Really Poor Today

[dougcollins]

Probably sane muppets who wanted to sack Dyche after we lost 3 nil at Hull on Boxing Day

Had more to worry about than the football that day, we had to stay in Hull as we couldn't get home for the floods.

[RalphCoatesComb]

Should have lost!!!! Get a grip

Really?! Get a grip?!

Get a grip of what? The match stats? The offside goal that wasn't offside? The cross off the bar? The lack of shots at their goal?

We should have lost, but we didn't. Another one where, hopefully, a point will see us over the line, come May. UTC!

[Garnerssoap]

Fulham pal said Parker will get the job done but it’ll be a bit grim. I’ll take that .
I do think Josh Brownhill is the best forward rampaging midfielder in the championship though - that’s the only change I’d make .

[The Shire Claret]

Still think we will win the league

[Swizzlestick]

Fulham and Parker got the job done because they had a PL quality striker in Mitrovic. We very much do not have that.

[dougcollins]

I don't know about should have, but we very easily could have lost that game.

All that possession created us the square root of **** all.

[dougcollins]

Fulham pal said Parker will get the job done but it’ll be a bit grim. I’ll take that .
I do think Josh Brownhill is the best forward rampaging midfielder in the championship though - that’s the only change I’d make .

Brownhill was poor today on the ball, and a poor captain's lead when he's indulging with grappling opposition players.

[Barlickclaret]

Still think we will win the league

Could you please tell me what you've been drinking since today's game finished.

[willsclarets]

We are a work in progress, and a very young team. I was very frustrated today, and we were pretty poor. But the bigger picture isn't bleak at all. We still have these players to come back this season who will improve us on an attacking front:

Beyer
Ramsey
Redmond
Tresor
+ a fully fit Flemming

I include Beyer because he's brilliant at taking a few players out of the game and pushing our midfielders forward. Him and Esteve as a pair at this level is basically cheating.

I am willing to bet anyone on here that if Flemming gets a run of games with Foster, Foster will start to score goals. I know many have written him off but Tresor at this level will be a real asset creating chances. Ramsey has done it for Middlesborough in the Championship, and Redmond is more than capable of scoring goals too.

At the moment, Parker's hand is forced slightly because Flemming hasn't been fit and others aren't suited as well to the 10 role. I do think there are ways we could be a little less cautious even now, especially at home. Anthony or Sarmiento in the 10 today was an option. The system will develop as players come back into the fold, but I think the manager has to sacrifice a little bit of control to risk a few passes forward. I've seen many a player make a run in the last few games (Including Foster), and seldom are they picked out in favour of an easy pass. Our wingers are basically expected to create magic from a completely flat and static situation. It's very easy to defend.

Today was a step backwards, but I'd have snapped your hand off for this start in terms of points. We need to be a little patient, we've lost once in 42 home games at this level, which is ridiculous. With the players we have to come back, I think the attacking side of our game will catch up to the defensive side.

[123EasyasBFC]

What makes you so sure people saying we were really poor are writing the manager and players off?
If you are going to continue comparing this season to the Kompany one I think you are going to hit a wall at some stage.

There’s plenty of posters writing the manager and players off you just need to read the threads.

All people do is compare to previous seasons in the championship

[123EasyasBFC]

Really?! Get a grip?!

Get a grip of what? The match stats? The offside goal that wasn't offside? The cross off the bar? The lack of shots at their goal?

We should have lost, but we didn't. Another one where, hopefully, a point will see us over the line, come May. UTC!

Personally I think Trafford had already seen the flag, the dive was for show, he would of saved the shot if the flag hadn’t gone up

[Elizabeth]

We are a fair way off being a good team. We are lucky this league is terrible.

This will upset those crowing about averaging 2 points a game. It's lucky this league is terrible because all bar one of our wins has been against the bottom half teams, three of which currently occupy the bottom 4 places. We've played 4 of the top half sides and won only one.
I've no doubt most are expecting improvement and believe we will be a good team in time but we are a long way off that at the moment.

[dougcollins]

Personally I think Trafford had already seen the flag, the dive was for show, he would of saved the shot if the flag hadn’t gone up

Bang on.

[bumba]

That lino was dreadful. He got their offside wrong, missed the blatant pull for the penalty and there was also a quick free kick we took that got Foster in and he gave offside despite him getting the run on two Preston players. He was inept and that is being kind.

He could have also flagged for the clear pull on Foster when the defender spun him right round and didn't help the referee out one jot.

[AGENT_CLARET]

Still think we will win the league

[123EasyasBFC]

This will upset those crowing about averaging 2 points a game. It's lucky this league is terrible because all bar one of our wins has been against the bottom half teams, three of which currently occupy the bottom 4 places. We've played 4 of the top half sides and won only one.
I've no doubt most are expecting improvement and believe we will be a good team in time but we are a long way off that at the moment.

Out of the 4 top half teams we have played we have only been played 1 at home and the other 3 away. In those 4 games we have 5 points, given the circumstances is that not reasonable. We played Sunderland away with barely a squad and only lost 1-0. Oxford was disappointing but 9 times of out of 10 with the chances created at Oxford we win the game. Surely it’s better to be see positive signs and feel so negative all the time

[willsclarets]

Why is it so crazy? We have played pretty average, and still picking up points. Is it inconceivable that we improve, get some players back from injury and improve some more? For what it's worth on balance I don't think we will come top, but by the same token it's not a completely laughable prediction.

[kentonclaret]

Still think we will win the league

Currently 9/1 with Sky Bet.

[The Shire Claret]

Could you please tell me what you've been drinking since today's game finished.

A half full glass of positive juice

[Elizabeth]

Out of the 4 top half teams we have played we have only been played 1 at home and the other 3 away. In those 4 games we have 5 points, given the circumstances is that not reasonable. We played Sunderland away with barely a squad and only lost 1-0. Oxford was disappointing but 9 times of out of 10 with the chances created at Oxford we win the game. Surely it’s better to be see positive signs and feel so negative all the time

If you think I'm negative I don't know what you will think when I tell you I feel we are in a false position in the table at the moment.
I'm sure on a number of threads that I've said I expect our performances to improve but I am seeing no positive signs of that at the moment. I'm a big fan of Flemming who I'm putting my trust in to be the catalyst.
People will always see things different ways to back up their beliefs but when most of our wins are against the bottom sides I think it's far too early for me to jump on board

[123EasyasBFC]

If you think I'm negative I don't know what you will think when I tell you I feel we are in a false position in the table at the moment.
I'm sure on a number of threads that I've said I expect our performances to improve but I am seeing no positive signs of that at the moment. I'm a big fan of Flemming who I'm putting my trust in to be the catalyst.
People will always see things different ways to back up their beliefs but when most of our wins are against the bottom sides I think it's far too early for me to jump on board

False position or not being 9 games in on 18 points with the turnover of players, the new head coach and the team injuries I think is only positive, obviously we can play a lot better and when players are fit we will get better.

4 of our next 5 games are away from home which might actually work in our favour, less pressure from the home fans

[Blue Skies]

I posted further up that our defence saw the flag go up and they relaxed. Jury is out whether Trafford was as equally relaxed but it was a half hearted attempt to save it. If any of our defenders move towards the striker he may not have had the clean shot at goal anyway. We didn't get the pen so possibly evens out so let's move 3

[123EasyasBFC]

I think the last 4 games have highlighted at this level how important Beyer is/was.

Esteve might be a better out and out defender but Beyer driving into midfield is something Esteve doesn’t do. Even Ekdal is confident driving forwards.

Maybe it’s an instruction to not do that but it’s something notably missing

[quoonbeatz]

Whereabouts in the league the teams we’ve beaten are at this stage of the season is meaningless, especially in this league where there’s 8 points separating 5th and 21st.

[Elizabeth]

False position or not being 9 games in on 18 points with the turnover of players, the new head coach and the team injuries I think is only positive, obviously we can play a lot better and when players are fit we will get better.

4 of our next 5 games are away from home which might actually work in our favour, less pressure from the home fans

I actually saw your suggested midfield/forward line up on the Cullen thread and think it would make a big difference to our forward play.

[123EasyasBFC]

I actually saw your suggested midfield/forward line up on the Cullen thread and think it would make a big difference to our forward play.

None of the wide players want to play from the right and foster isn’t a number 9, give him some room to drive with the ball out wide and he might be a different player

[Blue Skies]

123 has it right. The lack of drive from either centre half is missing and even under VK this took time until the team worked how to cover it. Esteve may be good enough In time and Roberts may help with that given he has seen it all before. Work in progress

[Elizabeth]

None of the wide players want to play from the right and foster isn’t a number 9, give him some room to drive with the ball out wide and he might be a different player

There is a long thread about Foster and tonight I posted that I think driving with the ball is his biggest strength. I just think with the combination of the other players it could work. I been thinking for the last couple of games that the current two wide players ( three with the usual substitution) isn't working.

[Elizabeth]

123 has it right. The lack of drive from either centre half is missing and even under VK this took time until the team worked how to cover it. Esteve may be good enough In time and Roberts may help with that given he has seen it all before. Work in progress

Yes , Esteve made one really good strong forward run in the second half and hopefully this is a sign of things to come

[cockneyclaret]

Still think we will win the league

With the squad we have yes, if the ones that are out are ever fit.
As it stands my bet would be sheff utd

[Lu-tze]

Personally I think Trafford had already seen the flag, the dive was for show, he would of saved the shot if the flag hadn’t gone up

Dunno if he definitely would have saved it but I agree it was an early flag and I think he’d clocked it, seemed like everyone had stopped and the dive was a bit half-hearted.

[Burnleyareback2]

On 40mins I sat there and wondered, was watching Cotterills football any better than this?

That’s how bad it’s been this week for me. Maybe 3 shots on target in 2 home games.

We can’t be lining up with 1 striker at home against teams like Preston or Plymouth. Especially if we aren’t going to give the 1 striker any service or support.

[Steve-Harpers-perm]

I think most football is poor everyone has decided they have to play like Man City these days. For large parts of the game nothing happens apart from defenders and keepers passing to each other. The days of getting it ‘in the mixer’ are a distant dream!

[CoolClaret]

Criticism is fine when it has some logic behind it - some of the comments on this thread are a bit disappointing and again, are missing key context.

Has it never occurred to some of you that perhaps the reason that the 'training wheels' are on right now is because, for the past 3 games or so, we have fielded a back five that:

- Are all under 24
- One is a left-footed center-half playing at right back
- One has barely played first team mens football, certainly not consecutive starts on the bounce,
- One is a Brazilian player who is still adjusting to a new country and language.

Parker is obviously trying to protect the inexperienced backline a touch, of course getting that balance is key and yes, it's probably a bit too conservative right now but crikey give it a bit of time...

Not to mention, we have so many players yet to come back fit—important players who will offer the side something different (especially in the attacking third).

[CrosspoolClarets]

It’s a quirk of football that sides parking the bus cause problems breaking them down, we are not the first side to suffer at this.

But what needs to change is the attitude to risk. At 0-0 on 60 mins that is the time to take risks, instead we had wingers coming back to receive, never racing down the line awaiting a pass, we had defenders never moving forward, holding midfielders always passing back.

Life is a spectrum, we have a range between Dyche and VK and it seems Parker is close to Dyche. But Dyche played two up front and got it in the mixer quick. He needs time, but needs to throw off the shackles and spend time at training on attacking sequences. You do build a house from the foundations first, but now is the time to build the rest. We simply cannot, cannot, get to January and have our league position resulting in more trying to leave.

[dsr]

The problem isn't so much the results, because 5 in 3 isn't so bad. It's the way we're playing. In 3 games, we scored 1 penalty and nothing else close. No hitting the woodwork, no great saves, no open goals missed, nothing. It's so BORING.

[RVclaret]

The problem isn't so much the results, because 5 in 3 isn't so bad. It's the way we're playing. In 3 games, we scored 1 penalty and nothing else close. No hitting the woodwork, no great saves, no open goals missed, nothing. It's so BORING.

Do you think yesterday & 2nd half Plymouth is how he wants us playing? I can’t see it. I personally thought we were exciting first half v Rovers, first half v Plymouth, parts of Oxford (did more or less miss an open goal with Hountondji btw), 1st half v Leeds, most of the Luton game. Yes I’m selecting particularly halves and generally not 90s because that’s what we’ve been able to put together so far. But I see those games and tempos as the blue print for what we need to deliver more consistently. With key attacking players coming back into it I’m hopeful we will get there, it’s just just 9 games in, 6 if you consider the ‘second pre season’ after 3 games. I think CoolClaret has made a good point that there has been an element of protecting the defence with Worrall & Roberts missing out (average age of 21 last few games) and let’s face it 5 clean sheets in 9, 3 in a row, isn’t to be sniffed at.

[jlup1980]

123 has it right. The lack of drive from either centre half is missing and even under VK this took time until the team worked how to cover it. Esteve may be good enough In time and Roberts may help with that given he has seen it all before. Work in progress

Esteve made one great driving run into the PNE half but the ball was back with Egan-Riley before Esteve was even back in position. That's the problem. We're so "safe" as a team. PNE committed more players forward than us yesterday and that has to be a concern. Let's hope the International break changes things a bit. I understand SP wants to build from a solid base, but you have to do more in the final third.

[Swizzlestick]

If he’s sacrificing positive play to protect the young defence, why isn’t Egan having more of an involvement? He’s sat on the bench which suggests he’s ready. Where is Sambo who at least has Eredivisie experience and would have allowed Humphreys to play in his natural position.

We have played ok in pockets, but in general the football has reverted to exactly the type Fulham and Bournemouth fans warned us about.

[Caballo]

Playing like we're trying to retain our Prem status, we need to get there first! The quality in this league is bobbins, demonstrated by the fact that we're playing with absolutely no ambition whatsoever and we've somehow found ourselves in third place.

[AGENT_CLARET]

It’s a quirk of football that sides parking the bus cause problems breaking them down, we are not the first side to suffer at this.

But what needs to change is the attitude to risk. At 0-0 on 60 mins that is the time to take risks, instead we had wingers coming back to receive, never racing down the line awaiting a pass, we had defenders never moving forward, holding midfielders always passing back.

Life is a spectrum, we have a range between Dyche and VK and it seems Parker is close to Dyche. But Dyche played two up front and got it in the mixer quick. He needs time, but needs to throw off the shackles and spend time at training on attacking sequences. You do build a house from the foundations first, but now is the time to build the rest. We simply cannot, cannot, get to January and have our league position resulting in more trying to leave.

100% Spot on

[Mattster]

Has it never occurred to some of you that perhaps the reason that the 'training wheels' are on right now is because, for the past 3 games or so, we have fielded a back five that:

- Are all under 24
- One is a left-footed center-half playing at right back
- One has barely played first team mens football, certainly not consecutive starts on the bounce,
- One is a Brazilian player who is still adjusting to a new country and language.

Parker is obviously trying to protect the inexperienced backline a touch, of course getting that balance is key and yes, it's probably a bit too conservative right now but crikey give it a bit of time...

- That back line cost more than triple Preston's entire squad.
- If Parker was concerned about lack of experience he has the vastly experienced Egan who has been training with us longer than Humphreys. Parker chooses not to.
- If Parker was concerned about playing a left footed centre back at right back he could very simply swap Humphreys and Egan-Riley around. Parker chooses not to.

Every week there are new excuses being made. "We've got tough opening fixtures we'll look better once we face weaker teams" -> "We'll look better once Cullen is back" ->"We'll look better once we face teams that don't sit 10 men behind the ball" -> "We need more time, we changed too many players" and now we're here with the inexperience of the defence and players being played out of position (both of which the manager has the options to address but chooses not to) apparently now the reason we don't create anything at the other end of the pitch. Can't wait for the next one.

[AGENT_CLARET]

- That back line cost more than triple Preston's entire squad.
- If Parker was concerned about lack of experience he has the vastly experienced Egan who has been training with us longer than Humphreys. Parker chooses not to.
- If Parker was concerned about playing a left footed centre back at right back he could very simply swap Humphreys and Egan-Riley around. Parker chooses not to.

Every week there are new excuses being made. "We've got tough opening fixtures we'll look better once we face weaker teams" -> "We'll look better once Cullen is back" ->"We'll look better once we face teams that don't sit 10 men behind the ball" -> "We need more time, we changed too many players" and now we're here with the inexperience of the defence and players being played out of position (both of which the manager has the options to address but chooses not to) apparently now the reason we don't create anything at the other end of the pitch. Can't wait for the next one.

Absolutely Mattster, some fan's watch our game's with Claret tinted glasses on and never ever see anything wrong

[RVclaret]

If he’s sacrificing positive play to protect the young defence, why isn’t Egan having more of an involvement? He’s sat on the bench which suggests he’s ready. Where is Sambo who at least has Eredivisie experience and would have allowed Humphreys to play in his natural position.

We have played ok in pockets, but in general the football has reverted to exactly the type Fulham and Bournemouth fans warned us about.

Fulham fans are pretty salty about his time there. And I spoke to a few Bournemouth fans who really enjoyed his football. I guess it depends who you speak to. Just a point on this too, they averaged 1.43 and 1.65 xG (chance creation) per 90 respectively, Kompany’s Burnley was 1.45 and we are currently 0.9.

[Elizabeth]

Whereabouts in the league the teams we’ve beaten are at this stage of the season is meaningless, especially in this league where there’s 8 points separating 5th and 21st.

I think after 9 games the league table may be more important than you think

[NL Claret]

Absolutely Mattster, some fan's watch our game's with Claret tinted glasses on and never ever see anything wrong

Works both ways though, some fans watch our games trying to find a stick to beat the club and managers/players they personally don’t like, and some are fixated on the 2022/2023 season.

[AGENT_CLARET]

Works both ways though, some fans watch our games trying to find a stick to beat the club and managers/players they personally don’t like, and some are fixated on the 2022/2023 season.

If its dull it's dull, let's see at the end of the season our final position and I bet we only just hit 5th or 6th, with the value of the squad around x6/X8 that of most teams in this league and probably x3 the wage bill of most team's if we don't hit top 2 it's not good enough

[CoolClaret]

- That back line cost more than triple Preston's entire squad.
- If Parker was concerned about lack of experience he has the vastly experienced Egan who has been training with us longer than Humphreys. Parker chooses not to.
- If Parker was concerned about playing a left footed centre back at right back he could very simply swap Humphreys and Egan-Riley around. Parker chooses not to.

Every week there are new excuses being made. "We've got tough opening fixtures we'll look better once we face weaker teams" -> "We'll look better once Cullen is back" ->"We'll look better once we face teams that don't sit 10 men behind the ball" -> "We need more time, we changed too many players" and now we're here with the inexperience of the defence and players being played out of position (both of which the manager has the options to address but chooses not to) apparently now the reason we don't create anything at the other end of the pitch. Can't wait for the next one.

You have little to no objectivity here and want to be proven right because you were dead against SP from the off and have been looking to criticise after every single game.

The fee for our young players here is determined by their perceived potential.

There has been plenty of times beforehand when we have been playing in the PL where Dyche has had pelters playing against teams where one of their players cost more than our entire squad.

It's also really just the 6th game with this 'new' team.

SP isn't a moron, he knows that we will have to create better chances going forward, but you don't win a league by making drastic changes every week for one-off games. It's about finding a formula, perhaps having slight variations and then keeping the players on task.

Ten Hag struggles in the league because of this. Whereas he is great at one-off cup games, Dyche is the opposite.

We do have creative players yet to come back - we do not have a natural attacking midfielder that is fit and available for selection right now. I knew we'd struggle in the final third this year because of that, no matter who the manager would be.

The most important point though, is that we are third, have just one loss all season (where SP was forced to play a drastically weakened team) and have many players to come back. Now is not the time to be all negative - let's see how we're looking after gameweek 15.

[NL Claret]

If its dull it's dull, let's see at the end of the season our final position and I bet we only just hit 5th or 6th, with the value of the squad around x6/X8 that of most teams in this league and probably x3 the wage bill of most team's if we don't hit top 2 it's not good enough

Out of interest, how much have you put on finishing 5th or 6th?

[AGENT_CLARET]

Out of interest, how much have you put on finishing 5th or 6th?

Nothing, but I've got £100 @ 8/1 winning the league so that's money I'll never see again