Ablation procedure - paroxysmal atrial fibrillation

[beeholeclaret]

After 8 episodes / hospitalisations due to suffering from paroxysmal atrial fibrillation in last 16 years the latest was most serious and rendered me unconscious for nearly 5 minutes.

Whilst NHS have been brilliant I now need to make progress by treating my condition with an ablation which offers the chance of a permanent solution as opposed to a succession of tablets and extensive tests every few years. I have received a referral list of hospitals in North West none of which provide a glowing grading / recoomendation from the Care Quality Commission. What makes matters worse is the waiting lists just for a consultation (let alone treatment) amount to almost a year in some cases.

Ive made tentative enquiries regarding the cost of private treatment and the ablation estimates on one site are between £10k and £20k which is way above the amount Im looking to pay even though it would improve my quality of life considerably. I had to miss last night's match and prospects for future are not looking too bright from my perspective.

What I am asking from you all is there anyone (or friends / relatives) who has had the ablation procedure carried out privately and if so where / who by / what was the cost.

Sorry to ambush this forum with a non football query but Ive always found the knowledge and experiences of others on here to be invaluable when needing to make decisions in the past.

Regards


BHC

[Bullabill]

Whilst NHS have been brilliant ......... What makes matters worse is the waiting lists just for a consultation (let alone treatment) amount to almost a year in some cases.
BHC

If NHS were brilliant you'd have an appointment next week. With that sort of condition (losing consciousness) it should be regarded as an emergency and the system should respond accordingly.

[beeholeclaret]

I should've included the word NHS "staff" were brilliant as first responders etc but follow up is not good and they have just put me on medication which doesnt seem to be solving the problem.

[ClaretDiver]

This is genuine comment, have you looked at whether the procedure is available privately in Thailand? Bumrungrad Hospital in BKK is a fine hospital and may be able to offer the procedure at a fraction of the cost. It does depend on how long the recovery is/follow ups required…

[beeholeclaret]

This is genuine comment, have you looked at whether the procedure is available privately in Thailand? Bumrungrad Hospital in BKK is a fine hospital and may be able to offer the procedure at a fraction of the cost. It does depend on how long the recovery is/follow ups required…

Thanks. I’m not sure I’m up to travelling so far atm but I was yesterday bemoaning the costs and delays for medical treatment in UK. Many people travelling abroad for procedures which should be more readily available in UK. Turkey, Egypt, Hungary etc

[beddie]

Gosh I feel for you beeholeclaret. I think the only thing you can do is keep researching and fire off some emails in the hope somewhere along the way you find a suitable hospital. I know my situation was nothing like yours but last year I had knee, hip and prostate surgery. I spent hours researching (successfully) for private surgeons that might carry out a procedure on the NHS. By researching I found some of the surgeons private secretary's very helpful in recommending other surgeons if the person they worked for didn’t do NHS work. I ended up paying for the prostate surgery due to the length of the waiting list. So what I’m saying is work hard at the research, just by making communication with others may lead you to where you need to be.
Good look, I hope you find what you’re looking for and reasonably quickly. My best wishes to you.

[beeholeclaret]

Thanks Beddie. Some excellent hints there.

Good luck with your own situation. Sounds like you’ve had a lot to contend with. I’ll keep up with the research.

[mdd2]

How old are you beehole and are they suggesting af ablation of av node ablation and insertion of a pacemaker
I guess you are already on apixaban to reduce the risk of stroke?

[mdd2]

https://doi.org/10.4022/jafib.1226
You may have seen this review
Hope the link works

[RattyClaret]

I had this done about 3 years ago at Blackpool hospital

Was done under local aesthetic took about 6:30 hours

I had ventricular tachycardia so had high heart rate episodes even when just sitting still but after ablation and I’m now on calcium blocker tablets I’m back to 80-90% health and I’m not almost passing out whilst driving

My doctor was Dr. Aruna Arujuna

https://www.avahealth.life/about

[RattyClaret]

Mine was though the NHS I opted for local aesthetic as I would of been waiting longer for the op if I wanted general

[TheOriginalLongsider]

I have the same condition as you beeholeclaret but I’ve never been unconscious- just light headed

Beddie gave good advice. I’ve just had an unrelated medical procedure done and shopped around. I first found surgeons that had good reviews and specialised in my condition. I then emailed them for prices. I did a video call and finally a face to face meeting before committing. One thing to enquire about is prices in different locations. My surgeon worked for the NHS and did his private work in various clinics. His secretary gave me the prices for each clinic and there was a big difference. £5k where some clinics were charging £10k for the same surgeon.

[beeholeclaret]

How old are you beehole and are they suggesting af ablation of av node ablation and insertion of a pacemaker
I guess you are already on apixaban to reduce the risk of stroke?

Thanks for your reply mdd2

I’m Aged 66 and have reasonable fitness levels for my age and walk 2 to 3 miles each day. This episode has been my worst and as with previous incidents has been accompanied with a bad cold so always wonder if that triggers it. I had been meds free for 3 years until 10 days ago and thought the issue had dissipated with time and less stress now Ive retired. Blackpool hospital got my heart rate down from 175 bpm to less than 100 and discharged me with bisoporol to control my rate once I was home. With my previous episodes once the fast rate was slowed my heart returned to normal rhythm but on this occasion I’m
Still in AF since 13th Feb. Maybe the meds take time to have desired effect?

Ablation was suggested but no mention of pacemaker. I’m on blood thinners since last week.

Sorry but the link you posted doesn’t work on my phone?

[Down_Rover]

After 8 episodes / hospitalisations due to suffering from paroxysmal atrial fibrillation in last 16 years the latest was most serious and rendered me unconscious for nearly 5 minutes.

Whilst NHS have been brilliant I now need to make progress by treating my condition with an ablation which offers the chance of a permanent solution as opposed to a succession of tablets and extensive tests every few years. I have received a referral list of hospitals in North West none of which provide a glowing grading / recoomendation from the Care Quality Commission. What makes matters worse is the waiting lists just for a consultation (let alone treatment) amount to almost a year in some cases.

Ive made tentative enquiries regarding the cost of private treatment and the ablation estimates on one site are between £10k and £20k which is way above the amount Im looking to pay even though it would improve my quality of life considerably. I had to miss last night's match and prospects for future are not looking too bright from my perspective.

What I am asking from you all is there anyone (or friends / relatives) who has had the ablation procedure carried out privately and if so where / who by / what was the cost.

Sorry to ambush this forum with a non football query but Ive always found the knowledge and experiences of others on here to be invaluable when needing to make decisions in the past.

Regards


BHC

I was diagnosed with AF in May 2023. My GP told me there would be no chance of an ablation by the NHS in the required timescales

I was referred to a Doctor Fox at Spire in Didsbury. In October 2023 he performed a Cardioversion treatment on me, similarto ablation but non invasive.

Cost me £3000. I would not recommend the hospital . Administratively there were dire. But Doctor Fox was superb and worth every penny.

I have had no adverse symptoms since but still have to consume mountains of tablets

Good lick. I will find some phone numbers for you if it helps

[mdd2]

Paroxysmal AF begets permanent AF. I am NOT a cardiologist but at 66 I would be wary of paying privately for ablation as the relapse rates for those in permanent AF are higher than those with PAF as that article points out. Bisoprolol wont put you into sinus rhythm but you may revert. I can give you a Rovers supporter who deals with this in Manchester he was my houseman when we were s**t and they were good in the Prem if interested or can chat if you want.

[mdd2]

Well you have his name now Beehole.

[beeholeclaret]

I was diagnosed with AF in May 2023. My GP told me there would be no chance of an ablation by the NHS in the required timescales

I was referred to a Doctor Fox at Spire in Didsbury. In October 2023 he performed a Cardioversion treatment on me, similarto ablation but non invasive.

Cost me £3000. I would not recommend the hospital . Administratively there were dire. But Doctor Fox was superb and worth every penny.

I have had no adverse symptoms since but still have to consume mountains of tablets

Good lick. I will find some phone numbers for you if it helps

Thanks for your reply and interesting to read about your experiences.

Yes please could you post any phone numbers that maybe useful.

[beeholeclaret]

Well you have his name now Beehole.

Thanks for your comments which are enlightening if not reassuring as regards progression of this condition.

When you say “I now have his name” is it the guy mentioned by Down Rover or have I missed it somewhere else on your posts?

Appreciate everbody’s contributions which are very useful.

[mdd2]

Yes it is Down_Rover's post.
As I said if you want to chat we can arrange it once both on line on here.
Looking at WL on NHS for this in my Trust.

[Down_Rover]

Thanks for your reply and interesting to read about your experiences.

Yes please could you post any phone numbers that maybe useful.

My consultant was David Fox . He actually works out of both Spire in Didsbury and the Alexandra in Cheadle. I had a different treatment several years ago at the Alex and found it to be very good.

Probably better to contact his secretary,Morgan Crossley, on 07500 927538

Email davidfoxsecretary@gmail.com or visit www.drdavidfox.co.uk

Not aware that he is a Rovers fan but he has an accent that fits

[lakesider]

After 8 episodes / hospitalisations due to suffering from paroxysmal atrial fibrillation in last 16 years the latest was most serious and rendered me unconscious for nearly 5 minutes.

Whilst NHS have been brilliant I now need to make progress by treating my condition with an ablation which offers the chance of a permanent solution as opposed to a succession of tablets and extensive tests every few years. I have received a referral list of hospitals in North West none of which provide a glowing grading / recoomendation from the Care Quality Commission. What makes matters worse is the waiting lists just for a consultation (let alone treatment) amount to almost a year in some cases.

Ive made tentative enquiries regarding the cost of private treatment and the ablation estimates on one site are between £10k and £20k which is way above the amount Im looking to pay even though it would improve my quality of life considerably. I had to miss last night's match and prospects for future are not looking too bright from my perspective.

What I am asking from you all is there anyone (or friends / relatives) who has had the ablation procedure carried out privately and if so where / who by / what was the cost.

Sorry to ambush this forum with a non football query but Ive always found the knowledge and experiences of others on here to be invaluable when needing to make decisions in the past.

Regards


BHC

Blackpool heart unit was very good for mine. I was told by them that I might have to have it done more than once but one time did the trick. Has your GP put you on blood thinners whilst you wait for surgery? There's a risk of stroke through potential blood clotting if not. I had it done around 8 years ago and have been fine since. From memory it costs around 8K so with inflation it's going to be a bit more. I went private because there was a 2 year waiting list. Going private meant I had it done within 7 days!

[Casper2]

Sorry to hear this beehole , I didn’t go private, had mine done with sedation 2 1/2 years ago and be fine since , mine was done in Oxford I only waited 4weeks so maybe it’s a postcode thing , good luck .

[beeholeclaret]

Yes it is Down_Rover's post.
As I said if you want to chat we can arrange it once both on line on here.
Looking at WL on NHS for this in my Trust.

Yes mdd2

A chat online would be useful possibly in a few days time?

I’m going to grill my GP if I can get an appointment in morning. There are a few unanswered questions at their end before I make any decisions.

What did you have in mind ? Simply arrange a mutually convenient time and post messages back and forth on here? Or arrange a chat in some other format away from UTC site?

Appreciate your help and to all the others who have come up with useful and thought provoking ideas. I’m in a better mood this evening having absorbed everyone’s supportive comments. Thanks to all.

[jjclaret]

Hi BHC,
In 2007, whilst recovered from my 3rd heart attack, it was noted that I was suffering from Tachycardia (fast heart rhythm), following further investigation I appeared to be switching between that and Bradycardia (slow heart rhythm) with pauses and stoppages, overall known as Sic Sinus Syndrome. I was fitted with a pacemaker, set at 60 Beats Per Min to prevent the Brady and prescribed Sotalol (now switched to Bisoprolol) to control the Tachy. During the following 2 years I was admitted, with very fast AF, on multiple occasions, to coronary care at RPH. During one such visit, I was sent to see Dr Waktare at Broadgreen Hospital in Liverpool and underwent a Cardiac Ablation, fully awake. All good until 2014 when during a routine pacemaker check It was noted to be in AF for 50-60% of the time. I have since, in April 2015 had a coronary artery bypass graft at Blackpool Vic. By 2019 I had worn my pacemaker out and have had a new on fitted. I am due my next pacemaker check on 11th March and I expect to see that I have been in AF 100% since my last check(12months ago).
I think I am reasonably fit, much fitter than I was at the start of this story, for 75, I watch Burnley a lot, and manage to take my 2 pooches out for 2/3 miles walk every day.

In summary I believe that the ablation worked at the time but no one knows why the AF returned. All I can say to you is that it's amazing what these guys can do and sometimes you have to trust someone and put your life in their hands.

Hope that drivel was more helpful than boring.

[beeholeclaret]

Hi BHC,
In 2007, whilst recovered from my 3rd heart attack, it was noted that I was suffering from Tachycardia (fast heart rhythm), following further investigation I appeared to be switching between that and Bradycardia (slow heart rhythm) with pauses and stoppages, overall known as Sic Sinus Syndrome. I was fitted with a pacemaker, set at 60 Beats Per Min to prevent the Brady and prescribed Sotalol (now switched to Bisoprolol) to control the Tachy. During the following 2 years I was admitted, with very fast AF, on multiple occasions, to coronary care at RPH. During one such visit, I was sent to see Dr Waktare at Broadgreen Hospital in Liverpool and underwent a Cardiac Ablation, fully awake. All good until 2014 when during a routine pacemaker check It was noted to be in AF for 50-60% of the time. I have since, in April 2015 had a coronary artery bypass graft at Blackpool Vic. By 2019 I had worn my pacemaker out and have had a new on fitted. I am due my next pacemaker check on 11th March and I expect to see that I have been in AF 100% since my last check(12months ago).
I think I am reasonably fit, much fitter than I was at the start of this story, for 75, I watch Burnley a lot, and manage to take my 2 pooches out for 2/3 miles walk every day.

In summary I believe that the ablation worked at the time but no one knows why the AF returned. All I can say to you is that it's amazing what these guys can do and sometimes you have to trust someone and put your life in their hands.

Hope that drivel was more helpful than boring.

Certainly not drivel and am sure your tale provides encouragement for other sufferers.

It’s just so worrying not knowing how these things will develop. I’ve got lots of things planned for travel in the coming years. Just hope I can make it!

Travel insurance is another issue that I would appreciate comment upon. With specific reference to pre existing conditions and how they will be viewed and associated extra costs.

[Guateclaret]

Dr Fox has a clinic at Wythenshawe which performs pulmonary vein ablations. I've been fortunate enough to have had two ablations performed there over the last five years.
All the best

https://mft.nhs.uk/wythenshawe/services ... rt-rhythm/

[TonbridgeClaret]

Hi BHC. My AF started just 4 weeks ago, and for the first few times, only when I was exercising hard. Now however, it's happening even when I'm relaxing, and the episodes are increasing. The consultant has already referred me for shocking (although I'm 68 and might be too old for the procedure), but ablation hasn't been mentioned. Has this treatment option been offered to you, or have you already had it done?

[beeholeclaret]

Hi BHC. My AF started just 4 weeks ago, and for the first few times, only when I was exercising hard. Now however, it's happening even when I'm relaxing, and the episodes are increasing. The consultant has already referred me for shocking (although I'm 68 and might be too old for the procedure), but ablation hasn't been mentioned. Has this treatment option been offered to you, or have you already had it done?

I had my first episode at age 49 and just thought I had tight chest with a cold and GO sent je to hospital where it rectified itself.

Subsequent episodes saw me treated in hospital with anti arrhythmia drugs on drip which brought bpm under control and I was discharged with tablets. I stated on meds until 3 years ago when my rate was deemed too low and my meds were phased out. The cardiologist said I may be better with ablation (Tony Blair once had it same with Alex Ferguson and they were back to work promptly).

I’ve pushed for a referral for ablation as I’ve now had 8 up of such episodes and the stress these cause for self and family is significant. Sadly the waiting list appear to be lengthy hence looking at options.

I think the ablation procedure has greater chance of success but reading comments from posters above there are varying success rates apparently. I think the age of patient comes into discussion but your GP should know this.

Good luck with your condition. Keep us updated as there are a good number of people affected by this issue.

[TonbridgeClaret]

I had my first episode at age 49 and just thought I had tight chest with a cold and GO sent je to hospital where it rectified itself.

Subsequent episodes saw me treated in hospital with anti arrhythmia drugs on drip which brought bpm under control and I was discharged with tablets. I stated on meds until 3 years ago when my rate was deemed too low and my meds were phased out. The cardiologist said I may be better with ablation (Tony Blair once had it same with Alex Ferguson and they were back to work promptly).

I’ve pushed for a referral for ablation as I’ve now had 8 up of such episodes and the stress these cause for self and family is significant. Sadly the waiting list appear to be lengthy hence looking at options.

I think the ablation procedure has greater chance of success but reading comments from posters above there are varying success rates apparently. I think the age of patient comes into discussion but your GP should know this.

Good luck with your condition. Keep us updated as there are a good number of people affected by this issue.

Thanks for this. I've been hospitalised twice already, and my most recent episode started at 8pm last night but didn't clear until 10.30 this morning (after lots of Bisoprolol). I'm hoping the shock treatment will restore things to normal, or I may be following the same path as yourself. I will follow your messages with interest! Best wishes.

[mdd2]

Yes mdd2

A chat online would be useful possibly in a few days time?

I’m going to grill my GP if I can get an appointment in morning. There are a few unanswered questions at their end before I make any decisions.

What did you have in mind ? Simply arrange a mutually convenient time and post messages back and forth on here? Or arrange a chat in some other format away from UTC site?

Appreciate your help and to all the others who have come up with useful and thought provoking ideas. I’m in a better mood this evening having absorbed everyone’s supportive comments. Thanks to all.

Hi beehole i wouldnt be wanting your full health details posted on here
If we chat we should do so over the phone. I am free pretty much most of the time at moment so I suggest we post times on here when you will be online and I will post my mobile briefly then we can agree a time to chat if that's what you want.
I see lots of people with AF so I do know what I am talking about, but I dont know what I am talking about in regard to ablation for AF except that it isnt anywhere near as successful as ablation for SVT which is what Tony Blair had and the best results for ablation in AF are in young people with normal hearts. There are only two options for AF treatment 1) rhythm control and in addition to ablation are, drugs such as flecainide and the toxic amiodarone or 2) rate control with drugs such as betablockers, digoxin, calcium channel blockers and these drugs slow down AV node conduction and reduce the fast heart rate which trouble people. There are many elderly who do not need drugs for AF, other than anticoagulants because they dont get a fast heart rate with AF. All patients with AF whether paroxysmal or persistent need assessing for stroke risk from their AF and offered treatment if at risk.

[beeholeclaret]

Mdd2 - thanks for the interesting post and I’m
Trying to build up a file of details and info before making decisions in conjunction with my medical advisers.

Yes I would like a chat if possible please just to get your take on things.

I can be on line tomorrow (Tuesday) at say 5pm if that’s any use for you to do what you suggested and then I’ll ring you if that’s ok?

Regards

BHC

[mdd2]

Ok I will be on here around 5pm post my number briefly then feel free to call

[beeholeclaret]

Thank you

[mdd2]

Be on around 5 tomorrow

[beeholeclaret]

I'm on line now mdd2 if you're around?

[mdd2]

Sorry Beehole had a domestic problem and had to go to hardware store and missed the 5pm as then had a car problem which took a time to sort to get me home and online.
Free most of tomorrow if you want to try again.

[beeholeclaret]

Sorry Beehole had a domestic problem and had to go to hardware store and missed the 5pm as then had a car problem which took a time to sort to get me home and online.
Free most of tomorrow if you want to try again.

No worries. We could try 5pm Wednesday?

[mdd2]

Ouch just missed you. Try 730 tonight if you read this in next 17 mins

[beeholeclaret]

I'm on line now mdd2 if you are able to post your details I'll give you a call.

Thanks

[mdd2]

Hope you got the number BHC

[beeholeclaret]

Cant see a number - Ive kept refreshing it and just seen your last message - do you want to try again?

[mdd2]

xxxxxxxxxx

[Casper2]

Hi BHC. My AF started just 4 weeks ago, and for the first few times, only when I was exercising hard. Now however, it's happening even when I'm relaxing, and the episodes are increasing. The consultant has already referred me for shocking (although I'm 68 and might be too old for the procedure), but ablation hasn't been mentioned. Has this treatment option been offered to you, or have you already had it done?

Sorry to see this Tonbridge hope you are ok .