England Squad Announcement

Milltown1882 · Post by **Milltown1882** » Thu Nov 02, 2017 10:26 am

Squad for the two forthcoming friendlies is out at 2 this afternoon.

How many Clarets are we going for in the squad? Could make a case for Pope, Mee, Tark and Cork being involved. No doubt Southgate will probably swerve all of them for some more entertaining names like Wilshere etc.

Tall Paul · Post by **Tall Paul** » Thu Nov 02, 2017 10:28 am

ClaretTony · Post by **ClaretTony** » Thu Nov 02, 2017 10:41 am

Milltown1882 wrote:Could make a case for Pope, Mee, Tark and Cork being involved. No doubt Southgate will probably swerve all of them for some more entertaining names like Wilshere etc.

Really? I can't imagine Tall Paul is far wrong with his suggestion of zero, in fact I'm sure he'll be absolutely spot on.

Haven't it already been confirmed that Wilshire won't be included?

RocketLawnChair · Post by **RocketLawnChair** » Thu Nov 02, 2017 10:44 am

None, and Jack Willshire who had a below average season at Bournemouth and a couple of OK Carebo Cup games since he got back to Arsenal will be...

JamesSherbourne · Post by **JamesSherbourne** » Thu Nov 02, 2017 10:48 am

As selfish as it sounds, the less Clarets involved the better. A fully fit Squad for Swansea is more important

duncandisorderly · Post by **duncandisorderly** » Thu Nov 02, 2017 10:51 am

Pope has conceded a quarter of the goals Pickford, Hart and Butland have and half as many as Forster and Foster.

I'm not saying Pope should be called up, but by the same token none of the above should either.

ClaretTony · Post by **ClaretTony** » Thu Nov 02, 2017 10:55 am

duncandisorderly wrote:Pope has conceded a quarter of the goals Pickford, Hart and Butland have and half as many as Forster and Foster.

I'm not saying Pope should be called up, but by the same token none of the above should either.

Pickford, Hart & Butland are exactly the three goalkeepers who should be selected. They are the best three England have available.

duncandisorderly · Post by **duncandisorderly** » Thu Nov 02, 2017 10:59 am

According to Fantasy Premier League, Forster and Pope are. I know it's not gospel, but it's impartial and fair across all the players for each position.

tybfc · Post by **tybfc** » Thu Nov 02, 2017 11:00 am

If Joe Hart had ten brothers it would be a doddle for the commentator.

Hart plays it out to Hart across to Hart back to the keeper Hart out to Hart on the wing who loses possession and you get the picture.

I can't see any of our lot getting a shout because Southgate is clueless for start and is probably on his way to the press conference now having just left Spurs training ground.

ClaretTony · Post by **ClaretTony** » Thu Nov 02, 2017 11:04 am

duncandisorderly wrote:According to Fantasy Premier League, Forster and Pope are. I know it's not gospel, but it's impartial and fair across all the players for each position.

I think the word Fantasy explains that

SalisburyClaret · Post by **SalisburyClaret** » Thu Nov 02, 2017 11:14 am

Pickford has been poor this season (and looks like he's put on weight), Butland has been inconsistent and Hart has been shocking. Forster has improved markedly so far this season and deserves a place.

So expect Hart, Butland and Pickford

Selby Claret · Post by **Selby Claret** » Thu Nov 02, 2017 11:14 am

ClaretTony wrote:Pickford, Hart & Butland are exactly the three goalkeepers who should be selected. They are the best three England have available.

I don't understand the fascination with Pickford. First season in Prem his team end up in the bottom three. Second season in Prem his team are in the bottom three. Of course, that may be coincidence

Hart and Butland have CVs to back up their inclusion but, for me, if you're taking a third GK as back up then at least take someone on form, that's full of confidence and optimism, and is not conceding many goals. Or at least two of those three!

Sutton-Claret · Post by **Sutton-Claret** » Thu Nov 02, 2017 11:23 am

Selby Claret wrote:I don't understand the fascination with Pickford. First season in Prem his team end up in the bottom three. Second season in Prem his team are in the bottom three. Of course, that may be coincidence

Hart and Butland have CVs to back up their inclusion but, for me, if you're taking a third GK as back up then at least take someone on form, that's full of confidence and optimism, and is not conceding many goals. Or at least two of those three!

Pickford cost £30m - he HAS to be selected. Southgate can't select a keeper who only cost £1m - what would the media say ?

Bordeauxclaret · Post by **Bordeauxclaret** » Thu Nov 02, 2017 11:26 am

Pickford looks a very good keeper to me, as does Butland.

Whilst Pope has looked good for us he’s still hardly played any games at this level so he’s not going to be anywhere near consideration for England and rightly so.

duncandisorderly · Post by **duncandisorderly** » Thu Nov 02, 2017 11:28 am

ClaretTony wrote:I think the word Fantasy explains that

Why be like that?

All I'm saying is that FPL awards points indiscriminately based on performances. It doesn't offer opinions or judgements.

Pope has made more saves, more catches, second most clean sheets, and let in the fewest goals by quite a margin.

ClaretTony · Post by **ClaretTony** » Thu Nov 02, 2017 11:36 am

SalisburyClaret wrote:Pickford has been poor this season (and looks like he's put on weight), Butland has been inconsistent and Hart has been shocking. Forster has improved markedly so far this season and deserves a place.

So expect Hart, Butland and Pickford

Pickford is currently getting very good reviews with Everton, I rate Butland the best of the lot and Hart was superb for West Ham last week.

Dyched · Post by **Dyched** » Thu Nov 02, 2017 11:38 am

Why would England pick Burnley players. It's the same moaners on all England threads who complain about the way England play with the ball. Yet want Burnley players who when have the ball don't look the most comfortable with it.

Pickford was relegated last year correct
Do we ignore Heaton was relegated with Bristol City??
Or that Mee, Trippier, Heaton(opps again) Cork have been relegated?? Oh pope was at Charlton

Lancasterclaret · Post by **Lancasterclaret** » Thu Nov 02, 2017 11:44 am

I don't think any of our lot will get in, but the one who should be getting in is Jack Cork

Quickenthetempo · Post by **Quickenthetempo** » Thu Nov 02, 2017 11:53 am

I don't think Butland has kicked on as much as we all hoped to be honest, I know he had the long injury but I still expected him to be a bit further on by now.
Forster was superb for a little while but up and down since the injury.
Pickford is good and should get better if his confidence doesn't go with all the pressure at Everton.

It would be good to see Pope get in the squad as Heaton improved dramatically for going away with England and training with the best.

Dublin7Claret · Post by **Dublin7Claret** » Thu Nov 02, 2017 12:03 pm

I thought Pickford was Everton's best player when they got stuffed (and let in 5!) against Arsenal t'other week

quoonbeatz · Post by **quoonbeatz** » Thu Nov 02, 2017 12:10 pm

whilst he's playing well in terms of general goalkeeping, i actually think pickford is big part of everton's problem's this season.

he's not experienced or commanding enough, the way heaton is for example. he doesn't marshal his defence well.

Rileybobs · Post by **Rileybobs** » Thu Nov 02, 2017 12:27 pm

You'd have to be a little bit mental in the head to seriously think that Pope should be considered for an England call up.

Edit - as Lancs says, Cork would be our closest shout considering England's dearth of midfield talent. Tarka will get a call up at some point in the near future but England are relatively strong in that position.

piston broke · Post by **piston broke** » Thu Nov 02, 2017 12:34 pm

Nick Pope rarely has to make an exceptional save. Most are shots from the edge of the box, that go down that narrow channel and straight at him.
There is a good goalie in him but he needs much longer to prove it to outsiders.

BleedingClaret · Post by **BleedingClaret** » Thu Nov 02, 2017 12:41 pm

Honestly though with the feeling around the England team these days are we bothered?

dsr · Post by **dsr** » Thu Nov 02, 2017 12:43 pm

Southampton fans generally think the only reason not to drop Forster is because his replacement is even worse. Heaton is injured. But that still leaves Butler, Hart, Pickford, and Foster as England qualified goalkeepers who will be in the squad long before Pope.

Cork's the only one of our men who has a chance of being picked, and considering the weakness of England's midfield I think he should be; but I bet he isn't.

NRC · Post by **NRC** » Thu Nov 02, 2017 12:50 pm

According to sky, purely on statistics, Pope and Mee should be in the starting 11

bobinho · Post by **bobinho** » Thu Nov 02, 2017 12:57 pm

Quickenthetempo wrote:
It would be good to see Pope get in the squad as Heaton improved dramatically for going away with England and training with the best.

No he didn’t.

Lancasterclaret · Post by **Lancasterclaret** » Thu Nov 02, 2017 12:59 pm

Apparently Abraham is in, so anyone could be.

jlup1980 · Post by **jlup1980** » Thu Nov 02, 2017 1:09 pm

I was talking to a colleague earlier about the England squad and how Southgate should be using these friendlies to take a look at three or four new faces; if only in training. It's all well and good choosing the same squad month after month but that doesn't allow for potential injuries before the World Cup.

We know there's a core of 17 or 18 who will be picked but those peripheral players (Livermore, Sturridge, Maguire, Cresswell, Vardy, Defoe etc) could easily be left out in favour of players like Mee, Tarky or Cork from our perspective, and / or Tommy Smith, Lewis Dunk etc from other squads.

For what it's worth I don't expect to see any Burnley players in the squad today and that says everything about the confidence I have in Gareth Southgate. We're 7th in the PL and it's built on an English foundation. If the three I mentioned above, and Pope to a lesser degree, aren't worth a look then they might as well give up on every getting a cap. We'll never be higher than we are now!!

jlup1980 · Post by **jlup1980** » Thu Nov 02, 2017 1:09 pm

Lancasterclaret wrote:Apparently Abraham is in, so anyone could be.

He'll be in due to his Chelsea connection, just as Chalobah magically appeared in the squad after playing a couple of games for Watford.

Milltown1882 · Post by **Milltown1882** » Thu Nov 02, 2017 1:12 pm

Abraham, Gomez and Loftus-Cheek all left out of the Under 21s so will probably be included

Quickenthetempo · Post by **Quickenthetempo** » Thu Nov 02, 2017 1:18 pm

bobinho wrote:No he didn’t.

Yes he did

Lancasterclaret · Post by **Lancasterclaret** » Thu Nov 02, 2017 1:19 pm

Actually that makes a lot of sense, at least they are bringing players through the U21s.

Bacchus · Post by **Bacchus** » Thu Nov 02, 2017 1:33 pm

They've announced 3 new faces so safe to assume no Burnley players. There's an argument for Cork, but as good a season as he's having with us he's limited in style and it's difficult to make a strong case that he's better than Henderson / Dier / Winks or any of the other options available as holding midfielders. Tarkowski probably needs a few more games under his belt at this level, especially since he doesn't have the advantage of having come through the England youth teams.

jlup1980 · Post by **jlup1980** » Thu Nov 02, 2017 1:44 pm

Bacchus wrote:They've announced 3 new faces so safe to assume no Burnley players. There's an argument for Cork, but as good a season as he's having with us he's limited in style and it's difficult to make a strong case that he's better than Henderson / Dier / Winks or any of the other options available as holding midfielders. Tarkowski probably needs a few more games under his belt at this level, especially since he doesn't have the advantage of having come through the England youth teams.

The comparison is Livermore in my opinion and I'd say Cork is playing better than him at the moment!

Milltown1882 · Post by **Milltown1882** » Thu Nov 02, 2017 2:00 pm

And the square root of 0 players in the squad confirmed

ClaretTony · Post by **ClaretTony** » Thu Nov 02, 2017 2:01 pm

Milltown1882 wrote:And the square root of 0 players in the squad confirmed

Which is exactly what we should be expecting

ClaretTony · Post by **ClaretTony** » Thu Nov 02, 2017 2:02 pm

Here's the squad

Tall Paul · Post by **Tall Paul** » Thu Nov 02, 2017 2:06 pm

Milltown1882 wrote:And the square root of 0 players in the squad confirmed

So this thread could (and probably should) have ended after post #2.

mdd2 · Post by **mdd2** » Thu Nov 02, 2017 2:09 pm

Michael Keane still injured or out of favour?

ClaretTony · Post by **ClaretTony** » Thu Nov 02, 2017 2:09 pm

On the subject of Wilshere, Southgate said: ""I don’t know how you get in an England squad if you’re not in the Arsenal team.”

MarkGreen · Post by **MarkGreen** » Thu Nov 02, 2017 2:15 pm

mdd2 wrote:Michael Keane still injured or out of favour?

He was led in a hospital bed at the weekend watching the Leicester game so suspect he is injured still.

Milltown1882 · Post by **Milltown1882** » Thu Nov 02, 2017 2:15 pm

Tall Paul wrote:So this thread could (and probably should) have ended after post #2.

Sorry I'll be sure to run conversation topics past you first next time.

claretrobo1 · Post by **claretrobo1** » Thu Nov 02, 2017 2:17 pm

How Gomez and Loftus-Cheek have got in is ridiculous. Abraham I can partly understand.

Edit: Lingard should be nowhere near as well. Wouldn't want him in our squad. Overrated imo

Bin Ont Turf · Post by **Bin Ont Turf** » Thu Nov 02, 2017 2:18 pm

Joe Gomez?

FactualFrank · Post by **FactualFrank** » Thu Nov 02, 2017 2:19 pm

claretrobo1 wrote:How Gomez and Loftus-Cheek have got in is ridiculous. Abraham I can partly understand.

I was thinking the same. Abraham I think will be interesting to see more of as he's shown he knows where the goal is. Every time I've seen Loftus-Cheek he's looked extremely 'meh'.

SalisburyClaret · Post by **SalisburyClaret** » Thu Nov 02, 2017 2:20 pm

There's at least 10 in that squad that wouldn't get in our team at present

MACCA · Post by **MACCA** » Thu Nov 02, 2017 2:20 pm

I don't get the squad selection at all, what's the approach?

Looking to the future?
Picking on form?
Giving experience to future first teamers?
Hoping to find/trying a new formations/systems?

There's nothing in there that gives you any clue to Southgate thinking.
Looks like he is almost being told who to pick, makes no sense to me that squad, but then again I'm not the England manager.

tybfc · Post by **tybfc** » Thu Nov 02, 2017 2:22 pm

The rest of the world must be worried to death at the sight of that squad.

FactualFrank · Post by **FactualFrank** » Thu Nov 02, 2017 2:23 pm

Probably a bit of all that, MACCA. I'd be worried if that was close to our World Cup squad though, which I envisage it will be.