Alan Pace

[Superjohnnyfrancis]

So even if you use the full squad, it's not the majority?

Sorry ive just looked its 17 players he got rid of guess those interest payments were really kicking in.

[Row x]

Sorry ive just looked its 17 players he got rid of guess those interest payments were really kicking in.

Hang on, which argument are you using
First you said the majority of the team from the first two games had been sold... Wrong
You then changed it to 7 who played, or came on in those two games, again not the majority

So what part, in the first two games, did those 17 you now refer to, take.

[Dark Cloud]

Players wanted away. It's pointless keeping them in those circumstances. It's then up to Pace and others to maximise what we get out of it financially. I'm not sure he can do a lot else tbf.

[Jakubclaret]

I left many a happy environment for better prospects and salary...

We all have but usually a sh1tstorm doesn't follow I forgot to mention tresor before on my list of oddities.

[Darnhill Claret]

How else do you get from a squad of 40 or 40+, down to 25, as well as allowing our Head Coach to get some of his own players in?

[Aclaret]

Damned if he does, damned if he doesn't.

[Jakubclaret]

How else do you get from a squad of 40 or 40+, down to 25, as well as allowing our Head Coach to get some of his own players in?

Well if you don't put yourself in that position to start with some might say you don't end up with that reduction problem.

[Row x]

Well if you don't put yourself in that position to start with some might say you don't end up with that reduction problem.

He put himself in that position, because he, and most fans at the time trusted the manager 100%
A chairman backing his manager, turns out it might not have been wise to trust him so much, but most of us did following promotion

[Jakubclaret]

He put himself in that position, because he, and most fans at the time trusted the manager 100%
A chairman backing his manager, turns out it might not have been wise to trust him so much, but most of us did following promotion

At some point maybe some sort of an acceptance must be recognised that some outspoken people on here (& elsewhere) albeit a minority accurately predicted what was going to happen with kompany. No willy waving involved or I told you so but when certain people say somethings going to happen time after time & it does happen maybe it's time to listen.

[Newcastleclaret93]

At some point maybe some sort of an acceptance must be recognised that some outspoken people on here (& elsewhere) albeit a minority accurately predicted what was going to happen with kompany. No willy waving involved or I told you so but when certain people say somethings going to happen time after time & it does happen maybe it's time to listen.

Yep quite a few people got dogs abuse for pretty much nailing the prediction last year

[Jakubclaret]

Yep quite a few people got dogs abuse for pretty much nailing the prediction last year

It was so obvious to a blind man double blindfolded entrenched in a deep dark cave.

[Vegas Claret]

It was so obvious to a blind man double blindfolded entrenched in a deep dark cave.

it was obvious he would get the Bayern job ?

[Jakubclaret]

it was obvious he would get the Bayern job ?

It was a surprise on the back of the season we had endured but with the man city connections & his name & reputation within the game it became clearer. My observations are focused on Burnley alone because that's all I really take a interest in. I maintain a godlike obsession firmly gripped large swathes of our support & minority voices got shouted down.

[Row x]

At some point maybe some sort of an acceptance must be recognised that some outspoken people on here (& elsewhere) albeit a minority accurately predicted what was going to happen with kompany. No willy waving involved or I told you so but when certain people say somethings going to happen time after time & it does happen maybe it's time to listen.

And when did this non willy waving happen?

Was it straight after promotion ( or before)?

Or was it after the manager had been backed by the board, and it was the players bought that concerned this informed minority?

[Jakubclaret]

And when did this non willy waving happen?

Was it straight after promotion ( or before)?

Or was it after the manager had been backed by the board, and it was the players bought that concerned this informed minority?

Throughout the season as it became increasingly apparent that we couldn't string any consistent performances or results together & the players he brought in by & large weren't fit for the purpose of the PL. The decibels of discontent were ratched up but people were in such awe of him it became a pointless exercise even saying anything. I can remember a spell after the man city opener people saying wait until we play the teams we expected to get something from & I don't think we got anything from them. That became the theme of the season excuse after excuse & justification for his bad buys.

[Row x]

Throughout the season as it became increasingly apparent that we couldn't string any consistent performances or results together & the players he brought in by & large weren't fit for the purpose of the PL. The decibels of discontent were ratched up but people were in such awe of him it became a pointless exercise even saying anything. I can remember a spell after the man city opener people saying wait until we play the teams we expected to get something from & I don't think we got anything from them. That became the theme of the season excuse after excuse & justification for his bad buys.

I thought as much
So you, along with everyone else was happy to see the chairman give the manager money to spend after promotion
The problem wasn't the fact he gave him the money to spend, but the way it was spent
As such I don't see why you were arguing against my original point

[Jakubclaret]

I thought as much
So you, along with everyone else was happy to see the chairman give the manager money to spend after promotion
The problem wasn't the fact he gave him the money to spend, but the way it was spent
As such I don't see why you were arguing against my original point

It's not just who he bought it was the positions he neglected leaving us lopsided it's already been widely acknowledged that for some bizarre reason he overloaded us with wingers. Like I said valid concerns were raised which ultimately proved true but were shouted down. It was a failed experiment overseen by pace both are as equally culpable.

[Row x]

It's not just who he bought it was the positions he neglected leaving us lopsided it's already been widely acknowledged that for some bizarre reason he overloaded us with wingers. Like I said valid concerns were raised which ultimately proved true but were shouted down. It was a failed experiment overseen by pace both are as equally culpable.

Yes, I get all that, but the discussion was about why we are where we are financially, and that it was because the chairman backed the manager after promotion.

You came on suggesting that there was a group of you who could foresee it was all going to end in tears, but actually your concerns were not at the time Kompany was being given the money to spend, but later when you saw what he'd spent that money on

[Jakubclaret]

Yes, I get all that, but the discussion was about why we are where we are financially, and that it was because the chairman backed the manager after promotion.

You came on suggesting that there was a group of you who could foresee it was all going to end in tears, but actually your concerns were not at the time Kompany was being given the money to spend, but later when you saw what he'd spent that money on

We could see that the complete shebang was going tits up irrespective of money the project itself was doomed to fail. You can't just throw a new team together & expect it to work in the PL people need time to adjust & for new ideas to be implemented.

[mdd2]

VK and the club signed some good players-see where most have gone -to a better standard of football they came from certainly not lower and/or at a profit for us
Muric-profit and in prem league, O'Shea the same, Vigoroux profit I imagine and now in Championship, Twine and McNally-similar to Vigoroux, Berge profit same league, Odobert, profit and prem league, Zaroury and Vitinho profit no idea of standard of league compared with Championship, Bastien-no idea of profit/loss account, Al Dakhill better league and profit and three of VK's signings out on loan Amdouni Obafemi and Churlinov. Amdouni at Benfica so an upgrade Obafemi in the same standard and no idea about Churlinov.
Have a gut feeling that a less recalcitrant manager ( not quite the word for VK-but pretty uncompromising and stubborn on how to play the game) with the squad we had could have kept us up

[CleggHall]

Yes given these recent sales/moves, it demonstrates that we had a quality squad last year and should have been able to survive in the PL. It just required a manager to organise and weld them together into a team, VK was not that man but player recruitment was very good.

[mdd2]

done pretty well in my view with recruitment over the years since BK took over with Stan. Bound to be some bad signings but the good outweighed the bad

[CrosspoolClarets]

The risk to Pace’s strategy appears to be that line in the accounts that a loan had to be paid off sooner if relegated (probably what led to cash being limited despite big profits on outgoing players). Clearly that could go wrong if the players didn’t get offers of that magnitude. As it is though, it feels like that bullet has been dodged. If we fail to go up the squad could probably be kept together for a 2nd go (apart from players like Esteve and Foster who may get offers from the PL). We also have money coming in for some players such as Amdouni in a year’s time that can offset incoming players of a similar type who we have to buy in 12 months.

Using the above logic there is little option but to go down the young player route, which people like Dyche would oppose I’d guess.

So all in all I think he has done a good job, but it is a risky strategy.

[Big Vinny K]

We could see that the complete shebang was going tits up irrespective of money the project itself was doomed to fail. You can't just throw a new team together & expect it to work in the PL people need time to adjust & for new ideas to be implemented.

Just close down the back and forth debate and post the link where you said before a ball was kicked last season that it was all “doomed to fail”

You’ve posted several times how obvious it was and how you knew what was going to happen so it should not be difficult to find one of your many posts before the 11th August 2023.

[Jakubclaret]

You are like a dog with a bone I'm not quite sure how many times I've got to politely ask please don't quote. Alarm bells started ringing as early as Chris wood going to Newcastle who's an out & out proven goalscorer & replacing him with a guy who'd never kicked a ball in English football & as it later transpired didn't want to play in the championship. It's all old hat it's been debated & debated about release clauses & what louis van gaal said & didn't say the kompany thing for me was just a continuation of that. It was said at the time that too much was getting changed far too soon but such was the euphoria of the championship season & the ewood win the guy was walking on water & turning water into wine & what could possibly go wrong & lo & behold. It's old hat.

[Big Vinny K]

Dog with a bone ?

How many times have you posted on this thread alone ?

If you don’t want people to think you are just spouting this crap with the benefit of hindsight then it’s simple - just post at least one link where you said all this stuff….prior to August 2023. You are saying you now knew all this back to when Chris Wood was sold…..so it can’t be that difficult for a man of your foresight and intelligence to search own posts.

[andyh]

Could be argued that the recruitment people, who had clearly identified targets, including a couple that are clearly Parker inspired choices, pulled Pace out of the mire somewhat after the chaos of this window.

Something tells me that it wasn't Pace who thought Josh Laurent would be a good option in midfield.....

Of course you are right. But as the person responsible for getting the deals to fit in with the grand plan he can screw it up. Look at Garlicks last 12 months. I hate having venture capitalists running the club but I think he realises selling all the family silver at once is not the best way to a long term profit.

[Jakubclaret]

It caused arguments at the time when I believed Simon Jordans take on the transfer as some people might remember I'm not going down that road again.

[GodIsADeeJay81]

I get that but this strategy is very risky as one wrong window and we are in big trouble.

He’s let Kompany buy lot of duds as well so if we get our money back from Trafford Amdouni and Tresor we will have done well. Not convinced Ramsey is going to recoup either.

That’s nearly £43-45m tied up in fees discounting Amdouni who it looks like we’re have got away with if the £20m obligation to buy for Benfica is to be believed.

So it seems roughly that these sales have broken even on the expenditure. We’ll never know exact as they don’t tell us the true figures.

This huge turnover of players is just not sustainable and I hope once they’ve paid off the debt in total that the strategy changes ( if their still here by then).

Of course it’s risky but we’ve still got plenty of time for our young players to grow and make money on

The huge turnover was needed, to get money in the bank etc
Buying low to sell high is our model