My big take - Bashir Humphreys

[jdrobbo]

I’m already a huge fan of Bash and whilst there’s still a rawness to his game, I think it’s fair to say, he’s one player with whom you can see his improvement and development, week upon week.

He played on the wrong side away at Leeds and whilst completely defensively solid, he struggled to keep the ball in play when in possession, often passing or running it out.

But like with CJER, who clearly struggled at full back (Wolves), after a relatively assured performance at centre back, on that fateful day up in Sunderland, I wonder if we’re witnessing the evolution of a player who is going to end up seeing his rise in a position away from where we expected? I’m becoming more and more confident that he’ll end up staying in this left-sides fullback position.

He was mainly signed as a left sided central defender and I think we all know that injury, suspension or God forbid, a sale aside, Estève won’t be giving up that position in a hurry. Yet when I look at Humphreys, I see a tall, strong and very athletic player who is very secure in his left back defensive role, but who is rapidly (very rapidly) improving his attacking play.

I also noted recently, that Joe Worrall, when on co-comms with Phil Bird, said that Bash is a player with massive potential.

It was interesting to note in his post-match interview, how he had been putting in extra hours after training, to get himself into those positions and produce crosses like he did for the Flemming winner at Blackburn.

I really look forward to seeing his development. I think it’s fair to say that the fee banded around for the possible signing of Humphreys at the end of the season (was it £10-12 million?) seemed enormous. You know, it could turn out to be an incredible bargain!

I would love to think we’ll see a lot more of him in a Burnley shirt.

He seems an absolutely top lad too!

Well played Bashir!

UTC

[123EasyasBFC]

Much better team with him in it, has the same amount of assists as Pires so the argument that Pires is better going forward doesn’t really work for me

[BurnleyFC]

After my initial reservations, he’s doing well at left back but I think he’ll up end being our left sided centre half as and when Esteve leaves.

[Tricky Trevor]

Has improved dramatically from his early FB appearances and now gets forward looking like he has good intentions. Previously he looked lost over the halfway line.
Comfortably two footed his biggest weakness is his first touch, which can getaway from him, but is solvable in training.
Will make a fine player.

[Devils_Advocate]

Don't disagree with anything you've written but it's hardly a big take. If you'd have come out with this post 6-8 weeks ago then maybe but doubt you'll find many fans who don't think this player has huge potential and looks like he has a top future ahead of him.

[ecc]

I've just checked on the usually reliable Transfermarkt concerning Bashir's loan.

Apparently it's an "Obligation to buy with conditions" loan.

I don't know whether a fee has been agreed, I tend to think not as I can't recall it mentioned on here.

What I do know is Chelsea can be thankful to Burnley for increasing his value. The lad's know floating in delightful crosses for our lads to head home.

[ecc]

Hi John,

I hadn't seen your thread about Bashir.

Here's mine:

ecc » Mon Jan 06, 2025 12:40 am
I've just checked on the usually reliable Transfermarkt concerning Bashir's loan.

Apparently it's an "Obligation to buy with conditions" loan.

I don't know whether a fee has been agreed, I tend to think not as I can't recall it mentioned on here.

What I do know is Chelsea can be thankful to Burnley for increasing his value. The lad's know floating in delightful crosses for our lads to head home.

[CharlieinNewMexico]

I assume the conditions are from our end “if we go up”.
Vaguely remember £12M mentioned from somewhere, not sure how reliable. Personally think he’s going to go on to big things, very underrated IMO.

[Foshiznik]

I believe the fee was agreed at £8m

[jdrobbo]

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[Clive 1960]

I’m already a huge fan of Bash and whilst there’s still a rawness to his game, I think it’s fair to say, he’s one player with whom you can see his improvement and development, week upon week.

He played on the wrong side away at Leeds and whilst completely defensively solid, he struggled to keep the ball in play when in possession, often passing or running it out.

But like with CJER, who clearly struggled at full back (Wolves), after a relatively assured performance at centre back, on that fateful day up in Sunderland, I wonder if we’re witnessing the evolution of a player who is going to end up seeing his rise in a position away from where we expected? I’m becoming more and more confident that he’ll end up staying in this left-sides fullback position.

He was mainly signed as a left sided central defender and I think we all know that injury, suspension or God forbid, a sale aside, Estève won’t be giving up that position in a hurry. Yet when I look at Humphreys, I see a tall, strong and very athletic player who is very secure in his left back defensive role, but who is rapidly (very rapidly) improving his attacking play.

I also noted recently, that Joe Worrall, when on co-comms with Phil Bird, said that Bash is a player with massive potential.

It was interesting to note in his post-match interview, how he had been putting in extra hours after training, to get himself into those positions and produce crosses like he did for the Flemming winner at Blackburn.

I really look forward to seeing his development. I think it’s fair to say that the fee banded around for the possible signing of Humphreys at the end of the season (was it £10-12 million?) seemed enormous. You know, it could turn out to be an incredible bargain!

I would love to think we’ll see a lot more of him in a Burnley shirt.

He seems an absolutely top lad too!

Well played Bashir!

UTC

I'm with you on this John still a bit of developing to do but a lot of potential there , so fingers crossed

[Vegas Claret]

Fabrizio is wrong on loads of fees, well out on some.

[Quickenthetempo]

He is improving, which is what is supposed to happen when young lads start getting regular football.

He came with a lot of expectation with such a high fee to pay and struggled to get in his favoured Centre half position. He's not a natural full back but could be perfect for a defensive back four in the prem. Or left side of a 3.

He really impressed me in the Boro home game after being at fault for their goal. He didn't sulk, he just tackled everything after that for fun.

[Walt]

Good OP..

It's great we're signing these young players and up to now seem to be doing quite well doing so. My only gripe is, if this is our model and main way of making big money we will need to get a bit tighter on the terms of the deals to make it a big success.

That's going to be quite difficult as clubs such as Chelsea clearly aren't going to be letting talent go on the cheap. The sell on fees will hurt our profit margin too, you'd think this will be at least 20%.

Overall positive though and back to Bashir specifically, starting to look like a player with a great future.

[Goliath]

So if we don't go up, we are still paying nearly 12 million on a full back??? I wonder if he's seen as Esteve's replacement.

[Steve-Harpers-perm]

Looking a very good player and a peach of a cross on Saturday. Imagine a bit like Ben Mee did here he will eventually move into the centre of the defence.

[Commy]

So if we don't go up, we are still paying nearly 12 million on a full back??? I wonder if he's seen as Esteve's replacement.

One says obligation and another says option.

[claretspice]

He's looking a very good player.

I wouldn't over think the question of whether he's a left back or a left sided centre back. Plenty of players these days who are equally comfortable in both roles, and are deployed in both.

Right now, he's our first choice left back. I like Pires and think he's been unfairly maligned at times, and one thing Humphreys doesn't replicate (yet) is the quality of Pires' forward passing from left back. But he's clearly a better defender and he's provided two excellent crosses for assists in the last three away games. Whilst both are perfectly mobile, the one thing both Pires and Humphreys lack is real out and out pace/accelaration - we still miss the "thrust" from full back that Maatsen (and as an understudy, Vitinho) gave us two seasons ago - hitting the attack at pace to add a real extra incision.

If we go up (huge "if" right now) it wouldn't surprise me if Parker uses a back 3 next season, in which case you'd think Humphreys would be a natural in that left sided centre back role - that might be his best "fit" right now, particularly in the modern way which sees the outside centre backs (at least on one side) encouraged to join the attack as an extra man on occasion. Parker used a back three in the Premier League with Fulham latterly, and it's consistent with the shape he's adopted occasionally away from home this season, with Anthony/Vitinho dropping into a wing back role and Roberts tucking in - and you can see how it might suit the core of a team that Parker might want to pick (Egan Riley, Esteve and Humphreys looks a natural back 3, and we're well stocked with players to use in the three or four central midfield positions that formation can create.

[FeedTheArf]

One says obligation and another says option.

You would think the obligation kicks in if we are promoted. In which case it’ll be money well spent given it’ll avoid another Maatsen saga.

[RVclaret]

I’m a huge fan of his. First interview showed what a good character he is and his first game (Wolves) showed the type of player he is (versatile, athletic, modern ball player). Again you’ve got to give Parker some credit for 1. playing him at left back 2. realising his potential - I read rather mixed reports from his time at Swansea so it’s hardly like we signed someone people were raving about and was fully cooked. If we go up he’s got the exact profile I want in a full back role as he adds height and athleticism, something I felt we lacked last season against Prem teams.

[Anonymous Claret]

He is looking our best left back by some distance atm.
He looks more comfortable every game and has been pivotal with his 2 crosses against Sheffield United and Blackburn winning us 6 points.
Stephen Ward early in his career started as a forward but played left back most of it.
Humphreys may have come as a centre back but it looks as though his best position may be left back.
It won't be the first time a player of ours finds their best position. Later in his career Alexander moved from right back to holding midfielder plus Mee moved from left back to centre half.

[jlup1980]

Bashir has huge potential and is showing his worth more and more every week. I see him as I saw Ben Mee. He'll be a centre back, but he's learning his trade at left back. In the same way that Mee was always going to move into the middle once Jason Shackell departed, I see Bashir as Esteve's replacement if or when he leaves.

[IanMcL]

Bash down the left crossong for Bash down the middle! What a team!

[warksclaret]

Our best LB since Stephen Ward (who I really rated). I never once worry that Bash is going to get roasted by his opposing winger. He is very good defensively and the recent improvements have been largely going forwards with two great recent assists which have helped gain us 6 points. he gets better each game, and even if we stay down at £12m he is an appreciating ASSET

[gtclaret]

A few points
1 He can't be called Bash now Barnes is here,he is the one and only bash,so he will have to be called Humph
2 I don't see him as being two footed as mentioned before and his first touch does need a bit of work.
3 He is looking very comfortable at LB so no need to move him unless Esteve leaves

[ClaretLoup]

Humph/Bash would have had two more assists if Brownhill had buried those two exquisite pull backs from the bye line vs Stoke and Boro away.

[DCWat]

He’s grown into the left back position and is doing a great job there. Quite whether that would be the case in the league above, I’m less convinced.

His time will come for a run in his favoured position at centre half. I suspect that ultimately it will be in this position that we see even better from him.

Either way, he’s growing into a great young player for us.

[Rowls]

Can’t argue with the analysis of the OP.

Bashir’s still got a mistake in him and a small concentration issue but he’s been exceptional for some time now.

On his current path, Humphrey’s might well go on to play for England.

We’ve seen Trippier and Maatsen progress in recent years, Humphreys look to have the same potential.

[claretgimmer]

Ben Mee came here as a full back if I remember rightly and looked a bit too slow, however was it Dyche ( not sure) who moved him to CH and the rest is history as they say, maybe left back is Bashirs new found position going forward in his career.

[Papabendi]

Better crosser of a ball than any of our wingers - and he is technically a centre back

[Quickenthetempo]

Ben Mee came here as a full back if I remember rightly and looked a bit too slow, however was it Dyche ( not sure) who moved him to CH and the rest is history as they say, maybe left back is Bashirs new found position going forward in his career.

No he was a CH but couldn't get in the team there. So he got shifted to full back until he got more experience. He was outpaced too many times at full back so had to come back inside.

[KellyClaret]

I like the sentiment of the post OP and completely agree but it's hardly a big take is it? I think it's as clear as day to anyone that's seen him this season that he's a CB.

Just had a look at his stats on Transfermarkt and has pretty much always played CB. He'd actually played more games at RB than LB before this season.

[jdrobbo]

The ‘take’ is that I think his rise will be as a brilliant fullback. Most, like you, still think he’ll be a centre back. That’s likely correct, but the ‘take’ is that despite playing out of position, I can see him becoming highly effective and successful there

[Rowls]

No he was a CH but couldn't get in the team there. So he got shifted to full back until he got more experience. He was outpaced too many times at full back so had to come back inside.

Nah, that's not how it happened.

Michael Duff was the one who was struggling, not Ben Mee. Duff's age had caught up with him.

Duff was dropped, Mee tucked inside to CB and Stephen Ward moved into the vacant left back slot.

[jdrobbo]

I agree

[Newcastleclaret93]

The ‘take’ is that I think his rise will be as a brilliant fullback. Most, like you, still think he’ll be a centre back. That’s likely correct, but the ‘take’ is that despite playing out of position, I can see him becoming highly effective and successful there

He’s 100% improved his attacking prowess as the season has progressed. If he keeps improving I think he could be really good left back in the prem. he’s got the physical attributes to make a success of it.

[claretonthecoast1882]

The lesson should be for some to just show a bit of patience with young footballers

[SirBob]

Nah, that's not how it happened.

Michael Duff was the one who was struggling, not Ben Mee. Duff's age had caught up with him.

Duff was dropped, Mee tucked inside to CB and Stephen Ward moved into the vacant left back slot.

Ben Mee was CB through his rise through Man City’s youth teams, he spent some time out on loan at Leicester City I think it was before he came to us where he was used at LB but he has always been a CB. Young CB are often used as FBs to gain exposure as there is slightly more margin for error and also gives them a chance to build strength and aggression needed to be a top CB.

[Anonymous Claret]

Nah, that's not how it happened.

Michael Duff was the one who was struggling, not Ben Mee. Duff's age had caught up with him.

Duff was dropped, Mee tucked inside to CB and Stephen Ward moved into the vacant left back slot.

QTT is right. Mee started his career as a centre back. He captained City to a youth cup at centre back, played on loan at Leicester as a centre and then came to us the following season.

I think Howe played him as a centre back for quite a few games but he really struggled. He wasn't on his own as the whole team was often shambolic as a defensive unit.

I can't remember whether it was Howe or Dyche who moved him to left back. As time progressed I think that a lot of people saw that Mee's best position would probably be centre back which also allowed Ward to be brought back into the side at left back. Some posters and Dyche couldn't see this but they eventually came around to that way of thinking.

I always thought that Mee's best position would be centre back, especially within a well organised Dyche team.

[Anonymous Claret]

The ‘take’ is that I think his rise will be as a brilliant fullback. Most, like you, still think he’ll be a centre back. That’s likely correct, but the ‘take’ is that despite playing out of position, I can see him becoming highly effective and successful there

He might be a centre back in the future but at the moment he is improving at a rapid rate as a left full back. Whilst we have Esteve I cannot see him playing at left centre back unless there is an injury or suspension. At the beginning of the season I could not have imagined Humphreys putting in the crosses for Brownhill and Flemming at Sheffield Utd and Blackburn respectively. Didn't Ben White start as a centre back also? I think left back will be his best position but I could be wrong.

[Rowls]

QTT is right. Mee started his career as a centre back. He captained City to a youth cup at centre back, played on loan at Leicester as a centre and then came to us the following season.

I think Howe played him as a centre back for quite a few games but he really struggled. He wasn't on his own as the whole team was often shambolic as a defensive unit.

I can't remember whether it was Howe or Dyche who moved him to left back. As time progressed I think that a lot of people saw that Mee's best position would probably be centre back which also allowed Ward to be brought back into the side at left back. Some posters and Dyche couldn't see this but they eventually came around to that way of thinking.

I always thought that Mee's best position would be centre back, especially within a well organised Dyche team.

Quickentthetempo is NOT right. He claimed the reason Mee reverted to CB was because he was getting outpaced:

No he was a CH but couldn't get in the team there. So he got shifted to full back until he got more experience. He was outpaced too many times at full back so had to come back inside.

This simply is NOT true. He was moved to LB because Duff and Keane were judged to be our best CB pairing. Mee did an exceptional job at LB - in fact he had been playing there for us for over a season under Dyche.

The fact that he started out as a CB is neither here nor there. The reason he moved from LB to CB is NOT because he was "outpaced too many times" as Quickenthetempo states. Ben Mee was moved back to his preferred CB position because Michael Duff's form fell off a cliff as his aged legs deserted him.

[Rowls]

Ben Mee was CB through his rise through Man City’s youth teams, he spent some time out on loan at Leicester City I think it was before he came to us where he was used at LB but he has always been a CB. Young CB are often used as FBs to gain exposure as there is slightly more margin for error and also gives them a chance to build strength and aggression needed to be a top CB.

This is correct but it's by-the-by and doesn't contradict anything I've said whatsoever.

[Anonymous Claret]

Quickentthetempo is NOT right. He claimed the reason Mee reverted to CB was because he was getting outpaced:



This simply is NOT true. He was moved to LB because Duff and Keane were judged to be our best CB pairing. Mee did an exceptional job at LB - in fact he had been playing there for us for over a season under Dyche.

The fact that he started out as a CB is neither here nor there. The reason he moved from LB to CB is NOT because he was "outpaced too many times" as Quickenthetempo states. Ben Mee was moved back to his preferred CB position because Michael Duff's form fell off a cliff as his aged legs deserted him.

We will have to disagree on this one Rowls. Mee wasn't exceptional at left back. I would say that he was average to good and sometimes very good. However I would say that Ward was exceptional at left back and when Mee moved to his best position at left centre back he was also exceptional.

[Rowls]

We will have to disagree on this one Rowls. Mee wasn't exceptional at left back. I would say that he was average to good and sometimes very good. However I would say that Ward was exceptional at left back and when Mee moved to his best position at left centre back he was also exceptional.

We can "agree to disagree" all we like but the fact of the matter is that Ben Mee was moved back to his preferred CB position because Michael Duff was dropped.

It had little to nothing to do with Mee's performances at LB. Mee was playing fine there for us. He'd already won one Championship promotion playing at LB for us.

OK, so the fact we had Stephen Ward waiting in the wings as a replacement LB will have helped Dyche make the decision.

But just that Ben Mee was certainly NOT moved back to CB for the reason Quickenthetempo erroneously claimed.

Sorry to 'make a thing' about this because it isn't a big deal (so what if some people get a football fact wrong?) but what I'm saying is factually correct in this instance and there's a degree of importance that should be attached to truth. I mean that completely sincerely. I've messed up big time today and ended up posting something I shouldn't have on here (now correctly removed - thank you mods) and in this instance, QTT has just remembered events not quite as they happened. No more, no less.

[DCWat]

We will have to disagree on this one Rowls. Mee wasn't exceptional at left back. I would say that he was average to good and sometimes very good. However I would say that Ward was exceptional at left back and when Mee moved to his best position at left centre back he was also exceptional.

Agreed. Mee had been poor at Left back and there were many of us calling for him to be played at his natural position. Eventually he was moved back inside and hey presto, we saw a top centre half.

[Anonymous Claret]

We can "agree to disagree" all we like but the fact of the matter is that Ben Mee was moved back to his preferred CB position because Michael Duff was dropped.

It had little to nothing to do with Mee's performances at LB. Mee was playing fine there for us.

I will engage 1 more time before I leave to do some work. What you have shared is not fact but your opinion of what happened which is different to the opinion shared by QTT, DC Wat, myself and many others. I am sure that there will be other people who also share your opinion because as I remember the debate about Mee moving to centre back was discussed at length and in depth even though I didn't post on these boards at that particular time.

We all remember it differently and that's ok.

[jdrobbo]

He’s 100% improved his attacking prowess as the season has progressed. If he keeps improving I think he could be really good left back in the prem. he’s got the physical attributes to make a success of it.

Very much how I see it

[dougcollins]

We can "agree to disagree" all we like but the fact of the matter is that Ben Mee was moved back to his preferred CB position because Michael Duff was dropped.

It had little to nothing to do with Mee's performances at LB. Mee was playing fine there for us.


We all remember it differently and that's ok.

I remember it different. Ben wasn't quick enough for LB and his performances weren't great, by any stretch.

He was perfectly suited to play CB.

[Anonymous Claret]

I remember it different. Ben wasn't quick enough for LB and his performances weren't great, by any stretch.

He was perfectly suited to play CB.

I completely agree. Those first 2 paragraphs are from a previous post by Rowls who I was disagreeing with.

When I copied and pasted the 2 paragraphs I forgot to copy his username also.

[Colburn_Claret]

He's doing great as he is, but he'll be ideal if we ever do decide to go 3-4-3, or 3-5-2.

I thought the biggest problem last season was the lack of numbers in midfield, we'd lose the ball and immediately be defending the area. We lacked the ability to change formation to deal with different situations/teams, or if we did it went over my head. That ability to read a game, make changes to counter, and have the confidence of the team to fall into position has been missing most of our prem seasons. The norm is swap like for like, or chuck the kitchen sink for the last 5 mins.