Ash Barnes interest...

minnieclaret · Post by **minnieclaret** » Thu May 18, 2017 12:16 am

from Newcastle and CPalace, according to ESPN.

Bin Ont Turf · Post by **Bin Ont Turf** » Thu May 18, 2017 12:26 am

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TNKbOj2B9_w" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Vegas Claret · Post by **Vegas Claret** » Thu May 18, 2017 1:15 am

85 million they can have him

benbfc · Post by **benbfc** » Thu May 18, 2017 8:36 am

His house is up for sale. Doesn't necessarily mean anything but you ever know.

IndigoLake · Post by **IndigoLake** » Thu May 18, 2017 8:39 am

I'll be like a jilted lover if he leaves us. One of my favourite Burnley players.

Sidney1st · Post by **Sidney1st** » Thu May 18, 2017 8:41 am

He's scored 14 league goals in his time with us according to Wiki.
I didn't realise it was such a low figure.

Good job he contributes in other important ways.

ClaretTony · Post by **ClaretTony** » Thu May 18, 2017 8:46 am

"sources close to the player have told ESPN FC"

That's it then - done deal

ClaretTony · Post by **ClaretTony** » Thu May 18, 2017 8:48 am

Sidney1st wrote:He's scored 14 league goals in his time with us according to Wiki.
I didn't realise it was such a low figure.

Good job he contributes in other important ways.

As it happens, the figure is correct on this one but quite often wiki figures are not.

This is accurate
http://www.uptheclarets.com/players/app ... -and-goals" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Blackrod · Post by **Blackrod** » Thu May 18, 2017 8:57 am

Barnes offers us something that other PL teams don't have. He's always going to be a good option off the bench. I for one would not like to see him go.

Goobs · Post by **Goobs** » Thu May 18, 2017 8:59 am

Out of the 3 we have he is the one I would be least bothered about losing. I like him a lot and hope he stays but we need to add a couple of better strikers and so one of the three is likely to have to leave if we do.

SonofPog · Post by **SonofPog** » Thu May 18, 2017 8:59 am

I like the player, but we need to be improving one, if not two or our strikers imho.

If we can get money for Ash, and you'll have to think it'll a little tasty, then maybe the best thing.

claptrappers_union · Post by **claptrappers_union** » Thu May 18, 2017 9:09 am

I hate it when Ashley Barnes plays.

I can forgive the tactic because it the best way to score goals and win points, but I can't do with the long ball forwards and Barnes jumping up in front of a defender and falling forwards to win a free kick.

It annoys me when Dyche moans about simulation, when that the biggest part of Ashley Barnes' employment.

uwe · Post by **uwe** » Thu May 18, 2017 9:18 am

I know what you mean but when he came on against Stoke to kill the game it was bl00dy hilarious.

PWBFC · Post by **PWBFC** » Thu May 18, 2017 9:24 am

To be fair to Barnes, his first touch is generally excellent.

Claretforever · Post by **Claretforever** » Thu May 18, 2017 9:35 am

He has a better touch then both Gray and Vokes. He's employed to cause problems for the opposition defence, leading to chances for him and those around him. He ruffles feathers and defenders hate playing against him. In fact, I wish Vokes realised his own frame size and made as much of it as Barnes does with his. Vokes sometimes plays like he's 7 stone wet through, and others not. Inconsistent with his strengths, although this isn't about Vokes.

The falling down bit sometimes annoying when we don't get it, but that's what he's there for.

If we are looking to upgrade to better, then fair enoug, but in today's marketplace he must be worth 10-15x what we paid for him initially.

ClaretTony · Post by **ClaretTony** » Thu May 18, 2017 9:38 am

claptrappers_union wrote:It annoys me when Dyche moans about simulation, when that the biggest part of Ashley Barnes' employment.

I can't recall one occasion when I've thought Barnes was guilty of simulation. There were certainly a couple of occasions on Saturday at Bournemouth when our players went down untouched, one being Vokes (not the one shown on TV when he was clearly fouled) and the other Brady.

Blackrod · Post by **Blackrod** » Thu May 18, 2017 10:32 am

Quite right that his first touch is far better than Vokes or Gray. Vokes seems to have used his frame more aggressively in the last few games ( and his game has improved) and has looked less of a lumbering giant.

HelloHiGoodbye · Post by **HelloHiGoodbye** » Thu May 18, 2017 10:39 am

ClaretTony wrote:I can't recall one occasion when I've thought Barnes was guilty of simulation.

Every game.

Right_winger · Post by **Right_winger** » Thu May 18, 2017 10:40 am

It's hard to not like Barnes and his committed style of play but one area of the squad we need upgrading is the forwards and of the 3 unfortunately Barnes is the weakest link

ClaretTony · Post by **ClaretTony** » Thu May 18, 2017 10:42 am

HelloHiGoodbye wrote:Every game.

I think you are mistaking winning free kicks, part of his job, with simulation which is diving.

claretspice · Post by **claretspice** » Thu May 18, 2017 10:59 am

ClaretTony wrote:I can't recall one occasion when I've thought Barnes was guilty of simulation. There were certainly a couple of occasions on Saturday at Bournemouth when our players went down untouched, one being Vokes (not the one shown on TV when he was clearly fouled) and the other Brady.

He's the worst Burnley player for diving and trying to win things that aren't there I've ever seen. He tries to make the most of every single contact, including those which are nowhere near enough to warrant a foul being awarded. To give one example - the last 5 minutes at Sunderland, when he went down ridiculously to try and win a penalty when there was barely any contact at all.

Good player and I'm glad we have him, but lets not be blind to his faults in this department.

KRBFC · Post by **KRBFC** » Thu May 18, 2017 11:03 am

ClaretTony wrote:I think you are mistaking winning free kicks, part of his job, with simulation which is diving.

Deceiving the referee, cheating.

Sidney1st · Post by **Sidney1st** » Thu May 18, 2017 11:05 am

Claretforever wrote:
If we are looking to upgrade to better, then fair enoug, but in today's marketplace he must be worth 10-15x what we paid for him initially.

We paid £400k I think it was, so I think £4 million is a bit of a low figure.

KefkaClaret · Post by **KefkaClaret** » Thu May 18, 2017 11:05 am

I love Barnes, he's a bit of a cheat and nasty player but he's ours so I like him. Same with Costa, he's a diving and cheating so and so but I would love him if he played for us.

KRBFC · Post by **KRBFC** » Thu May 18, 2017 11:06 am

As for Barnes, hes done fine this year but we need an awful lot better. Id like us to adopt a 1 in 1 our policy because I like the size of our squad currently. Of the 3 strikers, Id rather we lost Barnes.

UpTheBeehole · Post by **UpTheBeehole** » Thu May 18, 2017 11:06 am

Wow, had a post deleted because it pulled up Tony's post!

claretspice · Post by **claretspice** » Thu May 18, 2017 11:15 am

ClaretTony wrote:I think you are mistaking winning free kicks, part of his job, with simulation which is diving.

Disagree with that Tony. There's a distinction between ensuring you gain free kicks you are entitled to, and obtaining free kicks from contact that isn't a foul by making a meal of it. Barnes is frequently fouled and makes sure he gets his free kick, which is fine and a real strength in getting us up the pitch - its one reason he's a key player for us. But too often he strays into wining free kicks from simulation.

UpTheBeehole · Post by **UpTheBeehole** » Thu May 18, 2017 11:17 am

claretspice wrote:But too often he strays into wining free kicks from simulation.

Or losing possession because instead of challenging for a winnable ball, he flops to the floor.

claretspice · Post by **claretspice** » Thu May 18, 2017 11:19 am

UpTheBeehole wrote:Or losing possession because instead of challenging for a winnable ball, he flops to the floor.

Yep. And he's much more effective when he doesn't get dragged into that game.

Rick_Muller · Post by **Rick_Muller** » Thu May 18, 2017 11:21 am

If we're seriously considering selling Barnes, we should be in for Defoe IMO. I dont think we'll sell Barnes though

quoonbeatz · Post by **quoonbeatz** » Thu May 18, 2017 11:32 am

simulation is exaggerating contact to try and win a free kick.

barnes does it all the time.

ClaretTony · Post by **ClaretTony** » Thu May 18, 2017 11:34 am

Rick_Muller wrote:If we're seriously considering selling Barnes, we should be in for Defoe IMO. I dont think we'll sell Barnes though

I'm sure Defoe will go back to a previous club, most likely in London or possibly the Dorset coast.

Rick_Muller · Post by **Rick_Muller** » Thu May 18, 2017 11:35 am

ClaretTony wrote:I'm sure Defoe will go back to a previous club, most likely in London or possibly the Dorset coast.

I would agree Tony

EDIT - found this https://www.thesun.co.uk/sport/football ... ain-defoe/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

dsr · Post by **dsr** » Thu May 18, 2017 11:41 am

quoonbeatz wrote:simulation is exaggerating contact to try and win a free kick.

barnes does it all the time.

In the rules as they are applied now, the definition of a foul depends very significantly on whether the man falls over. You can push someone quite hard and a free kick won't be given if he stays on his feet; you can push someone very slightly and a free kick will be given if he falls over.

It's a major flaw in the way the laws are applied, but it's hard to fault someone for playing to those rules.

mkmel · Post by **mkmel** » Thu May 18, 2017 11:45 am

I would expect Mourinho to bid for Ashley Barnes

minnieclaret · Post by **minnieclaret** » Thu May 18, 2017 11:58 am

He obviously didn't see the lino flagging for a pen. when he laid on Sams first against WBA. A case where he could have stayed down.
He is a totally different player to Sam but for me we need to upgrade both.

Zesty · Post by **Zesty** » Thu May 18, 2017 11:59 am

Don't want to see Barnes or Vokes leave, very important players.

beddie · Post by **beddie** » Thu May 18, 2017 12:00 pm

"I can't recall one occasion when I've thought Barnes was guilty of simulation." That has to be the post of the year to date.

claptrappers_union · Post by **claptrappers_union** » Thu May 18, 2017 12:07 pm

It is simulation. Sean Dyche has instructed the team to play the ball towards Barnes for Barnes to win a free kick.

Barnes has a good first touch, he can control and play the ball if there is no-one near him, but as soon as he feels the defender on his back, he flops forwards onto his knees, suggesting he has been pushed. If you can't see that, you need to remove your claret tinted glasses.

jlup1980 · Post by **jlup1980** » Thu May 18, 2017 12:19 pm

Rick_Muller wrote:If we're seriously considering selling Barnes, we should be in for Defoe IMO. I dont think we'll sell Barnes though

A rumour from today's paper. I think we can safely scratch Defoe off our lists!

Jermain Defoe is being offered a staggering £18m contract by Bournemouth - despite turning 35 in five months.

Newty · Post by **Newty** » Thu May 18, 2017 12:20 pm

claptrappers_union wrote:It is simulation. Sean Dyche has instructed the team to play the ball towards Barnes for Barnes to win a free kick.

Barnes has a good first touch, he can control and play the ball if there is no-one near him, but as soon as he feels the defender on his back, he flops forwards onto his knees, suggesting he has been pushed. If you can't see that, you need to remove your claret tinted glasses.

It's not suggesting he's being pushed, he is physically being pushed and makes no attempt to stay on his feet. To the letter of the law of the game its a foul, not simulation.

Is it honest? not at all. But it's not simulation either. It's exploiting the rules as they're written and he does a damn good job of it.

quoonbeatz · Post by **quoonbeatz** » Thu May 18, 2017 1:39 pm

dsr wrote:In the rules as they are applied now, the definition of a foul depends very significantly on whether the man falls over. You can push someone quite hard and a free kick won't be given if he stays on his feet; you can push someone very slightly and a free kick will be given if he falls over.

It's a major flaw in the way the laws are applied, but it's hard to fault someone for playing to those rules.

not sure why you've quoted me here as i've not faulted him for it.

i was merely pointing out that to say he doesn't do it is completely wrong.

dsr · Post by **dsr** » Thu May 18, 2017 1:48 pm

quoonbeatz wrote:not sure why you've quoted me here as i've not faulted him for it.

i was merely pointing out that to say he doesn't do it is completely wrong.

It's just that simulation as I understand it is a pure dive without contact. I've never heard any official criticism of the idea as generally applied that a free kick can (in many cases) be defined by whether or not the foulee falls over. the "if he'd gone down it would have been a penalty" bit being the most blatant, but by no means the most frequent, example.

claretspice · Post by **claretspice** » Thu May 18, 2017 2:00 pm

dsr wrote:It's just that simulation as I understand it is a pure dive without contact. I've never heard any official criticism of the idea as generally applied that a free kick can (in many cases) be defined by whether or not the foulee falls over. the "if he'd gone down it would have been a penalty" bit being the most blatant, but by no means the most frequent, example.

Think you are wrong then. Simulation is simulating being fouled when you haven't been fouled, and the mere existence of contact does not make anything a foul.

Chester Perry · Post by **Chester Perry** » Thu May 18, 2017 2:02 pm

Next season is going to be a festival of retrospective action as the FA is voting today on using post match video on simulation - watch the big teams go nuts as their players pick up cards and bans on a weekly basis. Sean is getting his way on this one

Bin Ont Turf · Post by **Bin Ont Turf** » Thu May 18, 2017 2:05 pm

The only player that I've seen getting an opposition player sent off by just passing the ball.

dsr · Post by **dsr** » Thu May 18, 2017 2:07 pm

claretspice wrote:Think you are wrong then. Simulation is simulating being fouled when you haven't been fouled, and the mere existence of contact does not make anything a foul.

Try telling the referees that. You watch Andre Gray shielding the ball, and an opponent comes up and leans on him from behind. Does he get a free kick if he falls over? Yes. Does he get a free kick if he uses his strngth to fight for the ball? No. To get a free kick in those, and other, circumstances, you have to fall over.

Chester Perry · Post by **Chester Perry** » Thu May 18, 2017 3:06 pm

Chester Perry wrote:Next season is going to be a festival of retrospective action as the FA is voting today on using post match video on simulation - watch the big teams go nuts as their players pick up cards and bans on a weekly basis. Sean is getting his way on this one

FA have voted for it - stars next season

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/39962886" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

claretdom · Post by **claretdom** » Thu May 18, 2017 3:13 pm

"Only incidents that result in a penalty, a red card, or a yellow card that leads to a dismissal - either the first or second of two yellow cards - will be punished."

So if someone dives on the edge of the box and gains a free kick there is no punishment for the dive even if it leads to a goal. Not like the FA to do things by half measure.

KeighleyClaret · Post by **KeighleyClaret** » Thu May 18, 2017 3:50 pm

Barnes doesn't go down without a fight. Usually the Ref doesn't know who to penalise and gives nothing. But he's a real handful and incredibly difficult to play against.