Jeremy Corbyn & the IRA

[Clarets4me]

Whaooo!

Whaoo there sir!

You're not talking about Jeremy Corbyn here are you?

I hope not.

Jeremy Corbyn *could* have supported the peace process - if he had "spoken" to extremists on both sides of the argument. Did he do that? Did he buggery. There's plenty of evidence of him supporting and campaigning for the IRA and their terrorists but no evidence whatsoever that his "commitment to dialogue" extended to, for example, the UDA or the UVF.

"So what?" You might say. "At least he was encouraging dialogue and getting people to sit down and talk rather than kill each other." This is the exact line that Jeremy Corbyn's Labour party are trying to trot out now.

This is bullshit.

If Jeremy Corbyn had wanted to encourage dialogue he could have supported the SDP who wanted a united Ireland but were not the mouthpiece of a terrorist organisation. Did Jeremy Corbyn support the SDP?

I think you mean SDLP not SDP .... David Owen and Roy Jenkins weren't everyone's cup of tea, but I don't remember them campaigning for a United Ireland !!

[Rowls]

Jeremy Corbyn was involved in constructing a response to the attempted murder of Margaret Thatcher (a terrorist bombing that killed 5 innocent people) so although it cannot be directly attributed to a single person, Jeremy Corbyn shares collective credit for it:

"We refuse to parrot the ritual condemnation of ‘violence’ because we insist on placing responsibility where it lies…. Let our Iron Lady know this: those who live by the sword shall die by it. If she wants violence, then violence she will certainly get."

That's from the extreme left wing journal "Labour Briefing" which published this response to the Brighton bombing. Jeremy Corbyn served as editor (along with others) at the journal when they printed this statement.

People can make up their own minds about Jeremy Corbyn - just as long as we're not re-writing history or pretending Jeremy Corbyn did a single thing to help the peace process.

He did his best to stop it and his very best to support the IRA.

[Rowls]

I think you mean SDLP not SDP .... David Owen and Roy Jenkins weren't everyone's cup of tea, but I don't remember them campaigning for a United Ireland !!

I do indeed.

[JohnMac]

In a previous period of history he may well have been hung for treason.
He will never get my support because he isn't worthy of it.

[kentonclaret]

In a previous period of history Boris Johnson may well have been the Court Jester.

But instead we have him as Foreign Secretary.

[dermotdermot]

Corbyn apologists will find it difficult to find excuses for this but they will try. For him to suggest, as he did in said interview , that his involvement with the IRA was part of the Northern Ireland peace process is nothing short of obscene. He voted against it.

[evensteadiereddie]

I'd rather he wasn't like that but it was the only way to sort peace out, having people talk to them. If it's saved lives who gives a ????

I would rather poor kids get free school meals than any of this crap politics you want to stir.

And let's not forget the Blessed Margaret, you know, the lying cow who swore we'd never talk to terrorists. Guess what, she did, via the security services and various NI intermediaries.

Of much more relevance is Corbyn's potential appeal to the young and the 95% who are not so well off, not berks that hark back to a very dark age, thankfully, long gone.
I'm not surprised the Tories are getting nervous - other than attacking Corbyn personally, which has Lynton Crosby written all over it, you've got **** all.

[MK-Claret]

It could be worse you could have a former serving member of the Provos as your MP.

I wonder what the good people of a certain borough of South London think about their MP now.

I can't believe also she is a Tory..

[Rick_Muller]

Having dialogue with the IRA isn't exclusively attributed to JC is it...

https://www.theguardian.com/uk/1999/oct ... d.thatcher" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-16366413" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/2601875.stm" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/th ... 07416.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

But why dont we just crucify Jeremy Corbyn anyway, at least the initials fit...

as a footnote, this is interesting...

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/po ... 26723.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

and perhaps this too...

http://evolvepolitics.com/realise-curre ... ira-right/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

But no, lets just crucify JC for having dialogue instead of war, that makes much more sense.

[morpheus2]

Having dialogue with the IRA isn't exclusively attributed to JC is it...

https://www.theguardian.com/uk/1999/oct ... d.thatcher" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-16366413" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/2601875.stm" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/th ... 07416.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

But why dont we just crucify Jeremy Corbyn anyway, at least the initials fit...

as a footnote, this is interesting...

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/po ... 26723.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

and perhaps this too...

http://evolvepolitics.com/realise-curre ... ira-right/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

But no, lets just crucify JC for having dialogue instead of war, that makes much more sense.

I believe that the suggestion here is that JC was in favour of continued war rather than dialogue as he is (allegedly) supporting the IRA's military wing in their campaign of terror.

[AndrewJB]

http://www.middleeasteye.net/columns/co ... 2036528122" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

The correct link.

The mudslinging at Corbyn is a desperate attempt to paper over the fact the Tories want a bigger majority so they can shaft ordinary people even more. There is nothing in their manifesto about when austerity might end, or introducing positive change. It's all about ordinary working people paying more in school lunch fees, elderly care fees, and higher taxes - and the only promise in their manifesto around tax is that it will continue to go down for corporations.

If you want to consider real traitorous behaviour, what about Theresa May's relaxedness about foreign governments controlling our railways and utilities? She's happy for the Chinese and French to build and run our nuclear power. She voted for the Iraq War, in which hundreds of British soldiers lost their lives (pointlessly), and helped in the establishment of ISIS. And yet we have Tory forelock tuggers such as Rowls attempting to twist facts from thirty years ago to paint Corbyn as somehow disloyal to the UK.

Let's look at the facts dispassionately. Apart from repeating 'strong and stable' and attacking Jeremy Corbyn's character; what have the Tories offered the country in this election?

[Rowls]

And let's not forget the Blessed Margaret

Heaven forbid that Margaret not make an appearance on a Jeremy Corbyn thread.

I was beginning to worry she might not appear.

Thank you for appeasing the Gods of the Internet eddie.

[Sidney1st]

http://www.middleeasteye.net/columns/co ... 2036528122

The correct link.

The mudslinging at Corbyn is a desperate attempt to paper over the fact the Tories want a bigger majority so they can shaft ordinary people even more. There is nothing in their manifesto about when austerity might end, or introducing positive change. It's all about ordinary working people paying more in school lunch fees, elderly care fees, and higher taxes - and the only promise in their manifesto around tax is that it will continue to go down for corporations.

If you want to consider real traitorous behaviour, what about Theresa May's relaxedness about foreign governments controlling our railways and utilities? She's happy for the Chinese and French to build and run our nuclear power. She voted for the Iraq War, in which hundreds of British soldiers lost their lives (pointlessly), and helped in the establishment of ISIS. And yet we have Tory forelock tuggers such as Rowls attempting to twist facts from thirty years ago to paint Corbyn as somehow disloyal to the UK.

Let's look at the facts dispassionately. Apart from repeating 'strong and stable' and attacking Jeremy Corbyn's character; what have the Tories offered the country in this election?

You do know that E'on took over a Powergen in 2002 don't you?
That was during Labour's rule incase you're not sure and E'on certainly isn't British.

[Quickenthetempo]

Rowls-If I was 21 I might of got all chest beating patriotic against Corbyn like The Tories got England for the Falklands War, but as you get older you realise people only do things for an agenda.

Are you really feeling the heat and expect Labour to give you a run for your money? It seems that's the only purpose of your post.

[dsr]

What is wrong, in principle, with saying that people should pay to feed their own children?

[Dom]

He wanted a United Ireland under Irish rule and approved of the IRA's method of getting it. It's pure spin to dress it any other way, I don't think that too much should be made of it now as things have moved on.
If McGuinness can shake the Queen of Britain's hand, on multiple occasions, then although things shouldn't be forgotten, we perhaps shouldn't get too hung up on peoples distant pasts.

The IRA were terrorists and their atrocities should never be buried, but Corbyn himself wasn't a terrorist, McGuinness and Adams were and have gone on to become high level politicians - perspective.

[Rowls]

Rowls-If I was 21 I might of got all chest beating patriotic against Corbyn like The Tories got England for the Falklands War, but as you get older you realise people only do things for an agenda.
Are you really feeling the heat and expect Labour to give you a run for your money? It seems that's the only purpose of your post.

Hahahahahahaha

This stuff is so real and so damaging to Jeremy Corbyn that the Conservatives don't even need to talk about it. They're just leaving it to the newspapers.

The stuff I've posted about Corbyn is undeniable. He is up to his neck in it with the IRA.

The point here is, what drove him into the murderous hands of anti-Brit terrorists? You can all decide for yourselves what drove a north London MP to invite terrorists into the British Houses of Parliament mere months after they had attempted to murder half of the UK government.

But the facts speak for themselves.

[Quickenthetempo]

What is wrong, in principle, with saying that people should pay to feed their own children?

Nothing if it's aimed at the parents but it's the children we need to stick up for.

Some only get one decent meal a day at school as the family can't afford much or have other priorities. It's not the childs fault. The amount of schools that have breakfast clubs to allow kids food in the morning at the schools expense is growing rapidly.

Any MP who slashes anything like this and claims expenses for lavish lifestyle wants stringing up.

[Sidney1st]

Nothing if it's aimed at the parents but it's the children we need to stick up for.

Some only get one decent meal a day at school as the family can't afford much or have other priorities. It's not the childs fault. The amount of schools that have breakfast clubs to allow kids food in the morning at the schools expense is growing rapidly.

Any MP who slashes anything like this and claims expenses for lavish lifestyle wants stringing up.

There shouldn't be anything more important that feeding your kids.

[Quickenthetempo]

Hahahahahahaha

This stuff is so real and so damaging to Jeremy Corbyn that the Conservatives don't even need to talk about it. They're just leaving it to the newspapers.

The stuff I've posted about Corbyn is undeniable. He is up to his neck in it with the IRA.

The point here is, what drove him into the murderous hands of anti-Brit terrorists? You can all decide for yourselves what drove a north London MP invite terrorists into the British Houses of Parliament mere months after they had attempted to murder half of the UK government.

But the facts speak for themselves.

He has always been anti establishment but the people will vote for him on his policies of 2017. If he has done anything wrong legally tell the police about it.

[dsr]

Nothing if it's aimed at the parents but it's the children we need to stick up for.

Some only get one decent meal a day at school as the family can't afford much or have other priorities. It's not the childs fault. The amount of schools that have breakfast clubs to allow kids food in the morning at the schools expense is growing rapidly.

Any MP who slashes anything like this and claims expenses for lavish lifestyle wants stringing up.

Quite apart from the "other priorities" nonsense that Sidney has highlighted, presumably you approve of the idea of free breakfasts for all?

You are aware, incidentally, that free school meals for infant children of the poor will continue as they always used to, and as they still do for juniors?

[Rowls]

Thanks for the advice Quickenthetempo

And if Jeremy Corbyn has done anything I think people will want to know before considering who else they want to vote for, I'll post it here.

Ta.

[dsr]

He has always been anti establishment but the people will vote for him on his policies of 2017. If he has done anything wrong legally tell the police about it.

Carrying "anti-estbalishment" to the level that involves killing the PM, or supporting those that try, is more anti-establishment than most of us would support.

[Quickenthetempo]

There shouldn't be anything more important that feeding your kids.

I agree but it's not an ideal world.

Talk to some teachers about what state some children turn up for school in, it will open your eyes.

A school has a budget of 37-50p a school meal, let that sink in.

[Quickenthetempo]

Thanks for the advice Quickenthetempo

And if Jeremy Corbyn has done anything I think people will want to know before considering who else they want to vote for, I'll post it here.

Ta.

That's fine but from someone who was really thinking about voting Tory for the better Brexit deal, propaganda from the likes of you and the papers has swung me back to Labour. Like quite a few others.

But you carry on, I'm sure you might get a few to vote the way you want.

[Lancasterclaret]

I seriously would question the mental well being of anyone who changed their vote based on what is posted on here!

By all means use it as a guide, but hells bells, can you imagine going "Yeah, that Rowls talks a lot of sense, I'm going to vote Conservative"!

[Sidney1st]

I agree but it's not an ideal world.

Talk to some teachers about what state some children turn up for school in, it will open your eyes.

A school has a budget of 37-50p a school meal, let that sink in.

I've seen what happens.

In an ideal world the school would take notes of who they've got to feed if it's due to the condition of the kid and let Social Services know.
If possibly doesn't happen though which is a shame.

[aggi]

This stuff is so real and so damaging to Jeremy Corbyn that the Conservatives don't even need to talk about it. They're just leaving it to the newspapers.

This is definitely my favourite quote from all of the election discussion on here.

[Rowls]

That's fine but from someone who was really thinking about voting Tory for the better Brexit deal, propaganda from the likes of you and the papers has swung me back to Labour. Like quite a few others.

But you carry on, I'm sure you might get a few to vote the way you want.

You were going to vote Conservative until somebody told you a good reason not to vote for Jeremy Corbyn.

Classic.

Vote for who you like folks. But think long and hard about Jeremy Corbyn's record before you decide whether to abstain or change your vote.

[Lancasterclaret]

On the plus side, you won't have to think long and hard about voting for May.

Every day a U-turn, every day a new policy, every day she meets nobody who isn't hand picked, every day she looks more and more out of her depth

[Spijed]

You were going to vote Conservative until somebody told you a good reason not to vote for Jeremy Corbyn.

Classic.

Vote for who you like folks. But think long and hard about Jeremy Corbyn's record before you decide whether to abstain or change your vote.

Likewise, think long and hard about voting for Teresa May when it comes to Brexit negotiations, someone who has now made a complete U-Turn in the manifesto.

How will that be perceived by the other 27 European countries?

[UpTheBeehole]

Bit rich the Tories spreading these constant untruths about Corbyn when they have an actual Provisional IRA member in their ranks, and there's pictorial evidence of May meeting one of these IRA 'terrorists'

[Rowls]

Likewise, think long and hard about voting for Teresa May when it comes to Brexit negotiations, someone who has now made a complete U-Turn in the manifesto.
How will that be perceived by the other 27 European countries?

It's not a "complete u-turn" now is it? It's added an additional element onto the policy as it was previously announced.

Previously - New guaranteed minimum heritable estate of £100K for those with assets above this figure.
New - As above. A guarantee that didn't exist before except now also with an as yet unspecified cap on costs for social care.

I'm very happy for this election to be a proxy referendum on who sits down to negotiate Brexit.

Do we want boring, studious, stern Theresa May?

Or do we want the useless, incompetent anti-British Jeremy Corbyn?

It's a woman renowned for her mastery of her political brief (the longest serving Home Secretary of modern times, who is famed in Westminster for her organisation and sheer dullness) or it's a man who spends his time eating veggie sandwiches and endlessly protesting against "the establishment".

Your choice folks!

[Lancasterclaret]

Ah, anti-British

"STOP TALKING BRITAIN DOWN"

[Rowls]

Lancaster,

What do you think made Corbyn support the IRA? What made him a proud supporter of the "Troops Out" movement?

Does Marxism dictate that the Ulster province should be handed over to Republicans?

There's a theme to Jeremy Corbyn's political choices - he doesn't like Britain.

[UpTheBeehole]

Well, he's a pacifist isn't he, so if there's a foreign army occupying territory, then he'll want that occupying force to pull out and leave the country.

[martin_p]

It's not a "complete u-turn" now is it? It's added an additional element onto the policy as it was previously announced.

Previously - New guaranteed minimum heritable estate of £100K for those with assets above this figure.
New - As above. A guarantee that didn't exist before except now also with an as yet unspecified cap on costs for social care.

Unspecified equals uncosted, who's going to pay for this? And this 'additional element' was explicitly discounted by Jeremy Hunt when questioned by Nick Robinson last week.

[Rowls]

British troops stationed at home in the UK is a funny definition of "foreign" though isn't it?

And supporting a terrorist organisation as they wage war and murder people is a funny thing for a "pacifist" to do, no?

[Rowls]

Unspecified equals uncosted, who's going to pay for this? And this 'additional element' was explicitly discounted by Jeremy Hunt when questioned by Nick Robinson last week.

Quite true.

People have their choice.

Theresa or Jeremy?

Pick your side.

[Lancasterclaret]

Rowls, this is all flannel.

People want a country that works for everyone. I'm not going to be voting for JC, but compared to the utter contempt for democracy that the Conservatives are showing he's my prefered choice for PM.

I never thought I'd type that, so it shows just how much they have messed up.

[Spijed]

British troops stationed at home in the UK is a funny definition of "foreign" though isn't it?

And supporting a terrorist organisation as they wage war and murder people is a funny thing for a "pacifist" to do, no?

Rowls, out of interest, how would it have been possible to get the IRA to lay down their arms without giving some former members immunity from prosecution?

[dsr]

Well, he's a pacifist isn't he, so if there's a foreign army occupying territory, then he'll want that occupying force to pull out and leave the country.

That's a valid argument for Plaid Cymru to insist that the Angles, Saxons, Vikings, and remnants of the Romans pull out of England and leave it for the ancient Britons of Wales. Not a very good one, though. An "immigrants go home" policy is not one that he's likely to try and enforce. Even the SNP didn't try that one.

Basically, Britain's inhabitants are a very mongrel lot. Trying to sort out who should leave different bits of these islands because their immigration was too recent, is like trying to plait sawdust - it can't be done. The only viable policy is to let the citzens of each bit of these islands remain where they are, and let the majority decide.

[Rick_Muller]

Quite true.

People have their choice.

Theresa or Jeremy?

Pick your side.

I've picked Jeremy, and you've reinforced my belief that it is a good choice. Keep digging your hole...

[martin_p]

a man who spends his time eating veggie sandwiches and endlessly protesting against "the establishment".

Just imagine if Theresa May was vegetarian. As soon as she became PM she'd have seen stats showing that the majority of brits like their meat and then appeared on TV chewing on raw cow within the day! (No doubt claiming this was just a clarification of her eating habits).

[Lancasterclaret]

Whether you like Corybn or not, the changes of policy everytime some of their core support moans doesn't suggest strong and stable at all.

Quite simply, I'm now firmly of the opinion that everything is potential on the table for changing IF sufficient people who vote Conservative moan about it.

Now let that sink in for a minute.

And Brexiteers, think about it and thank god that all the big businesses are on the side of labour.......oh

[kentonclaret]

Boris Johnson over the weekend compared some politicians to blancmanges.

Well, Theresa May is certainly having a good old wobble.

[CrosspoolClarets]

I suspect that JC views people as more important than countries, and his sense of being British is minimal.

That would appeal to a lot of people in a John Lennon kind of way.

I suspect that is why he thinks of himself as a peacemaker and can seem pro IRA and pro Palestine at times.

If so, that doesn't make him a bad gentleman. Just totally unsuitable to lead the country.

My view is people should lead the country as they would lead their own family. Have consideration for others outside that family, don't condone maltreatment, greed or bullying. But push to improve the lot of one's family at all times, often at the expense of people outside it. Is Corbyn that loyal to Britain or the people he would represent? Would he be happy to make British folk richer but other folk poorer? I suspect not.

[kentonclaret]

Another Daily Mail headline leads to another anti Corbyn thread.

[UpTheBeehole]

It is ridiculous that dangerous lies can be posted as thread titles on this messageboard, unabated

[Rowls]

Rowls, out of interest, how would it have been possible to get the IRA to lay down their arms without giving some former members immunity from prosecution?

Spijed, this is entirely different from the question of Jeremy Corbyn's active support of the IRA during the terror campaign against the UK.

I'm sure you'll agree with that.

But I don't know if you think I'm labouring under any Corbyn-sized illusions here? I'm "happy" to agree that it probably would not have been possible to achieve peace without letting them off for their campaign of murder. I'm willing to accept that uncomfortable truth.

However, Jeremy Corbyn is unwilling to condemn the IRA - this is the point of the thread.