"Tragedy Chants" - clubs face sanctions.

[evensteadiereddie]

I'm not particularly impressed by the term but the sentiment is a good one.
After the Leeds / Man Utd horror show where the ugly Munich and Istanbul chants were in full flow, the FA and Premier League are considering taking action.

Could this, at last, mean the end of those embarrassing Jack Walker songs?

I, for one, think we're better than that.

[Rileybobs]

I thought this was going to be about chants to the Bee Gees track, which thinking about it is a great tune for a chant.

[Quickenthetempo]

People sing them sort of songs to be a rebel.

Any formal action would likely make it more attractive. Especially with more publicity.

[Burnley1989]

I thought this was going to be about chants to the Bee Gees track, which thinking about it is a great tune for a chant.

Could work with Kompany instead of tragedy

[houseboy]

I was thinking about the Munich one the other day whilst watching yet another anniversary item on the news about it. Why does this have to be dragged up every 5 years on North West news? It was showing kids there looking glum with United scarfs on whose parents wouldn’t even have been alive when it happened. I was only four and I’m getting on. There are far far worse tragedies in the world than this that never get a mention 20 years after let alone 65 years on.
Sorry if this seems disrespectful but I do get a little p!ssed off by the obsession with bloody United, especially in light of what’s just happened in Turkey/Syria. Munich happened, a handful of footballers died. It’s sad but it’s not the end of the world.

[Rileybobs]

Could work with Kompany instead of tragedy

Kompany
When the win is on and we've got Vincent
it's Kompany

[4midable]

I'm not particularly impressed by the term but the sentiment is a good one.
After the Leeds / Man Utd horror show where the ugly Munich and Istanbul chants were in full flow, the FA and Premier League are considering taking action.

Could this, at last, mean the end of those embarrassing Jack Walker songs?

I, for one, think we're better than that.

Wont stop fans

[martin_p]

Could this, at last, mean the end of those embarrassing Jack Walker songs?

I, for one, think we're better than that.

A lot of our supporters aren’t unfortunately. I don’t like them either and would never join in but I would question what harm they are doing other than to wind up opposition fans. Lots of football chants are ugly and wind people up, but that’s sort of the point.

[bobinho]

I was in the longside lower some years ago when we played Leeds and they had the full CFS.

As much as I hate Leeds Utd, their club and their fans, I was disgusted that some Burnley dick heads started chanting “Istanbul” towards them.

Celebrating people losing their lives at a football match is totally classless.

[tiger76]

Sadly the threat of sanctions won't stop the idiots spouting their daft chants, and all clubs have idiots including Burnley.

[bobinho]

I think you are right tiger.

Cocaine don’t think.

[bfcjg]

The mentality of people who sing such chants will not be deterred by sanctions.
Re the Waljer song it's about an individual who guided our hated local rivals to a position they would never have achieved, they don't sing he died in agony etc or gloating that he died as a young man in a crash etc etc it is a song about the end of an era re a guy who loved his club and the start of an era involving people who just use them as a tax avoidance scheme and treat them as basically an accounting tool.
Is Walker dead? Yes, are the Venkys really interested ? No. Get of your high horse (pun intended) and see it for what it is.

[daveisaclaret]

The thing is, you'll get Burnley fans (already have) justifying the songs about Walker. You'll get Leeds fans justifying the Munich songs because Man United fans sang about Istanbul, and vice versa. There were Man United fans singing about Hillsborough at Anfield after Liverpool fans' standing ovation to commiserate with the loss of C Ronaldo's child and there will have been plenty justifying that too.

Sanctions could be a starting point for stopping this, but only because they can be a starting point from which other fans are willing (or able) to shut down/shun the dickhead minority who think this stuff is acceptable. It's in that sense not different to racism from the terraces (which may still exist but is now primarily only extremely isolated incidents) - the only thing that can end it is a better culture.

[Rileybobs]

The mentality of people who sing such chants will not be deterred by sanctions.
Re the Waljer song it's about an individual who guided our hated local rivals to a position they would never have achieved, they don't sing he died in agony etc or gloating that he died as a young man in a crash etc etc it is a song about the end of an era re a guy who loved his club and the start of an era involving people who just use them as a tax avoidance scheme and treat them as basically an accounting tool.
Is Walker dead? Yes, are the Venkys really interested ? No. Get of your high horse (pun intended) and see it for what it is.

Both songs are celebrating the death of other people. How you can justify singing one whilst condemning signing another?

[Tricky Trevor]

The worst for me was fans hissing, sound of gas leak, at Spurs fans. Totally classless.
Not sure how this can be put on clubs but I hope they find a sensible solution.

[Colburn_Claret]

The mentality of people who sing such chants will not be deterred by sanctions.
Re the Waljer song it's about an individual who guided our hated local rivals to a position they would never have achieved, they don't sing he died in agony etc or gloating that he died as a young man in a crash etc etc it is a song about the end of an era re a guy who loved his club and the start of an era involving people who just use them as a tax avoidance scheme and treat them as basically an accounting tool.
Is Walker dead? Yes, are the Venkys really interested ? No. Get of your high horse (pun intended) and see it for what it is.

You really are a sad individual.

[wilks_bfc]

The mentality of people who sing such chants will not be deterred by sanctions.
Re the Waljer song it's about an individual who guided our hated local rivals to a position they would never have achieved, they don't sing he died in agony etc or gloating that he died as a young man in a crash etc etc it is a song about the end of an era re a guy who loved his club and the start of an era involving people who just use them as a tax avoidance scheme and treat them as basically an accounting tool.
Is Walker dead? Yes, are the Venkys really interested ? No. Get of your high horse (pun intended) and see it for what it is.

He also didn’t die of a heart attack, but that doesn’t stop the majority of fans seeing the song for what it is.
We’re going through the best spell in a long time and the songs have improved this season, but there are still a few that are dragging the atmosphere down and completely stop when with kids

[Bosscat]

The Welsh RFU have stopped the playing of Tom Jones "Delilah" over the sound system, but the Welsh Rugby fans are still singing it ...

I am not sure how possible it is to stop a Football crowd singing distasteful songs ...

I find the JW song particularly distasteful and never join in, but how do you stop it

Just have to hope that it disappears eventually.

[gandhisflipflop]

I was in the longside lower some years ago when we played Leeds and they had the full CFS.

As much as I hate Leeds Utd, their club and their fans, I was disgusted that some Burnley dick heads started chanting “Istanbul” towards them.

Celebrating people losing their lives at a football match is totally classless.

I was in the same section that day. I thought someone was wearing a galatasaraay shirt also?

[Lancasterclaret]

Some football fans are complete bellends

It really is that simple

Everyone has been to a Burnley away match and they have found themselves next to one (or more) and its painful

[Guitargeorge]

“Tragedy” is a good fast song for the Cricket Field faithful. They could romp through that in 9.1 ms

[PaintYorkClaretnBlue]

Some football fans are complete bellends

It really is that simple

Everyone has been to a Burnley away match and they have found themselves next to one (or more) and its painful

Some PEOPLE are complete bellends, unfortunately that’s the way the world is!

[Lancasterclaret]

Some PEOPLE are complete bellends, unfortunately that’s the way the world is!

Very true unfortunately

[Lowbankclaret]

If the sanctions are point deductions then other fans will attempt to stop their own fans singing it.

So for it to be effective.

Winning side losses it’s 3 points and another 3 points deduction.
Losing side loses 3 points
Assuming both s ides sign banned songs.

A draw they both lose 4 points.

Very soon it would self police itself.

[Burnley1989]

Both songs are celebrating the death of other people. How you can justify singing one whilst condemning signing another?

Its that weird defence that gets rolled out that worries me even more

[Claret Toni]

If the sanctions are point deductions then other fans will attempt to stop their own fans singing it.

So for it to be effective.

Winning side losses it’s 3 points and another 3 points deduction.
Losing side loses 3 points
Assuming both s ides sign banned songs.

A draw they both lose 4 points.

Very soon it would self police itself.

Points deduction might work; although it's possible opposition fans would infiltrate "home stands" and start banned chants.

I do agree that self policing is the way forward - we could start by booing the JW chant.

[bfcjg]

He also didn’t die of a heart attack, but that doesn’t stop the majority of fans seeing the song for what it is.
We’re going through the best spell in a long time and the songs have improved this season, but there are still a few that are dragging the atmosphere down and completely stop when with kids

Never mentioned the heart attack song.

[bfcjg]

You really are a sad individual.

For analysing a chant, lighten up.

[bfcjg]

Both songs are celebrating the death of other people. How you can justify singing one whilst condemning signing another?

I don't do sign language. I wouldn't sing the heart attack song but don't have an issue celebrating the end of one dynasty and the start of another.

[IanMcL]

Kompany
When the win is on and we've got Vincent
it's Kompany

I would change the 2nd Kompany to victory. Good effort though.

[gandhisflipflop]

Some football fans are complete bellends

It really is that simple

Everyone has been to a Burnley away match and they have found themselves next to one (or more) and its painful

I was once stood infront of someone at Stoke away in the first Dyche PL season who kept shouting ‘n***er’ at one of the Stoke players and laughing with his mates. Needless to say he got told. Can’t believe what goes through some fans minds tbh

[Rileybobs]

I don't do sign language. I wouldn't sing the heart attack song but don't have an issue celebrating the end of one dynasty and the start of another.

Yes, the lyrics are incredibly deep - using the act of somebody expiring whilst laid on the carpet as a metaphor to symbolise the end of a successful dynasty and start of a less successful one. It's an extremely clever, and touching piece.

[elwaclaret]

The worst for me was fans hissing, sound of gas leak, at Spurs fans. Totally classless.
Not sure how this can be put on clubs but I hope they find a sensible solution.

One way would be to issue public warnings and then a fine and mandatory education day (like they do with speeding). Those forced to attend may not learn anything, but they might and the fact that they are going to have to attend a five four session if spotted would probably be the best deterrent for those who think… I’ll just pay the fine if caught…

Jack walker… how two working class lads had the determination and drive to build Walker Steel from scratch… how Jack and George Walker (Burnley fan) would visit Turf and Ewood, supporting both clubs etc.

Munich, the full horror of a generation of British talent didn’t just crash but were aware that their was a discussion going on as to wether the plane could land and the tragic decisions that went with it… that led to a generation of young British talent erased from the future.

If the ignorant are proud of their ignorance… then punish them by forcing them to learn.

[bobinho]

Struggling to get my head around the punishing of the clubs for a “fans” behaviour.

Clubs have no real control over the chants that are sung by fans - recent welsh rugby game reinforces that point.

What it DOES do however, is generate some cash as inevitably, clubs will be fined…. Which leaves us with the tried and tested formula of?????

Follow the money….

[bfcjg]

Yes, the lyrics are incredibly deep - using the act of somebody expiring whilst laid on the carpet as a metaphor to symbolise the end of a successful dynasty and start of a less successful one. It's an extremely clever, and touching piece.

Glad you agree, however he didn't die on the carpet, don't believe everything you hear.

[elwaclaret]

Yes, the lyrics are incredibly deep - using the act of somebody expiring whilst laid on the carpet as a metaphor to symbolise the end of a successful dynasty and start of a less successful one. It's an extremely clever, and touching piece.

It’s a straight rip of the previous Bill Fox song. Bill was a lovely man (even to a young Burnley fan) who, if memory serves, had a heart attack in his office while at the club. Always felt saddened when I heard the original and even more so with it’s ‘rerelease’

[nil_desperandum]

Struggling to get my head around the punishing of the clubs for a “fans” behaviour.

Clubs have no real control over the chants that are sung by fans - recent welsh rugby game reinforces that point.

Clubs have always been held responsible for the behaviour of their fans, though obviously it's very difficult to enforce at an away game.
Ever since I can remember, there have been partial stadium closures, various restrictions on fans, CCTV footage to root our trouble makers, total stadium closures etc, to try to combat "inappropriate" behaviour from fans.
It has generally worked in England now so far as racist behaviour and hooliganism is concerned inside grounds, so "punishing" clubs and their fans for "inappropriate, sexist, racist or derogatory chanting" would be nothing new, (assuming that the general fanbase agree that certain chants are inappropriate and offensive.).

[NRC]

bear in mind the international audience that don't perhaps have the context of the "tragedy chants," but songs like "you're f*****g S**t come over loud and clear.

I sat at home with 10 guests watching the PNE game, and it was loud and clear. I shrugged my shoulders in an embarrassed way and said "that's not even our fans - it's theirs singing about their own team"

[claptrappers_union]

I don't know why the club should face sanctions. It's a slippery slope, though, as there's bad taste in some chants, I agree.

But Is calling Burnley fans Inbred offensive? I mean, I am sure people are living with some severe conditions from no fault of their own because of their family history... Should I be offended on their behalf? Should we ask for a response from the RSPCA, and encourage their help to stop mean football fans from calling Rovers fans horse fiddlers? Animal cruelty is no laughing matter.

Will someone think of the children?!

[Colburn_Claret]

I don't know why the club should face sanctions. It's a slippery slope, though, as there's bad taste in some chants, I agree.

But Is calling Burnley fans Inbred offensive? I mean, I am sure people are living with some severe conditions from no fault of their own because of their family history... Should I be offended on their behalf? Should we ask for a response from the RSPCA, and encourage their help to stop mean football fans from calling Rovers fans horse fiddlers? Animal cruelty is no laughing matter.

Will someone think of the children?!

There is a world of difference in making impersonal chants about a region, town or club, and making g very personal attacks on a well known local figure.
You should imagining people singing songs about your own father, or brother, and then decide whether it's OK.

[HiThere]

Don't punish the club, punish those fans.

[nil_desperandum]

Will someone think of the children?!

I think that when some of us cringe at these songs, we are mainly thinking about the children who are with us.
The bad language (both spoken and sung) is something which I think you just have to accept, and most children come across these words in the school playground or on the TV, (and in some cases form their parents), but I feel very uneasy when I have grandchildren with me and we get the Walker song, and a couple of others.
To hear grown up adults (some of them female) singing the t *** and f******s song is really quite embarrassing.
Not much of a problem at home games, but quite an education for kids if you take them to away games.

[Ptangyangkipperbang]

I think that when some of us cringe at these songs, we are mainly thinking about the children who are with us.
The bad language (both spoken and sung) is something which I think you just have to accept, and most children come across these words in the school playground or on the TV, (and in some cases form their parents), but I feel very uneasy when I have grandchildren with me and we get the Walker song, and a couple of others.
To hear grown up adults (some of them female) singing the t *** and f******s song is really quite embarrassing.
Not much of a problem at home games, but quite an education for kids if you take them to away games.

I cringe when I hear the chant your efinn S### or your support is etc.

[bfcmik]

I think that when some of us cringe at these songs, we are mainly thinking about the children who are with us.
The bad language (both spoken and sung) is something which I think you just have to accept, and most children come across these words in the school playground or on the TV, (and in some cases form their parents), but I feel very uneasy when I have grandchildren with me and we get the Walker song, and a couple of others.
To hear grown up adults (some of them female) singing the t *** and f******s song is really quite embarrassing.
Not much of a problem at home games, but quite an education for kids if you take them to away games.

The first thing I taught my kids, and, later on, the grandkids, is that what you hear at football is NOT what you can say anywhere else without punishment. Seems to have worked for the most part

[ClaretTony]

The mentality of people who sing such chants will not be deterred by sanctions.
Re the Waljer song it's about an individual who guided our hated local rivals to a position they would never have achieved, they don't sing he died in agony etc or gloating that he died as a young man in a crash etc etc it is a song about the end of an era re a guy who loved his club and the start of an era involving people who just use them as a tax avoidance scheme and treat them as basically an accounting tool.
Is Walker dead? Yes, are the Venkys really interested ? No. Get of your high horse (pun intended) and see it for what it is.

So you think a song that makes reference to someone dying of a heart attack is anything like acceptable? I think you need to have a long, hard look at yourself.

[bfcjg]

So you think a song that makes reference to someone dying of a heart attack is anything like acceptable? I think you need to have a long, hard look at yourself.

I think you need to check your facts he died of cancer hence the song about the heart attack is inaccurate and wrong anyway.
My goodness the virtue signaling smugness on here is tedious.

[Vegas Claret]

I hope so, the Jack Walker song is an embarrassment to the Club and the town, it's shameful.

[ClaretTony]

I think you need to check your facts he died of cancer hence the song about the heart attack is inaccurate and wrong anyway.
My goodness the virtue signaling smugness on here is tedious.

Don’t need to check anything. He did die of cancer, I got that wrong, but he also suffered a heart attack. The song is embarrassing.

[Colburn_Claret]

Don’t need to check anything. He did die of cancer, I got that wrong, but he also suffered a heart attack. The song is embarrassing.

Your wasting your time CT, he'll never get it. Obviously far too complicated for him to understand.

[Burnley1989]

I’d hardly call it virtue signalling