REPORT: Desperate Dreadful Deepdale Disaster

[FCBurnley]

Guess I got lucky as I was on a cruise ship and unable to watch

[ClaretPete001]

I think the underlying issue is that even when changing the team the problems are still there. Foster bullied up front, Brownhill not great in a double pivot and Shelvey looking like he is physically not ready to play at this level.

Kolosheo yet again not finding a final ball

I can't put words in CTs mouth but I watched it with a sense of despondency that we have so many peripheral and otherwise players that look to be nowhere ear good enough at this level.

I guess a win tomorrow will make Saturday a distant memory.

[Clovius Boofus]

It might be an age thing, but it took me weeks to get over the Wimbledon game. A team flying high in the top division getting beaten at home, by such a low standing club was unheard of and embarrassing

I agree. The Wimbledon game was utterly embarrassing. This was back in the day when top flight and promotion chasing clubs still took the FA Cup seriously. The Sunday newspaper sport pages had a field day at our expense. The defeat was also a harbinger of darker times yet to come.

[ClaretTony]

I understand the disappointment about Saturday, and I don't think it was a good performance at all, but I think a little bit of proportion is needed.

We were playing a good Championship team, with a good home record, at their ground on a pitch which - lets put it politely - suits their energetic and physical approach.

In addition, we obviously have a higher priority (i.e. promotion) and therefore need to be at our best for the game at Cardiff, which is a long journey quickly on the heels of Saturday. We made changes that reflected that priority. Preston on the other hand have nothing to play for in the league and so can prioritise progressing n the FA cup. They fielded a basically full strength team and were giving it their full focus.

Against that context, the result (Preston winning) really can't be that much of a surprise. I'm not sure it's a disaster at all, although it may be a disappointment. We played like a team thrown together (which it was) and which also had half an eye on Tuesday night. I'd expect us to have been more competitive (although the match statistics are fairly even) but I'm not sure it's that remarkable an outcome in the ground scheme of things.

Losing at home to Lincoln with the quality of the team we had at the time was a huge disappointment and a much bigger upset. I'm really not sure they're comparable.

If there's a real concern about Saturday, it's what it revealed about the suitability of Shelvey as a back up for Cullen, and Worrall as back up for our two centre halves. They were both way off it on Saturday. There were other poor performances, too and overall the impression was that our back up players are perhaps not quite as first team ready as we would want. That's a reason to absolutely prioritise the league, as Parker did on Saturday.

That good home record you refer to has seen them win six of seventeen league games this season at Deepdale. They have beaten Luton, Watford, Coventry, Hull, Sheffield Wednesday and Middlesbrough.

No one is suggesting Lincoln wasn't a huge disappointment but at least we gave it a go that day and would in my view have not lost with a stronger referee than Graham Scott. Saturday's lack of commitment didn't even reach inept.

[Anonymous Claret]

That good home record you refer to has seen them win six of seventeen league games this season at Deepdale. They have beaten Luton, Watford, Coventry, Hull, Sheffield Wednesday and Middlesbrough.

No one is suggesting Lincoln wasn't a huge disappointment but at least we gave it a go that day and would in my view have not lost with a stronger referee than Graham Scott. Saturday's lack of commitment didn't even reach inept.

I am with Spice on this one Tony. It's all subjective how you view things. If you ignored all mitigating factors then the game on Saturday was obviously a worse performance than the Lincoln defeat.

But IMO it cannot be ignored that we put a strong team out against Lincoln, were a PL side playing a non league side at home yet created hardly anything if I recall. It certainly wasn't chance after chance as you would maybe expect against a non league side.

PNE are at the same level as us and on the 2 previous occasions with our strongest available 11 selected we still couldn't beat them. Did we really expect our 2nd eleven to compete and turn them over?

On Saturday we looked like what we were, a group of players who had. never played together.

The more I reflect I don't think Parker, the board or the players were that fussed about the game. I think that they would have taken the win if it had come easy to them but they didn't over exert themselves. Parker was probably more concerned about not picking up any injuries than trying to win the game.

[blatherwickstattoos]

Looking at pne and our wage bill and we double theirs. The players and staff should be embarrassed just like us lot.

[Casper2]

I understand the disappointment about Saturday, and I don't think it was a good performance at all, but I think a little bit of proportion is needed.

We were playing a good Championship team, with a good home record, at their ground on a pitch which - lets put it politely - suits their energetic and physical approach.

In addition, we obviously have a higher priority (i.e. promotion) and therefore need to be at our best for the game at Cardiff, which is a long journey quickly on the heels of Saturday. We made changes that reflected that priority. Preston on the other hand have nothing to play for in the league and so can prioritise progressing n the FA cup. They fielded a basically full strength team and were giving it their full focus.

Against that context, the result (Preston winning) really can't be that much of a surprise. I'm not sure it's a disaster at all, although it may be a disappointment. We played like a team thrown together (which it was) and which also had half an eye on Tuesday night. I'd expect us to have been more competitive (although the match statistics are fairly even) but I'm not sure it's that remarkable an outcome in the ground scheme of things.

Losing at home to Lincoln with the quality of the team we had at the time was a huge disappointment and a much bigger upset. I'm really not sure they're comparable.

If there's a real concern about Saturday, it's what it revealed about the suitability of Shelvey as a back up for Cullen, and Worrall as back up for our two centre halves. They were both way off it on Saturday. There were other poor performances, too and overall the impression was that our back up players are perhaps not quite as first team ready as we would want. That's a reason to absolutely prioritise the league, as Parker did on Saturday.

Where do you get good home record from ?

[claretspice]

That good home record you refer to has seen them win six of seventeen league games this season at Deepdale. They have beaten Luton, Watford, Coventry, Hull, Sheffield Wednesday and Middlesbrough.

No one is suggesting Lincoln wasn't a huge disappointment but at least we gave it a go that day and would in my view have not lost with a stronger referee than Graham Scott. Saturday's lack of commitment didn't even reach inept.

Each to their own but for me Lincoln is a debacle on a different level to Saturday. I should hope we did give it a go against Lincoln - we were playing a team from four divisions below us, and we shouldn't have needed more help from the referee to put Lincoln out of sight. We didn't in part because the manager of the time just didn't get the team up for cup ties.

Saturday for me is a completely different kettle of fish. Of our starting eleven, I think it is fair to say that only two players started (Brownhill and Esteve) who are definitely in our best eleven, and one of them is easing back from injury. Then there is Foster who is debatable but probably isn't in Parker's first choice eleven right now, and Pires who is probably our second choice left back but plays due to injury. A virtual reserve side has absolutely no god given right to beat Preston's first eleven and indeed as soon as the teams came out I think it is fair to say Preston became favourites to win the game.

The point about commitment is funny. Undoubtedly, Preston wanted it more on the day. That's the difference between a team able to give it full commitment, and one that sees the competition as of secondary importance and possibly a distraction from the season's objective the further we go. Brownhill, Pires and Esteve probably did have one eye on not getting injured and making sure they were available on Tuesday. Koleosho was feeling his way back in.

Is all that unacceptable? It's hard to swallow from a fan's perspective but it's completely rationale from the professional perspective of Parker and the players. Throw in the fact that most of the other players who started are short of game time and the result looks far less dramatic. That's why Parker was so limited in his criticism after the game. If we win tomorrow night, and go on and get promoted, no-one will ultimately remember that we lost in the 5th round of the cup. That's why I think we're in danger of getting this out of proportion, unacceptable performance though it ultimately was.

[Goliath]

Each to their own but for me Lincoln is a debacle on a different level to Saturday. I should hope we did give it a go against Lincoln - we were playing a team from four divisions below us, and we shouldn't have needed more help from the referee to put Lincoln out of sight. We didn't in part because the manager of the time just didn't get the team up for cup ties.

Saturday for me is a completely different kettle of fish. Of our starting eleven, I think it is fair to say that only two players started (Brownhill and Esteve) who are definitely in our best eleven, and one of them is easing back from injury. Then there is Foster who is debatable but probably isn't in Parker's first choice eleven right now, and Pires who is probably our second choice left back but plays due to injury. A virtual reserve side has absolutely no god given right to beat Preston's first eleven and indeed as soon as the teams came out I think it is fair to say Preston became favourites to win the game.

The point about commitment is funny. Undoubtedly, Preston wanted it more on the day. That's the difference between a team able to give it full commitment, and one that sees the competition as of secondary importance and possibly a distraction from the season's objective the further we go. Brownhill, Pires and Esteve probably did have one eye on not getting injured and making sure they were available on Tuesday. Koleosho was feeling his way back in.

Is all that unacceptable? It's hard to swallow from a fan's perspective but it's completely rationale from the professional perspective of Parker and the players. Throw in the fact that most of the other players who started are short of game time and the result looks far less dramatic. That's why Parker was so limited in his criticism after the game. If we win tomorrow night, and go on and get promoted, no-one will ultimately remember that we lost in the 5th round of the cup. That's why I think we're in danger of getting this out of proportion, unacceptable performance though it ultimately was.

Not massively relevant but I don't think the Lincoln game was anything to do with getting them up for it. We saw that with Barton.

We just had huge limitations in breaking down low block tight defences and didn't have to do it very often at that time either. It was a terrible match up really for the team we were at that point.

[RVclaret]

Completely bonkers that Saturday is even being compared to Lincoln. A PL team losing AT HOME to a team 4 divisions lower. Seriously embarrassing. Losing away to a divisional rival doesn’t come close.

[kentonclaret]

Where do you get good home record from ?

A team that had lost only one of their previous 14 home Championship matches can be considered to have a good home record. Both Burnley and Preston had won 3 and drawn 5 of their previous 8 home fixtures.
Since we failed to beat them with a full complement of first teamers we were always going to be up against it with 9 changes.

[Row x]

Completely bonkers that Saturday is even being compared to Lincoln. A PL team losing AT HOME to a team 4 divisions lower. Seriously embarrassing. Losing away to a divisional rival doesn’t come close.

Exactly...losing at home to Huddersfield was more embarrassing
As for Wimbledon.......

[ClaretTony]

Completely bonkers that Saturday is even being compared to Lincoln. A PL team losing AT HOME to a team 4 divisions lower. Seriously embarrassing. Losing away to a divisional rival doesn’t come close.

It shouldn't be - two totally different games, but one, for me, where we did all we could to win and then came Saturday.

[jrgbfc]

I don't think our attitude was the problem against Lincoln. We just weren't good enough to outfootball a team from 4 leagues below us on our own pitch. Not sure what's worse!

[ClaretTony]

I don't think our attitude was the problem against Lincoln. We just weren't good enough to outfootball a team from 4 leagues below us on our own pitch. Not sure what's worse!

That sums it up. We didn't play well enough against Lincoln - Saturday we looked totally disinterested.

[Casper2]

A team that had lost only one of their previous 14 home Championship matches can be considered to have a good home record. Both Burnley and Preston had won 3 and drawn 5 of their previous 8 home fixtures.
Since we failed to beat them with a full complement of first teamers we were always going to be up against it with 9 changes.

So you think winning 6 from 17 is a good home record, ok then I beg to differ.

[ClaretPete001]

I understand the disappointment about Saturday, and I don't think it was a good performance at all, but I think a little bit of proportion is needed.

We were playing a good Championship team, with a good home record, at their ground on a pitch which - lets put it politely - suits their energetic and physical approach.

In addition, we obviously have a higher priority (i.e. promotion) and therefore need to be at our best for the game at Cardiff, which is a long journey quickly on the heels of Saturday. We made changes that reflected that priority. Preston on the other hand have nothing to play for in the league and so can prioritise progressing n the FA cup. They fielded a basically full strength team and were giving it their full focus.

Against that context, the result (Preston winning) really can't be that much of a surprise. I'm not sure it's a disaster at all, although it may be a disappointment. We played like a team thrown together (which it was) and which also had half an eye on Tuesday night. I'd expect us to have been more competitive (although the match statistics are fairly even) but I'm not sure it's that remarkable an outcome in the ground scheme of things.

Losing at home to Lincoln with the quality of the team we had at the time was a huge disappointment and a much bigger upset. I'm really not sure they're comparable.

If there's a real concern about Saturday, it's what it revealed about the suitability of Shelvey as a back up for Cullen, and Worrall as back up for our two centre halves. They were both way off it on Saturday. There were other poor performances, too and overall the impression was that our back up players are perhaps not quite as first team ready as we would want. That's a reason to absolutely prioritise the league, as Parker did on Saturday.

I think in a way you undermine your own point. Liverpool lost to a Plymouth side we beat 5-0 a few weeks before: it happens. Lincoln was a side on the up they brought a lot of enthusiasm and fans and all I recall of the game was meh who cares really.

Bu the performance was so bad on Saturday and so many of the issues that have held the team back were in evidence as well as additional ones you cite like Worrall and Shelvey.

It felt a little ominous because as you say we have a huge squad of players quite a number of whom look not good enough or in some cases not that interested.

It just felt for the first time this season the thin ice we are skating on began to crack or at least was clear to see.

But as I say a win tomorrow and who cares.

[claretspice]

I think in a way you undermine your own point. Liverpool lost to a Plymouth side we beat 5-0 a few weeks before: it happens. Lincoln was a side on the up they brought a lot of enthusiasm and fans and all I recall of the game was meh who cares really.

Bu the performance was so bad on Saturday and so many of the issues that have held the team back were in evidence as well as additional ones you cite like Worrall and Shelvey.

It felt a little ominous because as you say we have a huge squad of players quite a number of whom look not good enough or in some cases not that interested.

It just felt for the first time this season the thin ice we are skating on began to crack or at least was clear to see.

But as I say a win tomorrow and who cares.

I think on Saturday, a team completely focused on the task in hand, who were at full strength, exploited the fact their opponents had a thrown together team and had half an eye on a bigger game on Tuesday night.

I don't think you can judge whether players are good enough generally on the strength of Saturday. It was a very makeshift team with lots of very new combinations and players who haven't played much, playing against a team that has been playing together all season. Slot one or two of those players into our first choice line up and the rest cover them more. That luxury wasn't there on Saturday and you have to give the benefit of the doubt accordingly.

If Parker made a mistake, for me it was the fact that he went with a lightweight forward line. Foster never looks comfortable wrestling with defenders when we're forced long early, and Benson and Sarmiento are also lightweight. Those three in a front four was never likely to work, with hindsight, against Preston's aggressive style and we could have done with Barnes, probably for Benson. That, plus a couple of individual performances further back which were concerning, were the big issues for me.

But keep it in proportion. Cup defeats happen, this wasn't a cup upset in any conventional sense. We were beaten by a team that wanted it more. Normally that would be an issue but in the 5th round of the cup it's just a statement of priorities. Don't overthink the performance of makeshift team with bigger fish to fry.

[dougcollins]

PNE are a fair way off being a 'good' Championship side.

try a 'below average' Championship side.

[CrosspoolClarets]

Starting to find this thread as depressing as the match.

Anyone who thinks it is acceptable to toss it off like that, if you’ll pardon the expression, I wonder what they watch football for? We aren’t owners, we don’t have a financial stake in promotion.

This was a real chance of glory. Only City left who would be truly feared. And as it turns out they were drawn away. We would have got Villa at home, pumping atmosphere, with a Wembley chance. That’s what seasons are made of. I suspect Parker was actually less interested in a QF or SF than he was the 5R, with the potential to distract in the run in. That says to me he may not be worthy of managing our club, and I would find that a real shame.

I would be equally annoyed if I were a Forest or Ipswich fan, whoever loses tonight. They have gone weak too. They are almost certain to miss out on CL and be relegated, respectively. To sack off a chance to win the Cup, that must upset their fans whoever loses.

[ClaretPete001]

I think on Saturday, a team completely focused on the task in hand, who were at full strength, exploited the fact their opponents had a thrown together team and had half an eye on a bigger game on Tuesday night.

I don't think you can judge whether players are good enough generally on the strength of Saturday. It was a very makeshift team with lots of very new combinations and players who haven't played much, playing against a team that has been playing together all season. Slot one or two of those players into our first choice line up and the rest cover them more. That luxury wasn't there on Saturday and you have to give the benefit of the doubt accordingly.

If Parker made a mistake, for me it was the fact that he went with a lightweight forward line. Foster never looks comfortable wrestling with defenders when we're forced long early, and Benson and Sarmiento are also lightweight. Those three in a front four was never likely to work, with hindsight, against Preston's aggressive style and we could have done with Barnes, probably for Benson. That, plus a couple of individual performances further back which were concerning, were the big issues for me.

But keep it in proportion. Cup defeats happen, this wasn't a cup upset in any conventional sense. We were beaten by a team that wanted it more. Normally that would be an issue but in the 5th round of the cup it's just a statement of priorities. Don't overthink the performance of makeshift team with bigger fish to fry.

I'm not over thinking it - just saying that it had an ominous feeling about it.

I can't agree the forward line was the problem. The midfield 3 of Selvey, Brownhill and Sarmiento was the problem.

But I agree, I might have Barnes instead of Sarmiento and possibly playing Laurent in a 4-4-2 with Brownhill in addition to the two wingers we may have competed a little better.

But the truth is our Eur11 million striker was bullied by a Championship side in 15th place. Our Eur4 million wonderkid still can't find any end product. Our captain can't play in a midfield 2 (despite what I say above) and our new signing looks like he has semi retired.

The problems we face were writ large over the performance even with a much changed side.

But as you say, it's just one game...!