Our Lack of Goals is Killing Us Big Time

[Vegas Claret]

Flemming was so isolated all game, he should have done better with his hold up - Barnes should have been the change. He would have held it up and bought free kicks (for Sunderland of course because the ref was a dick )

[agreenwood]

Our defensive record this season is incredible. It’s becoming a once in a lifetime season.

On the flip side we’ve only scored 10 goals at home in the last 12 games. That’s normally something you associate with relegation fodder.

There’s a balance to be found.

[DCWat]

I’ve never been Brownhill’s biggest fan, certainly at the level above, but we were saying on the way over to the game tonight that he’s been superb recently and his numbers can’t be knocked.

Tonight though, I wondered if he might have been unwell this week. Aside from the knockdown to Flemming (should have scored) I thought he was really poor tonight, passes going astray or behind players, not pressing as well as he usually does and not doing enough to find space.

For me, if Foster was being kept on the pitch to go central, it was the opportunity to take Brownhill off and drop Flemming into his more natural position.

As it was, the substitutions seemed to knock the stuffing out of us. I also thought that throwing Sonne in at that stage of a game, when Sunderland were pressing, was a bit harsh on the lad - though it wasn’t one of Roberts’ best games.

[dsr]

I’ve never been Brownhill’s biggest fan, certainly at the level above, but we were saying on the way over to the game tonight that he’s been superb recently and his numbers can’t be knocked.

Tonight though, I wondered if he might have been unwell this week. Aside from the knockdown to Flemming (should have scored) I thought he was really poor tonight, passes going astray or behind players, not pressing as well as he usually does and not doing enough to find space.

For me, if Foster was being kept on the pitch to go central, it was the opportunity to take Brownhill off and drop Flemming into his more natural position.

As it was, the substitutions seemed to knock the stuffing out of us. I also thought that throwing Sonne in at that stage of a game, when Sunderland were pressing, was a bit harsh on the lad - though it wasn’t one of Roberts’ best games.

We are not going to see two forwards in a game we are drawing. Parker's plan A is to play with just one up front and try and win 1-0. If that fails, plan B is to play for a 0-0 draw. If you draw at home and win away, you (almost always) get promotion.

[NewClaret]

I’ve never been Brownhill’s biggest fan, certainly at the level above, but we were saying on the way over to the game tonight that he’s been superb recently and his numbers can’t be knocked.

Tonight though, I wondered if he might have been unwell this week. Aside from the knockdown to Flemming (should have scored) I thought he was really poor tonight, passes going astray or behind players, not pressing as well as he usually does and not doing enough to find space.

For me, if Foster was being kept on the pitch to go central, it was the opportunity to take Brownhill off and drop Flemming into his more natural position.

As it was, the substitutions seemed to knock the stuffing out of us. I also thought that throwing Sonne in at that stage of a game, when Sunderland were pressing, was a bit harsh on the lad - though it wasn’t one of Roberts’ best games.

I think you’re right in Brownhill. I’d have hooked him at half time. Miles off it tonight but he’s earned an off game. To wait until the 80th minute was a mistake on Parker’s behalf.

We need to stop talking about Flemming playing his “natural position” in this side though because we don’t play a natural 10. That’s not what Brownhill is playing. I don’t think we’ll ever see Flemming playing in the role fans see as the 10.

Sonne I thought was a good move at the time. I thought he might give us more going forward than Roberts. Turned out not to be so. It wasn’t a pen but it was an error to go down and could’ve been costly.

[Tricky Trevor]

The majority of the second half was woeful.
Ball ending up back with Trafford after we’ve had it in their half is occurring far too frequently.
I lost count of the number of passes over 25yds that were intercepted. Some were under hit and others our forwards were static. We were taught at school to meet the pass.
Anthony started so well and then after not getting a couple of FKs he should have he went into his shell.
A point we didn’t deserve is a bonus.
Although I predicted 0-0 pre-game. Our record against the NE trio is appalling, home and away.

[CrosspoolClarets]

One does have to ponder if a week in Dubai is a good thing during a quad-pemic of viruses this winter. Very easy to imagine a player or two being 30% off it.

The lack of goals is a choice though. I hate it, but it can work. When we go behind, which is rare, we come back with gusto. The players have been told at 0-0 keep it tight and keep a man goalside. All I will say in a positive sense is that if we go up we will need that style more than Kompany’s.

[DCWat]

I think you’re right in Brownhill. I’d have hooked him at half time. Miles off it tonight but he’s earned an off game. To wait until the 80th minute was a mistake on Parker’s behalf.

We need to stop talking about Flemming playing his “natural position” in this side though because we don’t play a natural 10. That’s not what Brownhill is playing. I don’t think we’ll ever see Flemming playing in the role fans see as the 10.

Sonne I thought was a good move at the time. I thought he might give us more going forward than Roberts. Turned out not to be so. It wasn’t a pen but it was an error to go down and could’ve been costly.

Appreciate that Brownhill isn’t playing a 10, but I don’t think it should be beyond the realms that we can switch to a more traditional 4-4-2 if the need dictates.

When offensively it’s not working (and I think we agree that Brownhill wasn’t contributing as effectively as he usually would as more of a box to box player) I think we’re more than solid enough defensively to switch it up, as the need dictates.

For all I didn’t think Roberts was having one of his better games, that was the wrong time to throw Sonne on, for me. Two nil up, fair enough, but not at such a late stage, with no time to get up to the pace of the game. It felt a big ask.

[Rileybobs]

There are a few issues. Some are systemic, some relate to personnel. We don’t have a true number 9, someone who will run in behind (notice how Sunderland’s defence advanced 20 yards after half time because the lack of threat), and a poacher with clever movement in the box. Fleming gets on the end of some crosses but he’s not exactly a fox in the box.

Our attacking players have a lack of composure, or vision, or ability when it comes to playing the final pass. This is of course is what separates the best players from the rest, but I feel that these players should be capable of picking out a player in the box with more frequency. Anthony and Brownhill were both guilty of this tonight. We saw that ‘coolness’ from Tresor albeit against a much weaker opposition, but it’s hard to imagine that he is the answer to this problem.

But the problems often start before we get to the final third, we lack any kind of incision through the centre of the pitch. It’s either a risk averse approach or a lack of confidence or ability to play between the lines (more likely a combination of each) - not helped by playing 3 midfielders who naturally don’t play on the half-turn. Either way, I can see why Parker is keen to sign someone with Shelvey’s ability to play incisive passes from midfield.

I’m not sure how much of this will be solved in the January transfer window, and Parker himself alluded to this not being a personnel issue in his post-match interview. A draw at home to Sunderland is fine, as one at home to Leeds would be, but whether we gain automatic promotion or not will inevitably come down to whether we can put the middling to lower teams to bed. Time will tell. That said I thought tonight was a very enjoyable game as far as 0-0’s go.

[Commy]

The other teams play at a much higher tempo than us which creates space. We are far too ponderous on the ball which gives the opposition time to set up against us.

[Peacock-Barrel]

I've been giving our attack the benefit of the doubt for most of the season as we've only really had 2 fit wingers and one centre forward for most of it, and that lack of choice and form has killed us against the poorer teams that are happy to sit in against us.

And I'd also convinced myself the approach was OK and that if promoted we'd be able to get some joy on the counter attack with Koleosho getting space etc.

But we've got decent options now, Sunderland weren't sat in defending, and we were still so scared about getting forward it's painful. There's no runs behind or through balls, no making defenders run towards their own goal. And we have the tools for it now, we're just not playing for it, and it's proper ineffective (at creating chances).

I don't think a number 9 makes any difference, whoever they are they are so uninvolved it must be tactical. But then the service from wide is slow and ends up being speculative crosses at a line of set centre backs. Either the attacking 8 (Brownhill) has a great game and there's a chance or 2, or he doesn't and it's random scraps (and we're crap at creating those too).

It's fine away but we've got to be more ambitious at home.

[Vegas Claret]

The other teams play at a much higher tempo than us which creates space. We are far too ponderous on the ball which gives the opposition time to set up against us.

All of that

[jojomk1]

We are not going to see two forwards in a game we are drawing. Parker's plan A is to play with just one up front and try and win 1-0. If that fails, plan B is to play for a 0-0 draw. If you draw at home and win away, you (almost always) get promotion.

Parkerball summed up there
Trouble is we won't win all our away games
Given our home form, likely to miss out on automatics and then it's a lottery, but the above tactics will not change with the current squad and Parker style

[Elizabeth]

While Flemming has been on a good goalscoring run, this game reminded everybody he does not have the quick reactions needed of a main striker. Foster was far more effective from the left wide position, Barnes is now restricted to being a battering ram and Jay's legs have gone at this level.
It's obvious what we need.

[Paddy1882]

Realistically we need a winger for each side as Parker clearly doesn’t think Koleosho is up to the task yet, and another striker. Will we get all of these? Not a cat in hells chance.

[agreenwood]

We’ve scored 22 goals in the last 25 games. It puts massive pressure on us to be almost perfect defensively.

There are times when I think we lack a goal threat and times when I think it’s more to do with the quality of supply, but it’s probably a bit of both.

I was hammering Brownhill last night for a poor ball into the keeper’s midriff. Watching a replay, it’s not a great ball (and he could have taken it in), but there’s no movement towards the front post to make more of it. You’ve got three Burnley players occupying similar territory awaiting the ball to arrive towards the back post.

[Pickles]

Interestingly, Pires put similar types of balls through way back in game week one against Luton but yeah, we're missing that type of creativity.

Watched the Luton highlights back over Christmas. Totally unrecognisable to how we've played since. Players running beyond the striker, possession used wisely and at pace, and clinical, emphatic finishing. It was dynamic and intense.

Yes, many (the majority?) of that team aren't with us anymore. But if possible I'd love to see some of those tactics come back.

[claretspice]

The most obvious thing the side needs is a goalscorer. Flemming isn't an out and out goalscorer and nor is Foster. They will both score goals because they are good players but they aren't instinctive around the box. We don't have anyone whose first thought when we win the ball in a dangerous area is to make a goalscoring run in behind, and equally when we have the ball in side areas there invariably aren't enough numbers in the box nor enough movement. We had a string of crosses in the first 25 minutes into dangerous areas at either front or back post, and in each case noone was attacking it.

Equally, though, there was a comparison last night with between the quality and directness of Sunderland's approach play last night in the final third, and ours. That is a bit more forgivable because Tresor, Redmond, Ramsey and Benson are all in principle an answer to that. But none are fit and we're approaching the point where ruthless decisions are needed about whether they can really be relied upon to make the difference. Sarmiento hasn't yet convinced he's at the required level, Flemming hasn't been seen as a 10 for whatever reason (perhaps we'll see it now against weaker teams now with Foster up top), Anthony has been steady but not remarkable Koleosho clearly doesn't have the confidence of himself or Parker right now. If we're going up automatically we need a level above option on those areas.

To put it another way, we're missing what Tella gave us 2 years ago and what Gudmundsson gave us 2 years ago. We miss othee things too (Maatsen's pace and quality from full back) but they're the fundamental differences and ideally we'd address both of them this window.

[123EasyasBFC]

It’s funny how people say ‘how’s it killing us we are still second’ it’s easy to say that now but we are putting ourselves in a position that we have to pretty much win every game from February onwards.

If we had the cutting edge we certainly wouldn’t have had 0-0s. We had a wrongly disallowed goal at West Brom but other than that we have missed massive chances to win against Boro away, Stoke at home and hull away and Oxford away. That’s 10 points right there, we would be clear. Preston, OPR and Derby we didn’t even create a single big chance to win those games, 16 points dropped from 0-0 draws. If we had the proper quality going forwards we would be sat more comfortable than we was at the time in the 22-23 season

[Blyclaret]

It’s funny how people say ‘how’s it killing us we are still second’ it’s easy to say that now but we are putting ourselves in a position that we have to pretty much win every game from February onwards.

If we had the cutting edge we certainly wouldn’t have had 0-0s. We had a wrongly disallowed goal at West Brom but other than that we have missed massive chances to win against Boro away, Stoke at home and hull away and Oxford away. That’s 10 points right there, we would be clear. Preston, OPR and Derby we didn’t even create a single big chance to win those games, 16 points dropped from 0-0 draws. If we had the proper quality going forwards we would be sat more comfortable than we was at the time in the 22-23 season

So all the teams around us are going to win every games from now

[KlyBfc]

Watched the Luton highlights back over Christmas. Totally unrecognisable to how we've played since. Players running beyond the striker, possession used wisely and at pace, and clinical, emphatic finishing. It was dynamic and intense.

Yes, many (the majority?) of that team aren't with us anymore. But if possible I'd love to see some of those tactics come back.

You say many of that team aren’t with us:
But its actually only Oshea, Vitinhio and Odobert isn’t it.

[CoolClaret]

Watched the Luton highlights back over Christmas. Totally unrecognisable to how we've played since. Players running beyond the striker, possession used wisely and at pace, and clinical, emphatic finishing. It was dynamic and intense.

Yes, many (the majority?) of that team aren't with us anymore. But if possible I'd love to see some of those tactics come back.

Yes, I hope we'd play a bit more dynamic at times, though I think losing players like Odobert, Vitinho, JBG etc can't be overstated enough. They're fantastic and opened up so much space on the pitch.

[TsarBomba]

The most obvious thing the side needs is a goalscorer. Flemming isn't an out and out goalscorer and nor is Foster. They will both score goals because they are good players but they aren't instinctive around the box. We don't have anyone whose first thought when we win the ball in a dangerous area is to make a goalscoring run in behind, and equally when we have the ball in side areas there invariably aren't enough numbers in the box nor enough movement. We had a string of crosses in the first 25 minutes into dangerous areas at either front or back post, and in each case noone was attacking it.

Equally, though, there was a comparison last night with between the quality and directness of Sunderland's approach play last night in the final third, and ours. That is a bit more forgivable because Tresor, Redmond, Ramsey and Benson are all in principle an answer to that. But none are fit and we're approaching the point where ruthless decisions are needed about whether they can really be relied upon to make the difference. Sarmiento hasn't yet convinced he's at the required level, Flemming hasn't been seen as a 10 for whatever reason (perhaps we'll see it now against weaker teams now with Foster up top), Anthony has been steady but not remarkable Koleosho clearly doesn't have the confidence of himself or Parker right now. If we're going up automatically we need a level above option on those areas.

To put it another way, we're missing what Tella gave us 2 years ago and what Gudmundsson gave us 2 years ago. We miss othee things too (Maatsen's pace and quality from full back) but they're the fundamental differences and ideally we'd address both of them this window.

Agree completely, but Tella and Maatsen were cheat codes in this league 2 years ago. In the space of a year since leaving us, one played in a Champions League final and the other won the Bundesliga.

We were very fortunate to have that quality in this league.

[Spijed]

We've got 25 points from 13 home matches.

Almost identical to our away form

[claretspice]

Agree completely, but Tella and Maatsen were cheat codes in this league 2 years ago. In the space of a year since leaving us, one played in a Champions League final and the other won the Bundesliga.

We were very fortunate to have that quality in this league.

They were young players on their way up. Tella was on loan from a club that got relegated. Mastsen was outstanding at left back and we miss him, but as I say what we really lack is a locksmith around the box. JBG is a huge miss.

[Pickles]

Agree completely, but Tella and Maatsen were cheat codes in this league 2 years ago. In the space of a year since leaving us, one played in a Champions League final and the other won the Bundesliga.

We were very fortunate to have that quality in this league.

And yet, a substantial number of fans spent a lot of our best season in about thirty years plus moaning about Maatsen. Like you say, a cheat code in the Championship.

[Robbie_painter]

And yet, a substantial number of fans spent a lot of our best season in about thirty years plus moaning about Maatsen. Like you say, a cheat code in the Championship.

Don’t remember one person moaning about Maatsen in fact I remember a substantial number of fans chanting his name during and after most games,I also remember most people buzzing when we put a bid in for him late in the transfer window.

[Pickles]

Don’t remember one person moaning about Maatsen in fact I remember a substantial number of fans chanting his name during and after most games,I also remember most people buzzing when we put a bid in for him late in the transfer window.

Loads and loads of criticism on this board of him during that season. Lots of praise too. But it was unbalanced considering how he was clearly too good for the league. A Champions League final the following season attests to that. A very intelligent footballer, and his ability to play on the inside between central midfield and left wing when in possession... we were never able to replicate it without him.

[Ric_C]

Our main attacking players are either inconsistent or under performing, or now too old.

We defo need a number 9 and an attacking wide player if possible. If not I feel like we will just miss out on the autos. I'm almost coming to the conclusion that it might be better for this young side and Parker to evolve a bit more, and stay in the championship for another season.

You can see what we are trying to achieve, but some of the key players are letting the manager down at the moment.

[jrgbfc]

Our main attacking players are either inconsistent or under performing, or now too old.

We defo need a number 9 and an attacking wide player if possible. If not I feel like we will just miss out on the autos. I'm almost coming to the conclusion that it might be better for this young side and Parker to evolve a bit more, and stay in the championship for another season.

You can see what we are trying to achieve, but some of the key players are letting the manager down at the moment.

Tbh i'm not that bothered about going back up from a football point of view, but i know our finances need it.
Would put massive pressure on us to go up next season though, with Ipswich, Southampton and Leicester all likely coming down and being decent. We'd almost certainly lose Trafford, CJ and Esteve as well.

[Hipper]

Said it on the match thread but we desperately need better quality in the final third.

I actually really like Anthony but he showed tonight exactly where our problems lie. Does amazing work beating a player then can’t cross for toffee.

I think if tresor is on that wing tonight we win the game.

Pace has got to sign someone this window or promotion is gone

We would have lost with Tresor because he wouldn't track Cirkin back.

[Hipper]

Not sure I agree to be honest.

I thought Flemming had one half chance from a knockdown by Brownhill.

The second Flemming chance (penalty incident) was another fortunate knockdown.

The best chance of the game was for Roberts and that was a pin ball chance.

Apart from that can’t really think of any other decent chances tonight

Foster's early chance from a corner, a couple of headers from Humphries, Foster's wild shot after his drive forward, Anthony's shot comfortably saved. Anthony shot straight at Patterson. They're what I remember. The BBC stats say we had 9 with 4 on target (Sunderland was 14/3).

[123EasyasBFC]

How many goals to people think we will end up on after 46 games, we are on 31 with 19 games left

[Jacko]

We'd definitely benefit from a better #9 (but then which team wouldn't) but the more significant issue is the way we're playing. It stems from the manager.

I get very frustrated with keeper, defenders, midfielders and forwards going backwards and sideways but recognise, out of the heat of the moment, that they're likely under instruction to do so. We've got plenty of evidence now to suggest it's a feature not a bug.

[Hipper]

The system works - we're second - but it needs more quality to work better!

[gtclaret]

I think in terms of automatic promotion,if Leeds and Sheffield Utd go on winning runs,we will be left behind as we will drop too many points,I think play off place will be certain as we won't lose too many,as for winning the playoffs,it's a lottery so who knows

[Enola Gay]

Our main attacking players are either inconsistent or under performing, or now too old.

We defo need a number 9 and an attacking wide player if possible. If not I feel like we will just miss out on the autos. I'm almost coming to the conclusion that it might be better for this young side and Parker to evolve a bit more, and stay in the championship for another season.

You can see what we are trying to achieve, but some of the key players are letting the manager down at the moment.

I'm not sure I can, to be honest.

On the way off the match last night a mate said he'd love us to have a prime Sam Vokes to act as a proper 9. Which sounds fine, but we don't play with one. We don't hit it long for a 9 to challenge the centre-halfs and knock down for an onrushing midfielder, nor do we use a 9 as a pivot to bring other players into the game. We certainly don't cross often or well enough to feed a 9 playing in a traditional centre-forward role.

Which then led me to wonder well, what do we actually do? Most of the time it seems like we're looking for everything to come from the midfield and too often at home it doesn't; Brownhill having a rare off-night arguably showed the limitations of this approach. Anthony is inconsistent, Cullen isn't that type of player, Koleosho has visibly regressed from last season (his injury won't have helped that), Foster can do a job there but is needed elsewhere, ditto probably Hannibal. Laurent looks better away from home running through a midfield in transistion than he does running at a packed defence at the Turf.

As others have said above though it's the speed of our attacks that's the killer. The only thing we do at real pace (looking at you here, Luca) is run into blind alleys. More often than not it's slow slow quick quick slow without the injection of tempo. And don't get me started on the movement. If I had a fiver for every time I've seen a defender with the ball at his feet look up and be confronted by 6/7 claret-shirted Weeping Angels I'd be posting this from my very own private Seychelle.

People saying "but we're second!" are missing the point that that's on the back of a freakishly excellent defensive effort. It's probably not realistic and arguably not fair to expect them to bear the massive majority of the promotion effort.

[Dyched]

We need someone in who can score 10/15 at least until the end of the season. If not, we’ll have to settle for the play offs.

[AmbleClaret]

I think in terms of automatic promotion,if Leeds and Sheffield Utd go on winning runs,we will be left behind as we will drop too many points,I think play off place will be certain as we won't lose too many,as for winning the playoffs,it's a lottery so who knows

Watching the pace on show from both Newcastle and Bournemouth currently, I dread to think what we'd look like against one of these.

[willsclarets]

Something we don't seem to do, is use inside channels. Brownhill is just about the only player that does. Isidor did it brilliantly last night. We are flat in wide positions and the only option often is a pin perfect cross. You have to turn defences so they're running the other way. Very seldom to the opposition defence show the numbers on their backs. They can stay in a bank facing our attack.

[ksrclaret]

Not since the days of Steve Cotterill have I seen a Burnley side look as unlikely to score a goal as this one.

We defend magnificently on the whole but there is a reason that our defensive record is unheard of. It’s because teams generally look to score goals as well so they have to take risks with and without the ball.

[CaptJohn]

The other teams play at a much higher tempo than us which creates space. We are far too ponderous on the ball which gives the opposition time to set up against us.

"Ponderous" is the word and why does everything have to go through Cullen? He's a talented player but he slows it down every time. Teams are scared by pace and right now we don't have it or choose not to use it. Anthony was played so many balls last night with a defender right on top of him with nowhere to go. We have to move it faster up field and unbalance teams with through balls. CJ has the right idea with those lovely cross field, diagonal balls but he can't do that every time. Parker must see this as an issue.

[cockneyclaret]

Watching the pace on show from both Newcastle and Bournemouth currently, I dread to think what we'd look like against one of these.

We would be another Southampton.. I couldn't see us scoring more than 15 goals

[Firthy]

Biggest difference between us and Sunderland was the speed of attacking play. Ours seemed almost pedestrian in comparison and a bit too obvious. We need 2 players from this transfer window. A striker who can find the net and a creative player who can thread passes through the middle rather than poor crosses from out wide all the time. I think Tresor could do this but not sure he'll get the chance.

[Superjohnnyfrancis]

Why bring in Barnes if your not going to play him?

[123EasyasBFC]

We would be another Southampton.. I couldn't see us scoring more than 15 goals

We might be bad but we wouldn’t be another Southampton, we wouldn’t play the criminal football in our own box that Southampton are playing

[123EasyasBFC]

Taken from X

Mike T has more assists than Luca K, Jeremy S & Jay Rod.He has the same assists as Josh L, Josh C, Hannibal, Zian F & Lyle F
2 Wingers with 0 assists.
3 midfielders with 1 assist apiece.
3 forwards with 2 assists between them.
It’s mid Jan!!

It’s clear what we are missing

[Newcastleclaret93]

Taken from X

Mike T has more assists than Luca K, Jeremy S & Jay Rod.He has the same assists as Josh L, Josh C, Hannibal, Zian F & Lyle F
2 Wingers with 0 assists.
3 midfielders with 1 assist apiece.
3 forwards with 2 assists between them.
It’s mid Jan!!

It’s clear what we are missing

Crying out for some quality in final third.

Not sure we will get it this window

[Spijed]

We defend magnificently on the whole but there is a reason that our defensive record is unheard of. It’s because teams generally look to score goals as well so they have to take risks with and without the ball.

If defending is as easy as you say for a team that won't take risks, why don't teams who are struggling at both ends of the table follow our template for a period of time and get a few more points on the board, to ensure they give themselves a chance to either avoid relegation or a better chance of promotion?

[TsarBomba]

Watching the pace on show from both Newcastle and Bournemouth currently, I dread to think what we'd look like against one of these.

We couldn’t be any worse than last year. As we’ve already seen this season, we play better against teams that don’t sit in, which is basically every team in the PL. A counter attacking strategy would arguably suit us.

We would need more pace at full back and better quality out wide, but the base/spine is there (if we managed to keep hold of certain players).