Heaton should return as no1 goalie

[Wokingclaret]

And what happened at Burton!

[KlyBfc]

So people believe that Heaton is the answer. Let’s have little bit of perspective / realism to this. Heaton in his 3 games this season has failed to keep a clean sheet, conceding 6 goals in those 3 games, against relatively poor opposition in terms of what we face in the premier league. Also his inability to keep some of those goals out is questionable (Burton) and at least 1 was down to poor organisation (Olympiakos).

Hart has kept 4 clean sheets (3 of those in his first 3 games for us) demonstrating the defence clearly have / had some level of trust in him. He can also be questioned by some for possibly a couple of the goals but he has equally saved us a mauling at Wolves and earnt us 3pts against Cardiff.

People can have a preferred choice and I get that we are all searching for an answer, but scapegoating and making assumptions which lack any real evidence or credability are unfair. The problems this season run deeper than who is our number 1 and I for one am not convinced things will improve anytime soon. But one thing I am sure of is that we as fans could try and do our bit with a better backing of the players. It might not help but if it’s spurs them to complete a few more sprints we might have a little more hope and encouragement.

[NL Claret]

Did Jamie Carragher mention that Hart was the problem or the lack of sprints? Could that be down to fitness or is that Hart's fault too?

[SGr]

Beg to differ, lots of evidence from many posters that you choose to ignore.

Lots of arguments from many posters you mean, most of which are based on assumption

Not doubting that Hart has made many saves but if he had a rapport with his defence and mutual trust he would not have to

Most of Heatons saves look routine because he trusts the defenders and anticipates accordingly

That's because Heaton actually could trust the defenders, since they weren't costing us like they are this season. Fact is, the standards of the defence, and arguably even more so the defensive midfield have dropped massively this season. Mee has had a very poor season overall, and his good performance against West Ham was cancelled out by a nightmare performance from Tarkowski. Taylor hasn't been great at all even though I believe he can only get better and is doing. Ward I don't think will ever recover the form he showed last season. Lowton has been sub-par throughout. And Cork is a shadow of the player he was this time last year. So yeah, think it's fair to assume a "lack of trust" as you put it is bound to exist - though not sure how this suggests Hart should have prevented more goals than he has.

Neither Heaton or Pope conceded 13 goals in 3 games in a hat load of seasons and Hart does it for fun

What you mean to say is "Burnley do it for fun", since as I've just pointed out, the collective failing of midfield and defence is behind the massive amount of goals conceded

Southgate, Torino, Wet spam and Pep worked it out. How long will it take us

They "worked it out" after a series of Hart howlers - don't have to look far on YouTube to work that one out. How many of the goals we've conceded have been his howlers? Zero. So that's void. Also why is Pep relevant? the man simply wanted a world class goalkeeper, with world class distribution, to compliment his world class side? Not like Heaton would have fared any better, nor Pope for that matter.

Think that covers everything...

[cricketfieldclarets]

Instead of dealing with it in phase 1 and thanking Ben for saving his arse? come on mate your better than that, but all about opinions.

It was a pheonomenal effort ffs. From a player who ripped the entire team apart.

More concerning is our defensive and midfield shape!!!!!

https://www.skysports.com/watch/video/s ... -clearance" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[cricketfieldclarets]

So people believe that Heaton is the answer. Let’s have little bit of perspective / realism to this. Heaton in his 3 games this season has failed to keep a clean sheet, conceding 6 goals in those 3 games, against relatively poor opposition in terms of what we face in the premier league. Also his inability to keep some of those goals out is questionable (Burton) and at least 1 was down to poor organisation (Olympiakos).

Hart has kept 4 clean sheets (3 of those in his first 3 games for us) demonstrating the defence clearly have / had some level of trust in him. He can also be questioned by some for possibly a couple of the goals but he has equally saved us a mauling at Wolves and earnt us 3pts against Cardiff.

People can have a preferred choice and I get that we are all searching for an answer, but scapegoating and making assumptions which lack any real evidence or credability are unfair. The problems this season run deeper than who is our number 1 and I for one am not convinced things will improve anytime soon. But one thing I am sure of is that we as fans could try and do our bit with a better backing of the players. It might not help but if it’s spurs them to complete a few more sprints we might have a little more hope and encouragement.

Fantastic and well reasoned post.

[SGr]

So people believe that Heaton is the answer. Let’s have little bit of perspective / realism to this. Heaton in his 3 games this season has failed to keep a clean sheet, conceding 6 goals in those 3 games, against relatively poor opposition in terms of what we face in the premier league. Also his inability to keep some of those goals out is questionable (Burton) and at least 1 was down to poor organisation (Olympiakos).

Hart has kept 4 clean sheets (3 of those in his first 3 games for us) demonstrating the defence clearly have / had some level of trust in him. He can also be questioned by some for possibly a couple of the goals but he has equally saved us a mauling at Wolves and earnt us 3pts against Cardiff.

People can have a preferred choice and I get that we are all searching for an answer, but scapegoating and making assumptions which lack any real evidence or credability are unfair. The problems this season run deeper than who is our number 1 and I for one am not convinced things will improve anytime soon. But one thing I am sure of is that we as fans could try and do our bit with a better backing of the players. It might not help but if it’s spurs them to complete a few more sprints we might have a little more hope and encouragement.

I've said it elsewhere but people WANT Hart to be the problem, so they can have their old favourite back. The reality is different, and more concerning.

[LoveCurryPies]

I've said it elsewhere but people WANT Hart to be the problem, so they can have their old favourite back. The reality is different, and more concerning.

I consider Hart, Heaton & Pope as equals and proud to have them at Burnley. As OP I asked a simple question, is it possible Tom organises his back 4 defenders better or maybe do they just understand what he wants from them.

It’s a question raised by the fact that we are shipping goals. Last year with Tom or Nick, if we lost, it was only by one or two goals.

[Milltown1882]

Certain people had an agenda against Hart from day one. How many of the shots against us last season were straight at Pope from outside the box due to how the defence and midfield were organised? We’re a shadow of the team last season and a keeper that’s been dire in the three opportunities he’s had this season and got us knocked out of two cups isn’t the answer. If Hart is the problem why is he constantly being touted for an England recall? This fanbase has an unbelievably small time mentality, didn’t want to qualify for Europe, just want to stay up, don’t want proven winners in the team it’s all boring and predictable.

[Ooogeorgeorgeoghani]

Certain people had an agenda against Hart from day one. How many of the shots against us last season were straight at Pope from outside the box due to how the defence and midfield were organised? We’re a shadow of the team last season and a keeper that’s been dire in the three opportunities he’s had this season and got us knocked out of two cups isn’t the answer. If Hart is the problem why is he constantly being touted for an England recall? This fanbase has an unbelievably small time mentality, didn’t want to qualify for Europe, just want to stay up, don’t want proven winners in the team it’s all boring and predictable.

I made an earlier comment that due to his positioning many shots went straight at pope last year , he's not as acrobatic as Hart but he doesn't need to be that s not down to the defence it's his awareness. I was more than happy to have Hart at burnley and still am he's one of the best , but I think pope is a better fit for us

[Ziggy Stardust]

Heaton and Dyche had a failing out end of last season. Heaton will be gone in January.

[deanothedino]

Also why is Pep relevant? the man simply wanted a world class goalkeeper, with world class distribution, to compliment his world class side? Not like Heaton would have fared any better, nor Pope for that matter.

Pep wouldn't even have Pope in his reserves because of his distribution.

[Targetman]

Heaton and Dyche had a failing out end of last season. Heaton will be gone in January.

Who is your source for this "fall out"?

[burnleymik]

Heaton and Dyche had a failing out end of last season. Heaton will be gone in January.

We've had a few versions now!

Heaton and Dyche fall out. Tarks and Mee fallout. Heaton upsetting the dressing room because he isn't first choice. Hart not talking to the other players because he feels he is too good for them. Tarks getting too big for his boots because of the car he bought. etc

Jesus wept, I am going to guess there isn't much truth in any of this made-up rubbish.

[JTClaret]

Can anybody find the stat about the amount of good goal scoring opportunities that have been made?
It's been around for a couple of years with Burnley having the most shots against us but the least amount of opportunities, due to the defenders always blocking or making it so it's hit straight at the keeper.

Heaton and Pope made a lot of saves with shots his straight at them, I'm struggling to think of this being the case for Hart - hence his 'one for the camera' saves that Heaton and Pope rarely had to make.

[IanMcL]

All demonstrates that we know nothing!

That is no reason why we should not have an opinion. However, that is all it is.
Up the Clarets.

[JTClaret]

Found it!!!
Goals Against Expected: xGA
Goals Against: GA

18/19 Season - 11 Games - xGA 24.72 - GA 25
17/18 Season - 11 Games - xGA 15.38 - GA 9
16/17 Season - 11 Games - xGA 20.59 - GA 15

I take it back... Hart isn't doing as well as I thought. According to this, Heaton and Pope ARE better.
https://understat.com/league/EPL/2018" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[Ooogeorgeorgeoghani]

Found it!!!
Goals Against Expected: xGA
Goals Against: GA

18/19 Season - 11 Games - xGA 24.72 - GA 25
17/18 Season - 11 Games - xGA 15.38 - GA 9
16/17 Season - 11 Games - xGA 20.59 - GA 15

I take it back... Hart isn't doing as well as I thought. According to this, Heaton and Pope ARE better.
https://understat.com/league/EPL/2018" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

That's not a good stat for Hart but how can it be right that he conceedes more than expected when he makes so many saves ?

[SGr]

Pep wouldn't even have Pope in his reserves because of his distribution.

Exactly

[dougcollins]

Yeah, cos we really rely on that distribution, don't we.

[JTClaret]

That's not a good stat for Hart but how can it be right that he conceedes more than expected when he makes so many saves ?

That's very true - I can't think of any he should have saved and didn't.
Possibly some he could have done better with, but certainly not a clanger

[CombatClaret]

Several outlets saying Huddersfield targeting him in Jan

https://www.thesun.co.uk/sport/football ... n-january/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[cricketfieldclarets]

Several outlets saying Huddersfield targeting him in Jan

https://www.thesun.co.uk/sport/football ... n-january/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

No way should we allow him to leave to a direct rival under any circumstances.

Newcastle
Huddersfield
Cardiff
Fulham
Southampton

Should all be off limits.

[deanothedino]

Found it!!!
Goals Against Expected: xGA
Goals Against: GA

18/19 Season - 11 Games - xGA 24.72 - GA 25
17/18 Season - 11 Games - xGA 15.38 - GA 9
16/17 Season - 11 Games - xGA 20.59 - GA 15

I take it back... Hart isn't doing as well as I thought. According to this, Heaton and Pope ARE better.
https://understat.com/league/EPL/2018" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

You realise that's a team stat though? Don't think anyone is disputing that we defended better as a team before this season.

[LoveCurryPies]

We've had a few versions now!

Heaton and Dyche fall out. Tarks and Mee fallout. Heaton upsetting the dressing room because he isn't first choice. Hart not talking to the other players because he feels he is too good for them. Tarks getting too big for his boots because of the car he bought. etc

Jesus wept, I am going to guess there isn't much truth in any of this made-up rubbish.

But you decide to repeat it??

[Ziggy Stardust]

Who is your source for this "fall out"?

A journalist.

[dougcollins]

The Spiders from Mars?

[Rick_Muller]

I'm waiting for people on here to understand that goalkeeping isn't just making worldy saves for the cameras...

Smug mode initiated

[Hibsclaret]

Wait until ward returns....

[Burnley1989]

Smug mode initiated

1 game? I’d be careful with the smugness

[dougcollins]

Every keeper can pull off worldies.

It's the other things that matter. Thankfully Sean has seen sense.