THB -

Bowclaret · Post by **Bowclaret** » Sat Oct 28, 2023 12:36 pm

Why the hell did we not sign this lad permanently ? 5 mins in for Southampton and won 3 headers already and looks pure class on the ball. Head and shoulders above O’Shea

Nori1958 · Post by **Nori1958** » Sat Oct 28, 2023 12:40 pm

Bowclaret wrote: ↑
Sat Oct 28, 2023 12:36 pm
Why the hell did we not sign this lad permanently ? 5 mins in for Southampton and won 3 headers already and looks pure class on the ball. Head and shoulders above O’Shea

Remind me which league that is

Bowclaret · Post by **Bowclaret** » Sat Oct 28, 2023 12:40 pm

And just scored !!!!

Pickles · Post by **Pickles** » Sat Oct 28, 2023 12:42 pm

Nori1958 wrote: ↑
Sat Oct 28, 2023 12:40 pm
Remind me which league that is

We signed O'Shea from it.

Bowclaret · Post by **Bowclaret** » Sat Oct 28, 2023 12:43 pm

We absolutely messed up not signing him !

daveisaclaret · Post by **daveisaclaret** » Sat Oct 28, 2023 12:46 pm

It's a real shame we didn't but surely it's because he was more expensive than anyone we actually did sign.

Bowclaret · Post by **Bowclaret** » Sat Oct 28, 2023 12:48 pm

Yeah but Southampton got him on loan - we should have done the same or got him permanently. Awesome last season, brilliant for England u’21,s and a born leader AND, loved it at Burnley

We messed up !

daveisaclaret · Post by **daveisaclaret** » Sat Oct 28, 2023 12:50 pm

Bowclaret wrote: ↑
Sat Oct 28, 2023 12:48 pm
Yeah but Southampton got him on loan - we should have done the same or got him permanently. Awesome last season, brilliant for England u’21,s and a born leader AND, loved it at Burnley

We messed up !

On loan with a reported £20 million obligation to buy him if they go up.

Bowclaret · Post by **Bowclaret** » Sat Oct 28, 2023 12:51 pm

Worth every penny and more

taio · Post by **taio** » Sat Oct 28, 2023 12:52 pm

Yes, should've signed him instead of O'Shea plus one other.

CoolClaret · Post by **CoolClaret** » Sat Oct 28, 2023 12:54 pm

MUD analytics said otherwise

RVclaret · Post by **RVclaret** » Sat Oct 28, 2023 12:57 pm

Good for a ball dominant team like us and Saints in the Champ. Not been tested yet in one that’s under more pressure (Stoke aside where he was average according to reviews) or at a higher level. Perhaps this explains why no Prem club went in for him?

Bordeauxclaret · Post by **Bordeauxclaret** » Sat Oct 28, 2023 1:00 pm

I think Boden mentioned on that podcast there was a worry about his pace.

I’d have liked to see him back here.

Cabbage · Post by **Cabbage** » Sat Oct 28, 2023 1:00 pm

I heard we went in for him but he wanted a bigger club.
Rolls Royce of a player.

Bowclaret · Post by **Bowclaret** » Sat Oct 28, 2023 1:02 pm

If there was any chance what so ever of getting him back in Jan I would go all out to do it

Ampth7 · Post by **Ampth7** » Sat Oct 28, 2023 1:03 pm

I would also have liked to see THB back with us this season, however, he wouldn’t necessarily improve our current inability to defend as a team.

Fingers crossed we are much better today because I reckon today is about as much of a must-win type of game that you can get! Interesting to see what team he picks….

Nori1958 · Post by **Nori1958** » Sat Oct 28, 2023 1:04 pm

Pickles wrote: ↑
Sat Oct 28, 2023 12:42 pm
We signed O'Shea from it.

And?

Pickles · Post by **Pickles** » Sat Oct 28, 2023 1:10 pm

Nori1958 wrote: ↑
Sat Oct 28, 2023 1:04 pm
And?

Because you've implied his performances are good but it's only in the Championship. Same applies to O'Shea.

Nori1958 · Post by **Nori1958** » Sat Oct 28, 2023 1:13 pm

Pickles wrote: ↑
Sat Oct 28, 2023 1:10 pm
Because you've implied his performances are good but it's only in the Championship. Same applies to O'Shea.

Who many blame for our poor defensive performances and not good enough at this level, but did well at championship level

Cirrus_Minor · Post by **Cirrus_Minor** » Sat Oct 28, 2023 1:14 pm

Brilliant on the ball and very much part of our success story last season. He did seem though seem to lack physically and some pace.

Bowclaret · Post by **Bowclaret** » Sat Oct 28, 2023 1:29 pm

I would certainly not say that he lacked physicality. We could for sure do with him in our team for todays game

Vino blanco · Post by **Vino blanco** » Sat Oct 28, 2023 1:29 pm

I would have liked to have signed him and Tella and possibly Maatsen permanently or on loan. They would be better for us in the PL than most of the other players we brought in pre-season.

burnmark · Post by **burnmark** » Sat Oct 28, 2023 1:58 pm

Not great for Birmingham’s goal.

boatshed bill · Post by **boatshed bill** » Sat Oct 28, 2023 1:59 pm

Perhaps we tried to sign him.

Newcastleclaret93 · Post by **Newcastleclaret93** » Sat Oct 28, 2023 1:59 pm

Bowclaret wrote: ↑
Sat Oct 28, 2023 1:29 pm
I would certainly not say that he lacked physicality. We could for sure do with him in our team for todays game

Certainly lacked it for that goal

beddie · Post by **beddie** » Sat Oct 28, 2023 2:30 pm

I too was surprised we didn’t sign him, he has good vision and can make a long pass. It would have been a big disappointment for him if after last season if he thought himself he’d be signed by us.

Claretforever · Post by **Claretforever** » Sat Oct 28, 2023 2:40 pm

Bordeauxclaret wrote: ↑
Sat Oct 28, 2023 1:00 pm
I think Boden mentioned on that podcast there was a worry about his pace.

I’d have liked to see him back here.

Worried about his pace? O’Shea doesn’t seem to have any at all.

Wokingclaret · Post by **Wokingclaret** » Sat Oct 28, 2023 3:31 pm

Claretforever wrote: ↑
Sat Oct 28, 2023 2:40 pm
Worried about his pace? O’Shea doesn’t seem to have any at all.

beddie · Post by **beddie** » Sat Oct 28, 2023 4:15 pm

Bordeauxclaret wrote: ↑
Sat Oct 28, 2023 1:00 pm
I think Boden mentioned on that podcast there was a worry about his pace.

I’d have liked to see him back here.

I’m surprised at that because his footballing ability far outweighs anything that O’Shea can offer. He’s a clever footballer and will get better. A real worry we didn’t sign him, Tella and Maatsen when we had the opportunity.

Bordeauxclaret · Post by **Bordeauxclaret** » Sat Oct 28, 2023 5:36 pm

Claretforever wrote: ↑
Sat Oct 28, 2023 2:40 pm
Worried about his pace? O’Shea doesn’t seem to have any at all.

Surprising comment in all honestly, but I’m guessing he heard it from someone at the club with the way he said it.

Hipper · Post by **Hipper** » Sun Oct 29, 2023 10:14 am

He was pretty poor after returning from injury last season, certainly not up to the first half. I would have thought if he was that good he would have got a deal at the top level. May still be better then what we've got but that may not be saying much and does not make him good enough.

ksrclaret · Post by **ksrclaret** » Sun Oct 29, 2023 10:25 am

I recall an interview Harwood-Bellis gave over the summer in which he said VK sat him down at the end of the season and told him Burnley wouldn't be able to sign him on account of what Man City were asking.

Having seen O'Shea in preseason, I thought we'd done alright getting a player in for less than half of what City were asking for Harwood-Bellis. He looked like he'd fit in well and was even spraying a few THB-like diagonals.

Unfortunately, it looks like the whole squad has lost all confidence in what they're supposed to be doing, and I don't think THB would have been immune to that either.

Rileybobs · Post by **Rileybobs** » Sun Oct 29, 2023 10:31 am

Very good ball player, mediocre defender. Can’t imagine he would make much difference to the plight we find ourselves in.

ClaretAL · Post by **ClaretAL** » Sun Oct 29, 2023 10:35 am

Rileybobs wrote: ↑
Sun Oct 29, 2023 10:31 am
Very good ball player, mediocre defender. Can’t imagine he would make much difference to the plight we find ourselves in.

Agreed on the technical aspects but I think this will come, however he does have 1 attribute that we need and that is organisation and leadership of those around him, and why he was the England U21 captain. To have that at the moment would be worth £20m

Rileybobs · Post by **Rileybobs** » Sun Oct 29, 2023 10:37 am

ClaretAL wrote: ↑
Sun Oct 29, 2023 10:35 am
Agreed on the technical aspects but I think this will come, however he does have 1 attribute that we need and that is organisation and leadership of those around him, and why he was the England U21 captain. To have that at the moment would be worth £20m

Good point about the leadership. There’s none of that on display. It’s a worn cliche but it’s hard to imagine Joey Barton would have tolerated how passive and effortless we were in the second half yesterday.

Swizzlestick · Post by **Swizzlestick** » Sun Oct 29, 2023 10:47 am

We should have gone for THB but it is what it is.

While Cork isn’t what you’d describe as a Barton type Rottweiler, he is the captain with plenty of experience so I think we need to see more of him now.

taio · Post by **taio** » Sun Oct 29, 2023 10:48 am

He'd be an improvement on O'Shea and Al-Dakhil and would start most games. Should've signed him.

Rileybobs · Post by **Rileybobs** » Sun Oct 29, 2023 10:55 am

taio wrote: ↑
Sun Oct 29, 2023 10:48 am
He'd be an improvement on O'Shea and Al-Dakhil and would start most games. Should've signed him.

He was behind Al-Dakhil in the pecking order by the end of last season wasn’t he? I don’t think he’d make our first eleven, but of course with the injuries we’ve had at the back he would be getting games.

taio · Post by **taio** » Sun Oct 29, 2023 11:01 am

Rileybobs wrote: ↑
Sun Oct 29, 2023 10:55 am
He was behind Al-Dakhil in the pecking order by the end of last season wasn’t he? I don’t think he’d make our first eleven, but of course with the injuries we’ve had at the back he would be getting games.

Don't really see the relevance of that. He got injured and prior to that was clearly part of our first choice pairing at centre half. Who would you have ahead of him?

Rileybobs · Post by **Rileybobs** » Sun Oct 29, 2023 11:05 am

taio wrote: ↑
Sun Oct 29, 2023 11:01 am
Don't really see the relevance of that. He got injured and prior to that was clearly part of our first choice pairing at centre half. Who would you have ahead of him?

The point is that when we signed Al-Dakhil in January he seemed to be favoured ahead of THB, and certainly Beyer is the first pick in our back line. It’s debatable that he would also be behind Ekdal, so it’s hard to make a case that he’d be in our first choice eleven.

Newcastleclaret93 · Post by **Newcastleclaret93** » Sun Oct 29, 2023 11:09 am

Rileybobs wrote: ↑
Sun Oct 29, 2023 11:05 am
The point is that when we signed Al-Dakhil in January he seemed to be favoured ahead of THB, and certainly Beyer is the first pick in our back line. It’s debatable that he would also be behind Ekdal, so it’s hard to make a case that he’d be in our first choice eleven.

To be fair Riley, we already practically won the league when Dakhil started playing.

Pretty certain he only started featuring to get him some game time.

In my opinion THB would likely start every game for us and would probably be our captain

taio · Post by **taio** » Sun Oct 29, 2023 11:10 am

Rileybobs wrote: ↑
Sun Oct 29, 2023 11:05 am
The point is that when we signed Al-Dakhil in January he seemed to be favoured ahead of THB, and certainly Beyer is the first pick in our back line. It’s debatable that he would also be behind Ekdal, so it’s hard to make a case that he’d be in our first choice eleven.

Beyer is obviously our first choice. Goes without saying really. I meant who else you'd have ahead of him ie who'd you start ahead of him alongside a fit Beyer. It's not hard at all to make a case that he'd be starting with a fully fit squad, especially as we've only seen Ekdal a handful of times and Al-Dakhil has looked vulnerable.

AGENT_CLARET · Post by **AGENT_CLARET** » Sun Oct 29, 2023 11:16 am

Cabbage wrote: ↑
Sat Oct 28, 2023 1:00 pm
I heard we went in for him but he wanted a bigger club.
Rolls Royce of a player.

Southampton a bigger club ??

Rileybobs · Post by **Rileybobs** » Sun Oct 29, 2023 11:19 am

taio wrote: ↑
Sun Oct 29, 2023 11:10 am
Beyer is obviously our first choice. Goes without saying really. I meant who else you'd have ahead of him ie who'd you start ahead of him alongside a fit Beyer. It's not hard at all to make a case that he'd be starting with a fully fit squad, especially as we've only seen Ekdal a handful of times and Al-Dakhil has looked vulnerable.

My point was that VK preferred Al-Dakhil to THB last season so that would probably be the case this season. I would have started the season with Al-Dakhil and perhaps Ekdal ahead of THB. Obviously 10 games into the season and with performances and injuries to consider that may have changed. I think it’s highly likely that THB would also have struggled in this side.

taio · Post by **taio** » Sun Oct 29, 2023 11:31 am

Rileybobs wrote: ↑
Sun Oct 29, 2023 11:19 am
My point was that VK preferred Al-Dakhil to THB last season so that would probably be the case this season. I would have started the season with Al-Dakhil and perhaps Ekdal ahead of THB. Obviously 10 games into the season and with performances and injuries to consider that may have changed. I think it’s highly likely that THB would also have struggled in this side.

The only reason he didn't start was because of injury or return from injury. It's not hard to make a case for him starting this season. In fact, it's quite easy. We'd clearly have still struggled but that doesn't mean he wouldn't have enabled some marginal gains.

daveisaclaret · Post by **daveisaclaret** » Sun Oct 29, 2023 11:38 am

Al-Dakhil playing ahead of THB was the same as Tella being on the bench when he came back from injury and Foster, Twine and occasionally Obafemi starting games. Clearly looking to the future because we'd won the league over picking the best XI.

Superjohnnyfrancis · Post by **Superjohnnyfrancis** » Sun Oct 29, 2023 11:40 am

Maybe we should try and buy him in January if we can break his loan at Southampton

Rileybobs · Post by **Rileybobs** » Sun Oct 29, 2023 11:41 am

I got the feeling VK preferred Al-Dakhil, he’s quicker which allows us to defend higher and he’s a more combative defender in my opinion. I may be wrong though, who knows.

CoolClaret · Post by **CoolClaret** » Sun Oct 29, 2023 11:41 am

Al Dakhil needs to be taken out of the lineup. That’s obvious.

O’Shea is limited but at least he will get stuck in a bit. Ameen is tragic right now.

I’d absolutely prefer Delcroix LCB, O’Shea RCB if Beyer and Ekdal are unfit.

taio · Post by **taio** » Sun Oct 29, 2023 11:46 am

Rileybobs wrote: ↑
Sun Oct 29, 2023 11:41 am
I got the feeling VK preferred Al-Dakhil, he’s quicker which allows us to defend higher and he’s a more combative defender in my opinion. I may be wrong though, who knows.

Al-Dakhil was rightly selected because THB was injured and then coming back from injury. And with the league won and it looking unlikely THB would be here this season it was correct to play Al-Dakhil - that was also a key factor. If THB was staying there would have been a strong case for him coming straight back in once fully fit. And given our performances this season the case the case would be even stronger - not sure how it could be seen as hard to make a case for him starting this season.