk ons for the dark and windy midweek games.

Replace the CFS with a new 6k~ capacity stand would bring the capacity to around 23-24k. Slightly more room for away fans whilst giving the home ends plenty of room.

Not sure we'll see much more than that anytime soon but would gladly be proven wrong.

[NewClaret]

It's the reality of what happens to ALL clubs bar those at the top. This season there will in all likelihood be another club relegated which has been in the Prem for quite a few years.

It happens to EVERY club eventually bar a select few and yet some really think that it's possible to become established without enormous wealth.

As has been said elsewhere, all it takes is one bad season and you are gone. And there have been quite a few, like Leeds and Forest where it took years to return with plenty of teams suffering double relegation.

We never will be big enough to swim against the tide without being relegated every few years and there will come a point where we'll go down but not return.

The problem for a number of similar clubs is they thought they could ride the storm and ended in series financial difficulties.

All we can ever hope for, for a club our size is to get promoted, hang in there for a few seasons, and then hope for a swift return. Without investment we can never achieve more.

That's why clubs like Bradford found themselves in a serious mess. They decided to build a bigger ground amongst other things and it all came crashing down.

I'd rather be a yo-yo club realising what the limits of our ambition is rather than thinking we should take a few risks without any safety net should it all go wrong.

I understand your point that you’re only ever one season away from relegation. I see the Prem in groups of 3 - no risk, medium risk and high risk - with the number of clubs in the “no risk” category growing in recent years. The medium risk ones would be unexpected but only one bad season away & the high risk the regular contenders for relegation. I agree we’ll always be in one of the latter two categories and therefore at a degree of risk.

I am a bit more hopeful that we could avoid crashing down the leagues though: Our recent Championship record (2 losses in 50) does suggest we’re establishing ourselves as being very competitive in this league and we’ll likely always have a bigger budget than our competitors. In the same way history tells you who’ll have a good chance of success in the Prem, the same is true of us in the Champ (if we end up there).

What we need to do is ensure we don’t take any major financial risks (as you say), we have reasonable cash reserved (we do, or did), flexible contracts that don’t kill us if demoted, young players out on loan building Champ experience (Thomas, McNally, etc) and a good Academy, good relationships with the super powers for loans, a good recruitment team to identify new talent, etc… all to support the inevitable player sales when demoted. I see good progress on all of those areas.

I think we’re agreeing we don’t need 30k but I’d say somewhere inbetween todays capacity and 30k would be potentially well utilised without needing huge financial bets that cost us if relegated.

[Chobulous]

Will we ever need a stadia with a greater capacity than what we currently have?

There will never be a time when we need more than one ground

[Vegas Claret]

With Pace and co seeing packed out stadiums in the USA and how successful some of the NFL/MSL teams are in terms of generated revenue (from things like food) I don't see any way that the CF remains in it's current state in the medium to long term, the only thing going for it are the acoustics. The club are missing out on good revenue in that stand in particular.