ARTICLE: BT to screen cup tie

martin_p · Post by **martin_p** » Thu Feb 02, 2017 12:28 pm

RocketLawnChair wrote:That 2400 of them will be entering the stand to the opposite side of the ground to the other 1500. Anyway enough is enough now CT said it's been deemed safe. That'll will have to do no matter what I or anybody else thinks.

You're right, people entering a stand through different sets of turnstiles definitely makes it less safe!

TVC15 · Post by **TVC15** » Thu Feb 02, 2017 12:30 pm

Oh and btw you are exactly correct on Lincoln`s ground - it was without exception the worst viewing for away fans I have ever been to. Tucked into the corner and could not see a thing - Stafford Rangers in the cup was better than that.

I have never liked Lincoln either - they had a sizeable hooligan element (I know we did also) and there was always trouble in those away matches.

Rick_Muller · Post by **Rick_Muller** » Thu Feb 02, 2017 12:50 pm

ClaretTony wrote:Why is it not safe to do so? If the police and safety authorities say it is then it is and your personal view won't be taken into consideration.

Tony, I alluded to the fact that it may be deemed unsafe to allow both home and away fans to use the pinch point of access down the Cricket field road in the instance where we allocate the whole CFS, and if that is deemed to be the case then as others have said, forcing home supporters through the small gap by the club shop may also be deemed unsafe. It is this logic that dictates that we would only allocate the normal away section as to increase it to the 15% would potentially be deemed unsafe - and health and safety should trump ticket quantities.

Thinking outside the box, it actually makes more sense to allocate a section of the Bob Lord stand and have steward segregation in the stand with netting across seats than to force home and away fans down the side of the cricket field if we were to meet the 15% request - that way all their fans will arrive in the same area of the ground and you wouldn't have the problem of sending fans on a half-mile walk to get to the right turnstile if they got it wrong.

AGENT_CLARET · Post by **AGENT_CLARET** » Thu Feb 02, 2017 12:56 pm

"if we were to meet the 15% request"

Rules state "UP TO" 15% not 15%

wilks_bfc · Post by **wilks_bfc** » Thu Feb 02, 2017 12:56 pm

Is it possible to walk from HPW to behind the Longside by going via he old players car park and though cricket club?

mybloodisclaret · Post by **mybloodisclaret** » Thu Feb 02, 2017 12:58 pm

AGENT_CLARET wrote:"if we were to meet the 15% request"

Rules state "UP TO" 15% not 15%

This. UP TO 15%.

martin_p · Post by **martin_p** » Thu Feb 02, 2017 1:00 pm

wilks_bfc wrote:Is it possible to walk from HPW to behind the Longside by going via he old players car park and though cricket club?

I really don't see it as an issue. It's 1500 supporters. On the way in it's not really an issue as most Lincoln fans will arrive before the home fans and be in the ground. If it's deemed an issue after the match then just keep the Lincoln fans back 15 minutes and it'll be clear anyway.

MACCA · Post by **MACCA** » Thu Feb 02, 2017 1:03 pm

martin_p wrote:I really don't see it as an issue. It's 1500 supporters. On the way in it's not really an issue as most Lincoln fans will arrive before the home fans and be in the ground. If it's deemed an issue after the match then just keep the Lincoln fans back 15 minutes and it'll be clear anyway.

2 clever people, the chap in post 129 said the same, although his was slightly better explained.

S27bfc · Post by **S27bfc** » Thu Feb 02, 2017 1:03 pm

What about the 1000 season ticket holders in the cfs,all other season ticket holders can reserve their seat in cup competitions,so we may not have a choice where we can sit,will we have to wait until they go on general sale?

martin_p · Post by **martin_p** » Thu Feb 02, 2017 1:04 pm

mybloodisclaret wrote:This. UP TO 15%.

Or if you use the full quote,

'In all matches preceding the Semi-Finals, the Visiting Club shall have the right to claim up to 15% of all accommodation for which tickets are issued providing these tickets are in a fully segregated area'

The 'up to' applies to the away team request. We then have to meet that request if possible. So if Lincoln ask for 15% and we can do it, then we have to.

MACCA · Post by **MACCA** » Thu Feb 02, 2017 1:05 pm

S27bfc wrote:What about the 1000 season ticket holders in the cfs,all other season ticket holders can reserve their seat in cup competitions,so we may not have a choice where we can sit,will we have to wait until they go on general sale?

A clever chap on post 118 had a good idea about that, should there not have been notice given upon season card purchase.

wilks_bfc · Post by **wilks_bfc** » Thu Feb 02, 2017 1:06 pm

martin_p wrote:I really don't see it as an issue. It's 1500 supporters. On the way in it's not really an issue as most Lincoln fans will arrive before the home fans and be in the ground. If it's deemed an issue after the match then just keep the Lincoln fans back 15 minutes and it'll be clear anyway.

Wasn't meaning it as an issue i was just curious

I always thought there was a "gate" between but I could have imagined it

Royboyclaret · Post by **Royboyclaret** » Thu Feb 02, 2017 1:09 pm

Best of luck to Dave Baldwin to finding a solution to this because, no matter what certain posters would have you believe, there is NO easy solution. A sizeable chunk of season ticket holders are about to be inconvenienced and brassed off whichever way he decides.

The simplest solution would be to inform Lincoln that on health and safety grounds their request for more tickets is not possible and 2,400 is therefore the maximum possible. Quite frankly the overriding priority in all this is our potential progress to the latter stages of the Cup and Lincoln's disappointment pales into insignificance.

martin_p · Post by **martin_p** » Thu Feb 02, 2017 1:21 pm

Royboyclaret wrote:Best of luck to Dave Baldwin to finding a solution to this because, no matter what certain posters would have you believe, there is NO easy solution. A sizeable chunk of season ticket holders are about to be inconvenienced and brassed off whichever way he decides.

The simplest solution would be to inform Lincoln that on health and safety grounds their request for more tickets is not possible and 2,400 is therefore the maximum possible. Quite frankly the overriding priority in all this is our potential progress to the latter stages of the Cup and Lincoln's disappointment pales into insignificance.

It happens at lots of grounds for FA cup ties and it's a risk you take if you buy a season ticket next to where away supporters sit. If we get through to the next round and get drawn away at Old Trafford then presumably season ticket holders there will be inconvenienced as we'll be entitled to 10,000 tickets rather than the usual Old Trafford allocation of 3000.

Quickenthetempo · Post by **Quickenthetempo** » Thu Feb 02, 2017 1:38 pm

Royboyclaret wrote:Best of luck to Dave Baldwin to finding a solution to this because, no matter what certain posters would have you believe, there is NO easy solution. A sizeable chunk of season ticket holders are about to be inconvenienced and brassed off whichever way he decides.

The simplest solution would be to inform Lincoln that on health and safety grounds their request for more tickets is not possible and 2,400 is therefore the maximum possible. Quite frankly the overriding priority in all this is our potential progress to the latter stages of the Cup and Lincoln's disappointment pales into insignificance.

What happens if we give them 2.4k and we only get a 12k crowd on due to the early kick off and being on T.V? What a damp squid that would be for the watching millions.

Royboyclaret · Post by **Royboyclaret** » Thu Feb 02, 2017 1:38 pm

Be interesting to know how they approach the problem at Man United on the basis that it will no doubt be a regular occurence there. Moving thousands of season ticket holders to other parts of the ground can't be easy and you'd guess the sensible approach would be for them to allocate those seats next to the away support to walk-on tickets for standard league match days.

2 Bee Holed · Post by **2 Bee Holed** » Thu Feb 02, 2017 1:42 pm

All those wanting to solve this by giving them the whole of the CFS
are over simplifying this.
What is wrong with my idea of 2,400 in CFS
plus 1000 in the Bob Lord nearest to CFS?
We did this with Wrexham in Div 4.

They are all entering and exiting the ground in the same location.
Less season ticket holders to re-position/inconvenience
and approx 15 stewards in the concourse. Bob Lord
tickets sold to their season ticket holders only.

Bordeauxclaret · Post by **Bordeauxclaret** » Thu Feb 02, 2017 1:45 pm

Quickenthetempo wrote:What happens if we give them 2.4k and we only get a 12k crowd on due to the early kick off and being on T.V? What a damp squid that would be for the watching millions.

I'm sure the watching millions will be at the forefront of any decision on this.

2 Bee Holed · Post by **2 Bee Holed** » Thu Feb 02, 2017 1:48 pm

martin_p wrote:It happens at lots of grounds for FA cup ties and it's a risk you take if you buy a season ticket next to where away supporters sit. If we get through to the next round and get drawn away at Old Trafford then presumably season ticket holders there will be inconvenienced as we'll be entitled to 10,000 tickets rather than the usual Old Trafford allocation of 3000.

I assume you don't have a ST in the CFS?
We are not talking about Man Utd.
We are talking about a section of fans who have taken it upon themselves
to generate an atmosphere and to dampen down the advantage that we have for a long
time given to visiting teams with a large following.

Clarinetclaret · Post by **Clarinetclaret** » Thu Feb 02, 2017 1:54 pm

Quickenthetempo wrote:What happens if we give them 2.4k and we only get a 12k crowd on due to the early kick off and being on T.V? What a damp squid that would be for the watching millions.

Who gives a **** about the watching millions? 15% and not a ticket more.

summitclaret · Post by **summitclaret** » Thu Feb 02, 2017 1:59 pm

As several have said this is not just about this game. The last thing I want is 4000 plus away fans in the CFS, both now and if we get through and have a home tie in the next round. Ditto future seasons. That number of away fans in that stand will drown our noise. What would be happening if this game was against Rovers. The logic of what some are saying is that the home section in the CFS would be left empty, because there is no way fans would be allowed to mix on the home end accesses.

Taking everything into account the best answer is to give Lincoln the normal away section of the CFS, with the balance of their 15% in the adjacent BLS.
That way the police issues are similar to normal.

I know that several BLS ST holders will not be happy, but give them first choice on any other none ST seats in any stand and a free pie or better still double bene and hot.

martin_p · Post by **martin_p** » Thu Feb 02, 2017 2:01 pm

2 Bee Holed wrote:I assume you don't have a ST in the CFS?
We are not talking about Man Utd.
We are talking about a section of fans who have taken it upon themselves
to generate an atmosphere and to dampen down the advantage that we have for a long
time given to visiting teams with a large following.

I must've dreamt all those matches we managed to win without supporters in the CFS! I think it's great we have supporters in there, and it does improve the atmosphere, but this is Lincoln City not Man United. I think we can win anyway!

quoonbeatz · Post by **quoonbeatz** » Thu Feb 02, 2017 2:03 pm

martin_p wrote:It happens at lots of grounds for FA cup ties and it's a risk you take if you buy a season ticket next to where away supporters sit. If we get through to the next round and get drawn away at Old Trafford then presumably season ticket holders there will be inconvenienced as we'll be entitled to 10,000 tickets rather than the usual Old Trafford allocation of 3000.

those season tickets are sold with the caveat that they'll be moved.

if our have been sold with that same caveat, no problem.

martin_p · Post by **martin_p** » Thu Feb 02, 2017 2:07 pm

quoonbeatz wrote:those season tickets are sold with the caveat that they'll be moved.

if our have been sold with that same caveat, no problem.

It's in the terms and conditions of every season ticket that you may be moved and offered an equivalent ticket.

Walton · Post by **Walton** » Thu Feb 02, 2017 2:11 pm

Here's the bit from United's T&Cs

Relocation of Seats
19. The Club may from time to time relocate a Ticket Holder from their usual allocated seat to an alternative seat
within the Stadium where this is required for operational reasons (for example and without limitation, to
facilitate the refurbishment or redevelopment of certain areas of the Stadium).
20. Due to the rules, regulations and requirements of the competitions in which the Club participates, the Club
cannot guarantee that the Ticket Holder’s usual allocated seat will be available for every home cup match.
Ticket Holders in the following areas of the Stadium are at greater risk of being relocated than others: (i) East
Stand Tier 2 (as the current location for away fans in the corner between the Sir Bobby Charlton Stand and
the East Stand, may not be sufficient to accommodate the away fans’ ticket entitlement for a cup match); (ii)
Sir Bobby Charlton Stand and Sir Alex Ferguson Stand Tier 2, Blocks 3401 and 4401 (to accommodate
additional media and commercial partner requirements for UEFA competitions); (iii) the front two rows of
East Stand Lower, West Stand Lower and the Sir Alex Ferguson Stand Block N1407 (as advertising boards
used for cup matches may be larger than those used for league matches); and (iv) West Stand, Block W209
(to accommodate additional television camera positions).
21. If the Club is unable to allocate a Ticket Holder their usual seat for a particular home match, then an
alternative seat will be allocated to that Ticket Holder. If the alternative seat is in the same or a higher price
band than the Ticket Holder’s usual allocated seat then the price payable by the Ticket Holder for that seat
shall be the price that the Ticket Holder would have paid had they purchased their usual allocated seat for
the match. If the alternative seat is in a lower price band than the Ticket Holder’s usual allocated seat then
the price payable by the Ticket Holder shall be the price of that alternative seat for the match (and, in the
case of any home match in the Premier League where a Ticket Holder is allocated an alternative seat which
is in a lower price band than the Ticket Holder’s usual allocated seat, the Ticket Holder shall be entitled to
receive a refund in respect of such match which shall be equal to the difference between the price of the
Ticket Holder’s usual allocated seat for that match and the alternative seat allocated to the Ticket Holder for
that match).
22. Where it is necessary to relocate a Ticket Holder (a “Relocating Ticket Holder”) from their usual seat, then
the Club will use reasonable endeavours to ensure that the Relocating Ticket Holder is provided with an
alternative seat that is adjacent to or within reasonable proximity to any Ticket Holders whose usual seats
are adjacent to the Relocating Ticket Holder’s usual seat (“Neighbouring Ticket Holders”), provided that the
Season Tickets of the Relocating Ticket Holder and the Neighbouring Ticket Holders were purchased from
the Club as part of the same transaction or are connected by such other identifiable factor which allows the
club to link such tickets on its ticketing and membership database (for example, the same payment card is
registered for the purchase of home cup matches).

http://www.manutd.com/pix/Emails/Files/ ... -17-v3.pdf

Walton · Post by **Walton** » Thu Feb 02, 2017 2:14 pm

Here's the bit from BFC's season ticket T&Cs:

BURNLEY FOOTBALL CLUB LIMITED

SEASON TICKET

CONDITIONS OF ISSUE

1. Issue of Season Ticket

1.1 The issue of a Season Ticket and subsequent access to the Ground is subject to the Terms & Conditions of Entry found on this page

1.2 Season Tickets are for the use of supporters of the Club only. By applying for a Season Ticket and/or using the same you hereby warrant and represent that you are a supporter of the Club.

2. Admission to the Ground

2.1 By purchasing and/or accepting and/or holding a Season Ticket and/or using a Season Ticket to gain access to the Ground, you: (a) certify that you have read, understood and accepted; (b) agree to be bound by and to comply with; and (c) agree to bring to the attention of others, as required below, the Terms & Conditions of Entry.

2.2 A Season Ticket permits you to occupy at the Match the seat indicated on the Season Ticket or such other alternative seat of equivalent value as the Club may, from time to time, allocate to you at its reasonable discretion. All access to the Ground pursuant to a Season Ticket shall be for the purposes of private enjoyment of the Match only, not for any commercial purpose (and no authorisation is given or implied in respect of the carrying out of any commercial activities).

2 Bee Holed · Post by **2 Bee Holed** » Thu Feb 02, 2017 2:29 pm

martin_p wrote:I must've dreamt all those matches we managed to win without supporters in the CFS! I think it's great we have supporters in there, and it does improve the atmosphere, but this is Lincoln City not Man United. I think we can win anyway!

martin_p. I think you are right.
I suppose my concern is that if the CFS is just surrendered without thought this time,
then the next round it might just be Man Utd or City. What then?

pushpinpussy · Post by **pushpinpussy** » Thu Feb 02, 2017 4:21 pm

they have asked us for 7500 tickets. can see this happening. we aint going to sell out and its on TV

mybloodisclaret · Post by **mybloodisclaret** » Thu Feb 02, 2017 4:32 pm

pushpinpussy wrote:they have asked us for 7500 tickets. can see this happening. we aint going to sell out and its on TV

Not a chance. That's like the entire Longside. Will not be happening.

Braindead · Post by **Braindead** » Thu Feb 02, 2017 4:41 pm

Beating Lincoln or anyone else at Turf Moor has absolutely zero reflection on whether or not there are home fans only, home/away fans or away fans only in the CFS.
Give them either the minimum 2400 tickets or the entire end, if they can fill it for their cup final then kudos to them, no way will the club give them any more and rightly so, why should we?
We should easily beat them even if there were 10k screaming imps in the ground so what does it matter?

Chester Perry · Post by **Chester Perry** » Thu Feb 02, 2017 4:47 pm

Wow - I did stir up a hornets nest when posting about them requesting all those tickets - sorry about that - I was only trying to show how up for the cup they were

Given their average league attendances is around 3000 in a 9000 capacity ground you could easily argue that our normal away allocation would meet the requirements of all their season ticket holders who want to travel for the match - let the debate continue

vinrogue · Post by **vinrogue** » Thu Feb 02, 2017 5:44 pm

I think the average attendance of Lincoln City is somewhat of a red herring given the hype of the Cup is why fans want tickets. This season Imps fans are starting to return and when it is £18+ to watch them v Solihull Motors and the like, it is not a cheap outing to Sincil Bank for the fans. They had 6,500 v Dover on Friday night, supporters that think they may just get back into the Football League. Having said that I would not give them the CFS, if at a push we thought we could give them 2,400 CFS plus the BLS corner of say up to a 1,000 that were sold to their season ticket holders, happy days but remember whatever we do for this game could bite us in the bum for the quarter-final at home to Man Utd when everyman and his dog wants a Burnley ticket and United say we want the same as Lincoln got.

dibraidio · Post by **dibraidio** » Thu Feb 02, 2017 5:58 pm

dushanbe wrote:The away side can claim up to 15% provided it is in a fully segregated area. They'll get 2400 in the cricket field stand.

15% of our highest gate this season (21794) is 3269. 2397 is 11%. Just saying like.
Do we really have any choice but to give them the whole CFS?

burnmark · Post by **burnmark** » Thu Feb 02, 2017 7:02 pm

How on earth can you segregate the Bob Lord Stand? I know it's been done before for a handful of Wrexham fans but it's just not a feesible option manning it with a line of stewards in the open area below the stand.

summitclaret · Post by **summitclaret** » Thu Feb 02, 2017 7:14 pm

It must be one of the narrowest stands in the world underneath. Would take a good joiner less than an hour.

Whatever it costs would be peanuts compared to avoiding 4000 plus away fans dominating the noise.

leedsdave · Post by **leedsdave** » Thu Feb 02, 2017 9:52 pm

This thread is this board at its best.

Almost 200 posts of people debating a matter over which none of us have any control. Whatever the club decide to do with regard to away ticket numbers and where they are allocated is entirely up to them.

Jeffbfc · Post by **Jeffbfc** » Thu Feb 02, 2017 10:22 pm

leedsdave wrote:This thread is this board at its best.

Almost 200 posts of people debating a matter over which none of us have any control. Whatever the club decide to do with regard to away ticket numbers and where they are allocated is entirely up to them.

We have no control.
Shite. The subblimable messages haven't worked again.
CT sort it out.

cricketfieldclarets · Post by **cricketfieldclarets** » Thu Feb 02, 2017 10:23 pm

Its an unnecessary risk giving them the whole stand. It isn't designed as it used to be. The partitions and separate entry / exit points mean there is potential for confusion and / or worse.

Do we really expect that the stewards will be able to direct away fans to the correct entrance for those confused? Presuming the tickets wont say which approach to the stadium they need to take?

Burnley fans coming from the North and West of the town (i.e. town centre, and belverdere road) are they going to have to circumvent the whole stadium to get in the home end?

What happens if over exuberant fans try to get from one side of the CFS to the other, be it under the stand or in it. There will be no police segregation to stop them.

Then as pointed out above we have 14k home fans trying to exit through one narrow area or going 'the normal' way which will be flooded with 4,000 away fans.

The police wont let us make our own way to Ewood but they will deem 4,000 away fans split in the home end safe?

whentheballmoves · Post by **whentheballmoves** » Thu Feb 02, 2017 11:25 pm

Hopefully know in the next few days!!!

Claretmatt4 · Post by **Claretmatt4** » Fri Feb 03, 2017 8:27 am

What are Lincoln going to do if we only give them the usual allocation? Health and Safety reign Supreme in these matters and it's just not feasible to house them all in the stand anymore.

We have to sellout our tickets in the CFS at least though or else it will be pretty crap on Lincoln fans who will miss out.

Holtyclaret · Post by **Holtyclaret** » Fri Feb 03, 2017 10:39 am

joey13 wrote:I would suggest you didn't attend the Wimbledon game

No too young (1975 wasn't it?), started watching Burnley in 1980 when my Dad signed for them (I was seven). I can assure you I have seen us beaten by all sorts of types as you have.

I'd like us to put out a strong team but I'd also like to see a full Turf, particularly in front of the cameras. A real 'we're taking the FA Cup seriously', carnival atmosphere ............... and then absolutely smash them.

NottsClaret · Post by **NottsClaret** » Fri Feb 03, 2017 10:51 am

There's some right misers on here. It's Lincoln's big day too, they've battled through loads of rounds to get here, don't be so arsey about it.

I hope we can accommodate 4,000 of their fans, make a big day out of it, and it should be a good atmosphere. If we don't have enough advantage already by being at home, in the Premier League and £100m in revenue against a non-league side then it's a poor do.

If I do go to a cup game, which isn't that often, I always move stands anyway - it's interesting watching from a different view for a change.

Lord Beamish · Post by **Lord Beamish** » Fri Feb 03, 2017 10:57 am

Some sources claim that they are asking for 7000 tickets for our upcoming match, which of course they will never get. Should we risk the annoyance of our ST holders in the CFS and give them the whole end? Is that even possible with the new segregation in that end?
Would it seem parsimonious to only give them the usual 2600 when there is a real chance of spare seat capacity in the Home Ends?

The Club has some serious thinking to do about this.

http://www.lincoln.vitalfootball.co.uk/ ... 33&start=1" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

leedsdave · Post by **leedsdave** » Fri Feb 03, 2017 10:58 am

NottsClaret wrote:There's some right misers on here. It's Lincoln's big day too, they've battled through loads of rounds to get here, don't be so arsey about it.

I hope we can accommodate 4,000 of their fans, make a big day out of it, and it should be a good atmosphere. If we don't have enough advantage already by being at home, in the Premier League and £100m in revenue against a non-league side then it's a poor do.

If I do go to a cup game, which isn't that often, I always move stands anyway - it's interesting watching from a different view for a change.

Well said NottsClaret. I too usually change stands for cup games, often to a seat that I've previously had a season ticket for.

duncandisorderly · Post by **duncandisorderly** » Fri Feb 03, 2017 10:58 am

We should agree to the allocation of 7000 away fans only if they agree to switch the tie to Sincil Bank.

jdrobbo · Post by **jdrobbo** » Fri Feb 03, 2017 11:00 am

Tricky one. It would cause frustration if the Cricket Fielders were told to move, but as a Season ticket holder...should the above happen, it would probably be fair if no one had their tickets reserved and thus, had to claim them in the first day of sales.

conyoviejo · Post by **conyoviejo** » Fri Feb 03, 2017 11:05 am

Let them enjoy the day and give them the whole of the cricket field end..

claretspice · Post by **claretspice** » Fri Feb 03, 2017 11:05 am

Very tricky one.

With some hesitation, I've reached the conclusion that if we reached the next round, I wouldn't want whoever we played to get the entire CFS. But I don't think 2,600 is a big enough allocation for a cup tie either.

So - I'd give them, if it is possible, half the Bob Lord nearest the CFS. The directors box is a natural segregation, and it ought not be that difficult to segregate, temporarily, the concourses of that stand.

It isn't ideal, but if would give Lincoln a little over 3,000 tickets, which is a pretty fair allocation, allows for a cracking atmosphere and a cup occasion, and set a sensible precedent for the future.

I appreciate this may not be ideal for season ticket holders in that area, so perhaps offer them some form of discounted ticket to move.

leedsdave · Post by **leedsdave** » Fri Feb 03, 2017 11:06 am

With due respect Lord Beamish, this topic has been bashed to death on the "ARTICLE - BT to screen Cup Tie" thread.

http://www.uptheclarets.com/messageboar ... =2&t=12921" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

MarkGreen · Post by **MarkGreen** » Fri Feb 03, 2017 11:06 am

I agree that the full stand should be allocated to Lincoln fans.

This is more their day than ours! We will be seen to be doing a great thing for the smaller clubs. As for season ticket holders, they will still have their seat come the next home game!

It is possible to open up all of the stand because the segregation downstairs is just a giant door.