Europa League Seedings

ClaretTony · Post by **ClaretTony** » Tue May 15, 2018 10:39 pm

dsr wrote:It's still the Europa League, even in the qualifying rounds. Just as clubs in the FA Cup qualifying rounds are still playing in the FA Cup.

Apparently not according to UEFA

tiger76 · Post by **tiger76** » Tue May 15, 2018 10:53 pm

Rangers may yet be barred from European entry https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/44129307

dermotdermot · Post by **dermotdermot** » Wed May 16, 2018 2:53 am

diamondpocket wrote:some horror shows in there
3 unseeded clubs in Kazakhstan and 2 in Azerbaijan
Belarus, Giorgia & Bulgaria dont sound too inspiring either.
The Swedish teams would be interesting and see Ulvestad's team in there, plus, Rangers with Scotty.

This post has caused me untold grief. A sleepless night ensues.

CrosspoolClarets · Post by **CrosspoolClarets** » Wed May 16, 2018 8:56 am

I am keeping an eye on the teams, because at the moment we have 11 teams seeded above us, which will be more when all the leagues finish, and by the play off stage we will need only 11 teams remaining above us in the seeding if we are to be seeded and avoid a knock out with someone like Sevilla. There are 12 games in that final phase.

My hunch is that we wouldn’t be seeded in the playoffs (Q4) but that it will be close.

Note that I haven’t checked the OPs link, I didn’t my own analysis at the weekend, so things may have changed slightly. Some leagues have wacky play off arrangements to find out who qualifies.

houseboy · Post by **houseboy** » Wed May 16, 2018 9:16 am

KRBFC wrote:Simply not the point, when looking to qualify you hope for the easiest draw not the hardest possible one (especially during pre-season). Look at the ''s**t sides'' who English clubs have lost against in qualifying, a sold out Ibrox during pre-season for a competitive qualifying game would be a fkin nightmare for 2nd round qualifying when we could draw a minnow team.

I think the perfect draw for the fans would be an Irish club. Little chance of losing and a short hop skip and jump to travel (unless one of the Welsh cubs made it through to that stage).

I still don't think even Rangers would pose too much of a threat but I take your point.

Lancasterclaret · Post by **Lancasterclaret** » Wed May 16, 2018 9:19 am

Rangers after a few games and a pre-season, no threat.

Rangers in the 2nd qualifying round, wouldn't be easy I feel

UpTheBeehole · Post by **UpTheBeehole** » Wed May 16, 2018 9:22 am

We've beaten Rangers 1-0 and 3-1 in July in the last couple of years, with an inferior starting 11.

The lineup for the 3-1 contains some names to make you shudder

BURNLEY: Heaton, Darikwa, Keane, Arfield (Gudmundsso 45’), Boyd (Ulvestad 84’), Vokes (Jutkiewicz 45’) Mee, Gray, Marney (O’Neil 84’), Lafferty, Jones (Kightly 84’)

Subs: Robinson, Lowton, Long, Tarkowski, Mitchell

Spijed · Post by **Spijed** » Wed May 16, 2018 9:47 am

dsr wrote:It's still the Europa League, even in the qualifying rounds. Just as clubs in the FA Cup qualifying rounds are still playing in the FA Cup.

That's my view as well. Whether we are in the qualifying rounds or group stages the Europa League logo will still be on display at our first match.

Geoff · Post by **Geoff** » Wed May 16, 2018 10:53 am

Spijed wrote:That's my view as well. Whether we are in the qualifying rounds or group stages the Europa League logo will still be on display at our first match.

So following this logic if an International team has played in a World Cup qualifier match they've played in a World Cup?

dsr · Post by **dsr** » Wed May 16, 2018 11:25 am

Geoff wrote:So following this logic if an International team has played in a World Cup qualifier match they've played in a World Cup?

It's spurious logic, but as it happens yes - that's why the World Cup Finals tournament is called the World Cup Finals tournament, to distinguish it from the World Cup Qualifiers. What would be the alternative - that World Cup group games are friendlies?

Don't let the stupid name "Europa League" fool you. It's all one competition, including the knockout stages at both ends.

CrosspoolClarets · Post by **CrosspoolClarets** » Sat May 19, 2018 8:18 pm

Big match tonight - Frankfurt winning against Bayern in the German Cup Final.

We need Bayern to win or another side is seeded above us (basically, it would mean Stuttgart go through the qualifying stages, who have a lower ranking than us, or Leipzig, who have a higher one).

As a reminder we need only 12 sides seeded higher than us by the Play Off Round or we will face one of the “big boys” to get into the group stages.

Spijed · Post by **Spijed** » Sat May 19, 2018 8:26 pm

now 1-1

tiger76 · Post by **tiger76** » Sat May 19, 2018 8:26 pm

There not winning any more Lewandowski to the rescue

CrosspoolClarets · Post by **CrosspoolClarets** » Sat May 19, 2018 9:08 pm

Frankfurt won. Not good for us. RB Leipzig now in Q2 with us, and are seeded higher.

tiger76 · Post by **tiger76** » Sat May 19, 2018 9:23 pm

Looks like we'll have to do it the hard way.

Dazzler · Post by **Dazzler** » Sat May 19, 2018 9:26 pm

CrosspoolClarets wrote:As a reminder we need only 11 sides seeded higher than us by the Play Off Round or we will face one of the “big boys” to get into the group stages.

By my reckoning there will 13 seeded teams in the Play Off round.

Dy1geo · Post by **Dy1geo** » Sat May 19, 2018 10:03 pm

A quick question would Liverpool winning the Champions League improve our country co efficiency this improving our seeding?

ClaretAndJew · Post by **ClaretAndJew** » Sat May 19, 2018 10:05 pm

Dy1geo wrote:A quick question would Liverpool winning the Champions League improve our country co efficiency this improving our seeding?

No

Dy1geo · Post by **Dy1geo** » Sat May 19, 2018 10:31 pm

ClaretAndJew wrote:No

That’s the sort of quick answers I like!!

OffTheBar · Post by **OffTheBar** » Sat May 19, 2018 10:44 pm

Dy1geo wrote:That’s the sort of quick answers I like!!

You might like it, but it is wrong. If Liverpool win the CL, it helps us

ClaretAndJew · Post by **ClaretAndJew** » Sat May 19, 2018 10:46 pm

OffTheBar wrote:You might like it, but it is wrong. If Liverpool win the CL, it helps us

I thought it was settled regardless of who won what etc?

CrosspoolClarets · Post by **CrosspoolClarets** » Sat May 19, 2018 10:46 pm

Dazzler wrote:By my reckoning there will 13 seeded teams in the Play Off round.

Yes, my bad, there are 13 matches so it is 12 teams max who we need seeded above us. I have corrected my earlier post.

Also, regarding the other post about Liverpool, I think that yes, it would improve our coefficient. It would for example take us above Inter Milan to about 16.3

OffTheBar · Post by **OffTheBar** » Sat May 19, 2018 10:52 pm

ClaretAndJew wrote:I thought it was settled regardless of who won what etc?

No. We are the only team in the Europa League qualifiers whose coefficient isn’t certain. If Liverpool win the CL it goes up, but by how much I don’t know.

Spijed · Post by **Spijed** » Sat May 19, 2018 10:55 pm

OffTheBar wrote:No. We are the only team in the Europa League qualifiers whose coefficient isn’t certain. If Liverpool win the CL it goes up, but by how much I don’t know.

How come it goes up if Liverpool win, but wouldn't have had Arsenal won the Europa league?

OffTheBar · Post by **OffTheBar** » Sat May 19, 2018 11:09 pm

Spijed wrote:How come it goes up if Liverpool win, but wouldn't have had Arsenal won the Europa league?

No idea. But since the EL final has happened and Arsenal weren’t even in it, who cares?

ClaretAndJew · Post by **ClaretAndJew** » Sat May 19, 2018 11:23 pm

OffTheBar wrote:No idea. But since the EL final has happened and Arsenal weren’t even in it, who cares?

Dazzler · Post by **Dazzler** » Sat May 19, 2018 11:34 pm

CrosspoolClarets wrote:Also, regarding the other post about Liverpool, I think that yes, it would improve our coefficient. It would for example take us above Inter Milan to about 16.3

And I thought I was becoming obsessed with this Europe malarkey.

Claret&Green · Post by **Claret&Green** » Sun May 20, 2018 6:06 am

houseboy wrote:If we can't beat a Scottish team we don't deserve to be in it. Nothing at all to fear in Rangers or Aberdeen (apart from Rangers fans).

We couldn't beat a non league club on our own turf in the fa cup last Jan. Personally I am of the opinion we would be better of sacrificing Europa League as early as possible and concentrating on a mid table finish. God forbid we get any injuries in the 6 games we'd have to play before getting to the competition proper.

TVC15 · Post by **TVC15** » Sun May 20, 2018 7:16 am

Claret&Green wrote:We couldn't beat a non league club on our own turf in the fa cup last Jan. Personally I am of the opinion we would be better of sacrificing Europa League as early as possible and concentrating on a mid table finish. God forbid we get any injuries in the 6 games we'd have to play before getting to the competition proper.

WestMidsClaret · Post by **WestMidsClaret** » Sun May 20, 2018 7:29 am

1st of all we had fans saying it'd be better us not etting in to the Europa league now we have them saying we should sacrifice it (how long since we last played in Europe!!!!) and concentrate on a mid table finish.

WTF. Glad I don't watch the games with some of these "fans"!

Dazzler · Post by **Dazzler** » Sun May 20, 2018 7:07 pm

CrosspoolClarets wrote:Also, regarding the other post about Liverpool, I think that yes, it would improve our coefficient. It would for example take us above Inter Milan to about 16.3

Also,2 of these European giants may yet come into the league/main path Europa League qualifiers from Champs League qualifying.
One definitely will.

Spijed · Post by **Spijed** » Sun May 20, 2018 7:44 pm

Wiki has got a few blanks filled in:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2018%E2%8 ... opa_League" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

CrosspoolClarets · Post by **CrosspoolClarets** » Sun May 20, 2018 9:01 pm

OK, wife's out, kids in bed, time to have another look at this after today's games.

Every useful website that I have been scanning (Wikipedia, footballseeding, uefa) is a bit behind with filling things in, but a lot has been decided today. I'll be wrong on some of this, that's life. But I think these will be the sides seeded above us in Q4, the play off round. If 13 remain by then, we will not be seeded and will draw one of them if we are still in.

I make it a minimum of 13 and possibly 20 sides. It will be tough for several of those to miss out against inferior opposition, hopefully the same logic applies to us too, and by heck there are some big teams in that list

Definitely qualified (I think) :

Sevilla (Spain)
AZ Alkmaar (Netherlands)
Rapid Vienna (Austria)
Red Bull Leipzig (Germany)
Braga (Portugal)
Besiktas (Turkey)
Maccabi Tel Aviv (Israel)
FK Partizan (Serbia)
Steaua Bucharest (Romania)
FC Zenit (Russia)
Olympiacos (Greece)
Feyenoord (Netherlands)
Sporting Lisbon (Portugal)

Probably (depending on future games):

FC Copenhagen (Denmark)
Gent (Belgium)
Maribor (Slovenia)
Genk (Belgium)
Sparta Prague (Czech)
Basel, Ajax, PAOK or Sturm Graz (Champions League League route, two of four in Europa playoffs, three seeded better than us)

South West Claret. · Post by **South West Claret.** » Sun May 20, 2018 9:26 pm

Is this Cup competition always as complicated as it appears this year?

KRBFC · Post by **KRBFC** » Sun May 20, 2018 9:32 pm

CrosspoolClarets wrote:OK, wife's out, kids in bed, time to have another look at this after today's games.

Every useful website that I have been scanning (Wikipedia, footballseeding, uefa) is a bit behind with filling things in, but a lot has been decided today. I'll be wrong on some of this, that's life. But I think these will be the sides seeded above us in Q4, the play off round. If 13 remain by then, we will not be seeded and will draw one of them if we are still in.

I make it a minimum of 13 and possibly 18 sides. It will be tough for several of those to miss out against inferior opposition, hopefully the same logic applies to us too, and by heck there are some big teams in that list

Definitely qualified (I think) :

Sevilla (Spain)
AZ Alkmaar (Netherlands)
Rapid Vienna (Austria)
Red Bull Leipzig (Germany)
Braga (Portugal)
Besiktas (Turkey)
Maccabi Tel Aviv (Israel)
FK Partizan (Serbia)
Steaua Bucharest (Romania)
FC Zenit (Russia)
Olympiacos (Greece)
Feyenoord (Netherlands)
Sporting Lisbon (Portugal)

Probably (depending on future games):

FC Copenhagen (Denmark)
Gent (Belgium)
Maribor (Slovenia)
Genk (Belgium)
Sparta Prague (Czech)

Approximately how many will drop out of the CL qualifying into the EL?

CrosspoolClarets · Post by **CrosspoolClarets** » Sun May 20, 2018 10:01 pm

(Post deleted, corrected later)

KRBFC · Post by **KRBFC** » Sun May 20, 2018 10:03 pm

CrosspoolClarets wrote:None, as affects us, until the group stages. The two competitions go on separate qualifying paths. This post is all about qualifying, it will be a different bunch in the group stages.

So the non qualifying CL teams enter the EL group stage and not the qualifiers? That's interesting, thanks.

Lancasterclaret · Post by **Lancasterclaret** » Sun May 20, 2018 10:12 pm

is that Lazio and AC Milan into the mix today then as well?

Crikey!

MDWat · Post by **MDWat** » Sun May 20, 2018 10:31 pm

Every side that loses in the Champions League qualifiers gets another chance in the Europa League, at least that's how I read it.

So sides losing in the third qualifying round of the Champions League, will be in the playoff for the Europa League. Might be wrong, mind.

CrosspoolClarets · Post by **CrosspoolClarets** » Sun May 20, 2018 10:34 pm

KRBFC wrote:So the non qualifying CL teams enter the EL group stage and not the qualifiers? That's interesting, thanks.

I didn’t quite explain it fully. The main non qualifying CL teams qualify using a Champions Path so avoid our League Path, apart from four (I’ve added them to the above big list) of which two will enter the play offs (later exits from the CL go into the group stages).

Lancaster’s comment surprised me, I thought that the two Milan’s had entered the EL group stages, but I didn’t realise it is head to head first in the event of a tie, so Lazio are in the EL and Inter are in the CL. Frankly though, just getting to the group stages for us will be a heck of an achievement.

Lancasterclaret · Post by **Lancasterclaret** » Sun May 20, 2018 10:36 pm

Crosspool, does that mean that Lazio (5th) go straight in the group stages, while AC Milan (6th) go in with us at 2nd qualifying round?

CrosspoolClarets · Post by **CrosspoolClarets** » Sun May 20, 2018 10:42 pm

Lancasterclaret wrote:Crosspool, does that mean that Lazio (5th) go straight in the group stages, while AC Milan (6th) go in with us at 2nd qualifying round?

Lazio are in the group stages too as are Milan. Only Atalanta qualify with us, and we are seeded higher.

Lancasterclaret · Post by **Lancasterclaret** » Sun May 20, 2018 10:45 pm

Cheers

So if we are seeded higher than Atalanta (who are a bloody good side btw) and still might not be seeded, then there must be some cracking sides in the 2nd qualifying round then?

Dazzler · Post by **Dazzler** » Sun May 20, 2018 10:52 pm

Lancasterclaret wrote:Cheers

So if we are seeded higher than Atalanta (who are a bloody good side btw) and still might not be seeded, then there must be some cracking sides in the 2nd qualifying round then?

: Screenshot_20180520-224901.jpg (479.26 KiB) Viewed 2805 times

KRBFC · Post by **KRBFC** » Sun May 20, 2018 10:56 pm

MDWat wrote:Every side that loses in the Champions League qualifiers gets another chance in the Europa League, at least that's how I read it.

So sides losing in the third qualifying round of the Champions League, will be in the playoff for the Europa League. Might be wrong, mind.

That's initially what I thought which would add higher seeds to the mix, likely meaning we'll be unseeded.

CrosspoolClarets · Post by **CrosspoolClarets** » Sun May 20, 2018 10:57 pm

Lancasterclaret wrote:Cheers

So if we are seeded higher than Atalanta (who are a bloody good side btw) and still might not be seeded, then there must be some cracking sides in the 2nd qualifying round then?

Have a butchers at this site. That should sum up where we are, though it isn’t quite fully up to date. Seeded on the left, unseeded on the right. Bold is an entrant in that round, unbolded is a possible qualifier from the prior round. The numbers are their seeding coefficient. It’s the play offs, when we move to the right hand column, where the fun starts (assuming we don’t suffer a catastrophic exit by then).

https://www.footballseeding.com/europea ... ing-18-19/

For those folk pondering the Champions League element, there is a picture half way down this page which explains it, though I thought it was 2 side’s entering from CL Q2, not 3. A bit of ambiguity online.

https://www.footballseeding.com/europea ... for-18-19/

Dazzler · Post by **Dazzler** » Sun May 20, 2018 11:04 pm

MDWat wrote:Every side that loses in the Champions League qualifiers gets another chance in the Europa League, at least that's how I read it.

So sides losing in the third qualifying round of the Champions League, will be in the playoff for the Europa League. Might be wrong, mind.

KRBFC wrote: That's initially what I thought which would add higher seeds to the mix, likely meaning we'll be unseeded

From the 2nd round qualifiers there is a Champions path & a league/main path.

Teams that lose in the Champs league qualifiers that won their national league go into the Champions Path qualifying.
Other losers go into Main path qualifiers.

KRBFC · Post by **KRBFC** » Sun May 20, 2018 11:05 pm

Dazzler wrote:From the 2nd round qualifiers there is a Champions path & a league/main path.

Teams that lose in the Champs league qualifiers that won their national league go into the Champions Path qualifying.
Others losers go into Main path qualifiers.

Ok thanks, all this European malarky is confusing

cricketfieldclarets · Post by **cricketfieldclarets** » Sun May 20, 2018 11:07 pm

Cubanclaret wrote: I think that's a potential problem with a lot of Eastern Europe cities. I don't think we'll exactly be received with open arms!

We will be as welcome as we make ourselves. More chance of trouble at Walsall than Warsaw!

cricketfieldclarets · Post by **cricketfieldclarets** » Sun May 20, 2018 11:07 pm

CnBtruntru wrote:Macabba Tel Aviv, I think I would give that a pass

One of the best cities I have ever been to and easily the safest. Would love to get a Tel Aviv side.